Off Topic International Break Thread
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Wait...so we want Dier in the back four now?
Either way, Tanganga's back in training
Mixed feelings about Wales' goal....Bale easily won a header against Doherty at the back post.
Honestly not sure why Dier gets the blame for the first goal. It's a decent pass to Mount but he's sleeping and the centre back beats him to it.
Grealish aside, England were rubbish, the Belgians so much better and even though we were camped in their half for much of the 2nd half don't think Courtois made a save of note. For the pundits in the studio to suggest otherwise is just the usual biased rubbish we get from sky.
Don't think we were too bad. Would have been a different match if Kane had scored with the keeper beaten (until the centre forward heads it off the line, where have we seen that before?) However thought Mount was utterly appalling - and as someone said, not so much as Dier's bad pass for the first goal, as Mount not being switched on. Sancho was equally bad, not sure if he really is a top player or had a top first season. Incidentally, none of the game made me wish Sterling was playing.
I think you watched a different match to me! Despite Grealish looking good (and he was our best player), he still actually created nothing for the countries best centre forward, who was our 2nd best player but couldn't be in 2 places at once to convert his own crosses and through balls, and lets not forget that this was against defence made up from 2/3 players most of us consider to be way past their best. Of the 4 subs only Winks really made a positive impact, again a player that we here often criticise yet Englands upturn in performance coincided with his introduction though he could hardly have had less impact the Henderson and Rice who were both poor last night. Henderson is rapidly becoming a modern day John Barnes fabulous for Liverpool - hopeless for England and Hendo doesn't haven't a goal in the Maracana to live off of.
Of the other 7 players Trippier was OK, the back 3 didn't do much wrong, I am not sure what the hype about Sakas performance is about he is another one who failed to put a single decent cross in from a number of decent opportunities Chilwell was better for sure. As for the other Subs Sancho I agree with the previous posters and Calvert Lewin should have gone down the middle with Kane why bring on an in form Centre Forward and ask him to play on the right of the front 3 it doesn't make sense to me, and the lack of impact he made can be laid at Southgates door rather than the players.
In my opinion Belgium were comfortable at 2-0 and allowed us to dominate possession and play in front of them which we did, they still created two chances for Lukaku in the 2nd half that were better than anything we created for Harry.
Of the other 7 players Trippier was OK, the back 3 didn't do much wrong, I am not sure what the hype about Sakas performance is about he is another one who failed to put a single decent cross in from a number of decent opportunities Chilwell was better for sure. As for the other Subs Sancho I agree with the previous posters and Calvert Lewin should have gone down the middle with Kane why bring on an in form Centre Forward and ask him to play on the right of the front 3 it doesn't make sense to me, and the lack of impact he made can be laid at Southgates door rather than the players.
In my opinion Belgium were comfortable at 2-0 and allowed us to dominate possession and play in front of them which we did, they still created two chances for Lukaku in the 2nd half that were better than anything we created for Harry.
Perhaps you care more than I do. I expect very little from the National team because the instances of exciting performances are so rare. I would take it back to Venables before I remember a team of sustainable excitement. So for me compared to the boring dross that is usually served up, and I include the last world cup where we achieved a creditable result but without breaking any excitement barriers. Looking at last nights performance through that lens I was pleased to see some positive moves forwards, to witness some creative interplay and don't forget Kane had a top header cleared of the line by Lukako add to that a helpful deflection for Belgium's first goal and a dubious free kick awarded for DeBruyne kicking our player. It's clear that the gods of fortune were not on our side. By the way you may write Toby off but I never have and you have to give credit to Belguim for defending well. They are rated number 1 after all so all in all I don't think their performance was that impressive either and England created just as many chances as they did. All in all I think your cries of rubbish are too much in what I saw as one of the most promising looking England sides that I have seen for years, with a stand out creative Grealish and a world class striker. If this side grows together we could at last see something worth watching.
I’m becoming increasingly disillusioned with Southgate’s management of the team. Up until maybe a year/18 months ago he’d been a breath of fresh air and had largely avoided the pitfalls and favouritism that had hampered previous recent England managers.
But he seems to have been spooked by defensive fragility and the reversion to a back 3 has not fixed this while at the same time has stifled some of the attacking creativity. We have a number of excellent attacking midfielders and forwards and I see no reason why he shouldn’t be using the 433 which looked so effective for us in some of the big games after the World Cup, particularly as the alternative isn’t working.
Drop Mount and the horrendously overrated Declan Rice, stop shoehorning Walker in as a third CB, and we might get more out of this group.
But he seems to have been spooked by defensive fragility and the reversion to a back 3 has not fixed this while at the same time has stifled some of the attacking creativity. We have a number of excellent attacking midfielders and forwards and I see no reason why he shouldn’t be using the 433 which looked so effective for us in some of the big games after the World Cup, particularly as the alternative isn’t working.
Drop Mount and the horrendously overrated Declan Rice, stop shoehorning Walker in as a third CB, and we might get more out of this group.
I agree almost precisely, all England managers end up far too defensive and right now we do have some really good attacking players, so let's use them. Mount and Rice were far from impressive and too often we seem to have no spirit of adventure. I am pretty sure most us would prefer to see some exciting forward play. I applaud Leeds for example and their dedication to attacking forward, even if the are not getting perfect results they do at least entertain.
Yes rubbish was harsh, and was posted in the immediate aftermath and I think my comments today are more considered. I do agree that there was good fortune about their goals. But I still think they were comfortable from that point on. I do care and have been a passionate fan of the national team since the early 70s and I genuinely hope that Grealish is a given a chance to establish himself as the creative force we need, but I am not convinced he will be picked when Sterling and Rashford are both available.
As for Toby I have not written him off (there are plenty here who have), he is far and away our best defender and both and he and Jan looked very comfortable last night.
Mount’s usefulness can be seen when you compare his free kick 20 yards out with Merten’s from almost the same spot. I cannot understand why he is in the squad at all, but it seems that he is beyond reproach. The loss of possession leading to the first goal was definitely down to him not concentrating on the game, but nearly all the experts want to blame Dier. I have seen nothing to be excited about from Sancho. When we played Dortmund, Vertonghen kept him in his pocket through the match. Don’t even get me started about Rice!
I think Pablo Escobar's Egyptian twin meant to say "Salah won't be considered a great player until he signs for Los Ladrones do Madrid"
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These internationals are ****ing ridiculous. Better play some friendlies though, just to be sure!
It was inevitable after Brown tested positive last week , James Maclean also tested positive
I'm now sitting in a dark room with my fingers in ears waiting for Son to go down for the Citeh game
I'm now sitting in a dark room with my fingers in ears waiting for Son to go down for the Citeh game