Match Day Thread Tottenham Hotspur v Wolverhampton Wanderers

[Citizen Kane.]

Getting real tired of seeing the Reddit crowd saying variants on "You're overreacting to just two matches"

No, we're not

Because it's not a couple of games, it's now four games, and pretending the Palace match didn't happen to try and find positives in the Saltypool/Leicester matches is a bit bloody difficult after Palace II: This Time It's Wolves

I make it much, much more than 4 games HBIC.

The Burnley, Brighton and WBA performances were embarrassing. The Brighton result being totally undeserved.

The second halves against Chelsea and Arsenal were shocking, not a tactical masterclass. As we've now shown x 4 all it takes is one lapse in concentration and the opposition are right back in it. Poor all game against Everton, poor in the 1st half against Soton, wasteful against the Toon.

So in essence the only 90 minutes I look back on with pride since the West Ham shambles was the City game. Which means we've had 2 good full games all season, and both of them were against the Manchester clubs.

At what point do we concede that our Benevolent Rulers made a very, very big mistake?

 

[Spurlock]

Not here to gloat, not here to say "I told you so". Just here to reiterate what I said over a year ago now: Jose Mourinho is finished, and has been for years. Having watched the Amazon documentary, I warmed to Jose the character. But Jose the tactician? Well I think we can all see how that's going.

The joy of watching Spurs has completely gone, for me. We are lucky that there are no fans witnessing the steady demise of our football club into a Graham-esque style of football.

I stood by, laughing, while our fanbase creamed itself when we topped the league for a few weeks. Talking us up as title contenders?! Pull the other one. Sad thing is, we could be. Utilising Aurier/Reguilon like we used Walker/Rose, allowing Tanguy a free role instead of insisting he becomes a box to box midfielder, play Gio much, much further up the pitch, pin teams back with our FBs and the pace of Son/Stevie and stop asking Kane to play 3 roles at once. It honestly isn't rocket science.

And the saddest thing is how Jose explicitly promised he would stay loyal to the club's traditions. Ha. All that took to crumble was the 3 late goals against West Ham. He did exactly the same thing at Chelsea when we tanked them 5-3. They were flying at the top of the league, but that game haunted him, until he changed their entire way of playing, pissed off key players in the process, lost the changing room, started picking scapegoats for the team's problems (at them it was that physio; ours seems to be Dele Alli), and it all unravelled from there.

There used to be a football club over there.

Oh and happy new year guys, hope you're all keeping well

orite mate...hope all is well

for me...I’m happy to back anything to get us silverware...personally I was a bit sick and tired of the tippy tappy 80% possession and no end game year after year.

give the bloke a full season at least then hopefully you can have the tippy tappy back...let’s hope in the meantime we learn to win silverware under the current regime to take forward as a club.

 

[Blue and White]

Getting real tired of seeing the Reddit crowd saying variants on "You're overreacting to just two matches"

No, we're not

Because it's not a couple of games, it's now four games, and pretending the Palace match didn't happen to try and find positives in the Saltypool/Leicester matches is a bit bloody difficult after Palace II: This Time It's Wolves

I'm not Reddit but I think there is overreacting.
I agree i did not enjoy that game but you have to give credit to the opposition sometimes.
No games are easy this season. Everyone is capable of a decent game and there are no gimmies.
Even SU have made it very difficult for sides.
We could try and play a different style but with a player like Traore we would have left ourselves exposed. Likewise against Palace and Zaha. We might get lucky and score six like against Man. U but we might get unlucky and concede 7 as Liverpool did against Villa.
If we were all great managers we wouldn't be on this BB.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

orite mate...hope all is well

for me...I’m happy to back anything to get us silverware...personally I was a bit sick and tired of the tippy tappy 80% possession and no end game year after year.

give the bloke a full season at least then hopefully you can have the tippy tappy back...let’s hope in the meantime we learn to win silverware under the current regime to take forward as a club.

I guess the big question is: what silverware will it take to convince Kane and Son to stick it out for yet another season? The FAC or Carabao won't cut it imo. Unless they're combined with a top 4 finish which I can't see happening as we'll still be battling for the Europa at the same time and don't have the squad for 4 competitions. And top 4 itself this season looks like it could be the death of most clubs. The strength of the opposition is insane.

Anything less than top 4 + a trophy and they're out, as far as I can see it. And to achieve that we're going to have to spend big in Jan on a new CB and upgrade on Sissoko and hope both new players settle in instantly.

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

I'm not Reddit but I think there is overreacting.
I agree i did not enjoy that game but you have to give credit to the opposition sometimes.
No games are easy this season. Everyone is capable of a decent game and there are no gimmies.
Even SU have made it very difficult for sides.
We could try and play a different style but with a player like Traore we would have left ourselves exposed. Likewise against Palace and Zaha. We might get lucky and score six like against Man. U but we might get unlucky and concede 7 as Liverpool did against Villa.
If we were all great managers we wouldn't be on this BB.

Sheffield United make it difficult for sides

When we go 1-0 up, we don't make it difficult for sides - we sit back and invite them to find how long it'll take before somebody makes an error or we have our customary set piece brainfart

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

Oh bloody hell, we're creating metaphors now...

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["Thanks for that Brian"]

I make it much, much more than 4 games HBIC.

The Burnley, Brighton and WBA performances were embarrassing. The Brighton result being totally undeserved.

The second halves against Chelsea and Arsenal were shocking, not a tactical masterclass. As we've now shown x 4 all it takes is one lapse in concentration and the opposition are right back in it. Poor all game against Everton, poor in the 1st half against Soton, wasteful against the Toon.

So in essence the only 90 minutes I look back on with pride since the West Ham shambles was the City game. Which means we've had 2 good full games all season, and both of them were against the Manchester clubs.

At what point do we concede that our Benevolent Rulers made a very, very big mistake?

United had a man sent off at 2-1 and completely lost their heads and we beat City without Aguero and Sterling. They were great results but I'm not sure that we can read too much into them.

If Son and Kane hadn't had an incredible start to the campaign, we'd be ****ed. Teams are working us out now but we're still trying the same routine...without the success.

 

[Spurlock]

I guess the big question is: what silverware will it take to convince Kane and Son to stick it out for yet another season? The FAC or Carabao won't cut it imo. Unless they're combined with a top 4 finish which I can't see happening as we'll still be battling for the Europa at the same time and don't have the squad for 4 competitions. And top 4 itself this season looks like it could be the death of most clubs. The strength of the opposition is insane.

Anything less than top 4 + a trophy and they're out, as far as I can see it.

I think we can get top 4...no one is really convincing me enough to say them places are nailed on bar Liverpool. Teams are going on good runs and shooting up the league so I think I won’t write that off just yet.

If we lose either Kane/Son then ultimately it’s not because of Jose it’s because of the clubs philosophies at a crucial time of the teams development.

 

[Blue and White]

Sheffield United make it difficult for sides

When we go 1-0 up, we don't make it difficult for sides - we sit back and invite them to find how long it'll take before somebody makes an error or we have our customary set piece brainfart

The majority of our attacks or potential attacks were broken up with a foul.
Wolves committed 20 fouls. On average the ball is in play for 60 minutes, so every 3 minutes they committed a foul. They stopped us playing by fouling.

 

[Dier Hard]

I’m just honestly perplexed at how terrible Jose’s squad management is. For a manager that’s won so much I’m genuinely shocked at how bad the squad is being managed.

Kane, Son and Hojbjerg have all been well below par in recent games because they’ve been playing 90 mins in the League, played in the Europa games and two even played 90 mins in the cup the other night.

These guys are being ran into the ground and for some reason the manager can’t see it.

If I were still a betting man and a sort of bet was available, I’d put money on one of Kane or Son getting a hammy tear sooner or later - and if that happens, kiss goodbye to any top four finish or potential trophy.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

United had a man sent off at 2-1 and completely lost their heads and we beat City without Aguero and Sterling. They were great results but I'm not sure that we can read too much into them.

If Son and Kane hadn't had an incredible start to the campaign, we'd be ****ed. Teams are working us out now but we're still trying the same routine...without the success.

The reliance on them has been worrying me for a while. Perhaps the only comfort from today's game is that we now officially have a 3rd top scored in the PL with a grand total of...2 goals.

Teams know that Kane is dropping deep, so double up on him with their most advanced CB and most defensive CM. And then they just don't let Son play off the shoulder and that's that...we're fecked. Nought else coming from anywhere else.

And this infuriates me more than anything. There is zero Plan B. It was the same last season. Plan A: Push Aurier 70 yards forwards and hope he puts in a decent cross while Sissoko is shoe-horned into a RB leaving a vast no-man's land in the middle. Opposition teams: Right then, we'll ignore your right flank and attack you straight through the middle, cheers muchly.

Now this season's Plan A: Sit back and absorb pressure for 90% of the game. Hope the opposition concede possession on the ground and *anyone apart from Kane and Son* can play the ball to *Kane or Son*. Opposition teams: Right then, we'll double up on Kane and Son as none of your other players are within 60 yards of our goal anyway so we have men to spare. And we honestly don't care if Kane feels a nudge and flops to the ground as you play all of your free kicks backwards anyway. Cheers muchly.

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

The majority of our attacks or potential attacks were broken up with a foul.
Wolves committed 20 fouls. On average the ball is in play for 60 minutes, so every 3 minutes they committed a foul. They stopped us playing by fouling.

The majority of our attacks or potential attacks were stopped by us sitting back for 75 minutes

 

[BajanSpur]

There were so many back passes it was hard to tell in which direction Spurs were playing in.

Somebody should do some stats., might well be a record number of back-passing by a side over 90mins.
Winks would be so proud.

 

[Blue and White]

The majority of our attacks or potential attacks were stopped by us sitting back for 75 minutes

You are not disputing the figures.
Everytime we went forward they fouled.

 

[remembercolinlee]

I do not like watching us. It's boring, insipid football which I would not pay to watch.
My least favourite period of football at Spurs was late 98 until 2001. We won a trophy in that time but played some of the worst football I can ever remember.
This matches it.
We have played 2 complete good games of football in the league this season.
The Everton game, the 2nd half v west ham, the 2nd half v toon, the first half v southampton, most of the Brighton and Burnley games, mos of the Chelsea game and the 2nd half v Arsenal, Palace and big chunks of the Liverpool game, the whole of the Leicester match and most of this match have seen us play boring football.
I would not be prepared to pay my hard earned to sit and endure that ****e .... I didn't do it under Graham and I wouldn't do it now.
I went to a lot of games under Ramos but saw some great games (not always wins but memorable games that I still chat about) . Can only think of Maureen's first 3 games (3-2 v Bournemouth and West Ham and 4-2 v Olympiakos) a 5 nil win over Burnley and a 3-2 win in the Cup v Southampton last season. This season there was the United game and the 7-2 EL match for this season.

7 or 8 very good matches in 15 months is poor by anyones standards.

The club are lucky there aren't paying fans in my opinion

 

[Blue and White]

There were so many back passes it was hard to tell in which direction Spurs were playing in.

Somebody should do some stats., might well be a record number of back-passing by a side over 90mins.
Winks would be so proud.

Look at the pass map.
But also look at the pass map of other teams.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

I do not like watching us. It's boring, insipid football which I would not pay to watch.
My least favourite period of football at Spurs was late 98 until 2001. We won a trophy in that time but played some of the worst football I can ever remember.
This matches it.
We have played 2 complete good games of football in the league this season.
The Everton game, the 2nd half v west ham, the 2nd half v toon, the first half v southampton, most of the Brighton and Burnley games, mos of the Chelsea game and the 2nd half v Arsenal, Palace and big chunks of the Liverpool game, the whole of the Leicester match and most of this match have seen us play boring football.
I would not be prepared to pay my hard earned to sit and endure that ****e .... I didn't do it under Graham and I wouldn't do it now.
I went to a lot of games under Ramos but saw some great games (not always wins but memorable games that I still chat about) . Can only think of Maureen's first 3 games (3-2 v Bournemouth and West Ham and 4-2 v Olympiakos) a 5 nil win over Burnley and a 3-2 win in the Cup v Southampton last season. This season there was the United game and the 7-2 EL match for this season.

7 or 8 very good matches in 15 months is poor by anyones standards.

The club are lucky there aren't paying fans in my opinion

Hear, hear!

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

You are not disputing the figures.
Everytime we went forward they fouled.

I'm disputing the idea that those figures are in any way relevant, for the simple reason that when we're sitting back for 70+ minutes it's easier to break up our scant attacks with a foul since there's only one player that needs to be taken out, as opposed to three or four as part of an attacking move

Also, since you want to bring stats into it, here's one for you
Wolves shots: 11
Spurs fouls: 13

We couldn't even break up their attacking play by fouling them. Why? Because we were sitting back so much for 70+ minutes

 

[Dier Hard]

I went to a couple Cheshunt FC games when fans were allowed back at non-league matches. Was a great laugh to be fair and the football was actually a lot more intense than you’d think.

£95 for their season ticket.
I’m shelling out over a grand for my Spurs one.

Something ain’t right there

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

A Tale of Two Responses

Response A, from Alasdair Gold

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Response B, from some rando on r/coys
Spurs have conceded 15 goals so far in the PL. 10 from set pieces, 2 own-goals, 1 major deflection and only remaining 2 from open play. More than half happened in the last 10 minutes.

One says we play like we fear the opponents, the other says we give ourselves a reason to fear our opponents because of how we play