Off Topic Bill Nicholson Arms

  • Please bear with us on the new site integration and fixing any known bugs over the coming days. If you can not log in please try resetting your password and check your spam box. If you have tried these steps and are still struggling email [email protected] with your username/registered email address
  • Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!
Time will tell on that.


"The choice isn't between deaths and economic damage."

The matter is which (total deaths, economic damage) pairis are
most acceptable to a nation, and what measures had to be
enacted to make those pairs reality.
You are begging the question, in its proper sense, by defining the matter in that way because your wording assumes the answer that economic damage and deaths are a trade off. My hypothesis is that economic damage is caused by the virus getting out of control so that the correct way of dealing with it is stringent early measures, which obviate the need for longer term late ones.
There is a good reason to take this as the starting point, because there is a constraint on the system which is the capacity of the hospitals to treat those with the virus. Once this is reached then you start getting knock on effects in deaths from other untreated illnesses so you then have almost no choice but to put in heavy constraints to restrict further growth.
My background is in physics and nuclear power. The virus spread is exactly the same mathematically as a nuclear chain reaction. Exponential growth is most easily containable by early intervention.
 
You are begging the question, in its proper sense, by defining the matter in that way because your wording assumes the answer that economic damage and deaths are a trade off.

Not quite.
The problem is that in attempting to solve an N variable problem, if
one variable is allowed to dominate than you end with "local maxima" .


"My hypothesis is that economic damage is caused by the virus getting out of control
so that the correct way of dealing with it is stringent early measures, which obviate the need for longer term late ones.
There is a good reason to take this as the starting point, because there is a constraint on the system
which is the capacity of the hospitals to treat those with the virus.

Once this is reached then you start getting knock on effects in deaths from other untreated illnesses
so you then have almost no choice but to put in heavy constraints to restrict further growth."

You are going to have this now anyway (undiagnosed/untreated cancers,
suicides due to depression or loss or livelihood etc)


"My background is in physics and nuclear power.
The virus spread is exactly the same mathematically as a nuclear chain reaction.
Exponential growth is most easily containable by early intervention."

A nuclear chain reaction that is spewing alpha rays does not require the
immediate intervention that one spewing gamma rays would.

We thought at the beginning that we were facing the latter
(no serious info on the pathology of SARS-CoV-2 - as bad as "Spanish flu" ?? ) .

Now we know we are not, different measures are possible,
In this vein it could be argued that the likes of Sweden wagered
at the outset that it was not the latter (in which case they may end
up with a decent "global maxima" to the N variable problem) .
 
RIP Paolo Rossi - Taken far too young, anyone who scores in a WC final to help beat the Germans is one of the good guys in my book.

The hat-trick to beat that fabulous but horribly arrogant Brazil side at the same world cup was equally brilliant.
 
Did you mourn Maradona's death?
Yup

This is the thing that I sometimes find aggravating about obituaries, where some will airbrush out the jagged edges while others seem to be an exercise in getting the boot in one last time. For one example, does anyone remember the obituaries for Jade Goody? They all focused on her as a mother, and yes it is tragic for children to lose their mother especially to cancer, but they really airbrushed out the whole "being a racist" thing or how she is the best example of what can happen when you thrust random people into the public eye just as she's an example of someone who was manipulated and exploited so other people could make money off her
 
That World Cup had some great games. Italy v Brazil was on my birthday and I was watching the Clash on the night of the final. The bar was packed with Italians watching the game and it was a great night...Germany lost and great music.

Golden days...

RIP Paolo...
I was in the South of France for that summer around St Tropez. The bar owner refused to let any brits in after the England v France match when a bunch of scousers smashed up his bar. He made the mistake of turning the TV off when England took the lead. Absolute carnage!.
 
RIP Paolo Rossi - Taken far too young, anyone who scores in a WC final to help beat the Germans is one of the good guys in my book.

The hat-trick to beat that fabulous but horribly arrogant Brazil side at the same world cup was equally brilliant.

What arrogance ??

The whole team bar the GK played as though they believed
they were all Pele, and that you don't need to defend when you
are ahead or behind because the goals will come anyway.

That was their philosophy.
They are loved and remembered because of it, not because of
the odd occasions when it met its match (see also Barca and
the height of the "tika taka" era) .
 
RIP Paolo Rossi - Taken far too young, anyone who scores in a WC final to help beat the Germans is one of the good guys in my book.

The hat-trick to beat that fabulous but horribly arrogant Brazil side at the same world cup was equally brilliant.
The interesting thing about that Brazil side is their coach told them he wanted to instill "Garra" into them, which is essentially the Brazilian euphemism for ****ehousery

The main reason I bring this up is, much like plenty of Brazil teams since, people always waffle about joga bonito when the whole thing is a lie, because when they're not hurling themselves to the ground and gaming referees constantly (especially the 2002 team) they're a parade of sly kicks, trips and stamps interspersed with some blatant ones (notably the 1994 and especially the 2014 teams)
 
I was in the South of France for that summer around St Tropez. The bar owner refused to let any brits in after the England v France match when a bunch of scousers smashed up his bar. He made the mistake of turning the TV off when England took the lead. Absolute carnage!.

I was in a bar in Frèjus , the bar owner did likewise , I left before the end when the local chapter of Herbert's arrived
 
  • Like
Reactions: deedub93
I like Frejus, I saw Bowie and Roxy Music there that year. Wonderful roman amphitheatre for a rock concert, my favourite venue in the world.
We happened upon Santana on Bastille night one year what a night , we used to stay on a farm a couple of kms out of town , farmers wife used to leave fresh eggs and wine every day and take the kids off to feed the piglets and chickens , they loved it
 
What arrogance ??

The whole team bar the GK played as though they believed
they were all Pele, and that you don't need to defend when you
are ahead or behind because the goals will come anyway.
.

A definition of arrogance is when a person believes he or she is better than others - in footballing terms you have summed it up above.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Spurlock
A definition of arrogance is when a person believes he or she is better than others - in footballing terms you have summed it up above.

Arrogance is how you openly manifest such things to others (pride and derision etc) .

AFAIK nobody in the Brasil 82 WC squad were shouting the odds
about how they were so much better and their opponents were so
much worse (of course these were the days when oversea press
articles/reports were not widely translated or available to
international audiences - so perhaps they actually did so) .