Lessons learned

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C

Channon walked on H2O

Active Member
Jul 22, 2011
1,091
10
38
Royan, SW France
Driving back up through Wales last night, I was reminded of the last time I'd made that journey after the Cup Final in 03. I'd felt pretty good last time. Seems a long time ago!

Anyway, not a lot of "feel-good" about this latest journey so plenty of time for reflection. The hard lesson was one we all knew at the start of the season, but our great start has allowed us to forget. This is going to be one hell of a tough league. The step up is a huge, and last night you could see why. Cardiff refused to let us play (the cads!) and while it was ugly it was pretty effective. In Miller they had a skilled front man who took chances that, had they fallen to a Div 1 striker might have got away.

In this league the opposition are not going to be swept away by dazzling football, and a good dozen or so teams have players capable of hurting other teams. We are in the mix, of course we are. But we need to be aware that our novelty value is fast fading; that when chances come they have to be converted and when we have the ball at the back route 1 is sometimes an option we need to take. Before the 76 Cup Final Lawrie Mac allegedly told Steele and Blyth that he didn't care if the Queen was watching, if the ball was in our area they should boot it away. Would have been good advice to our centre backs last night!

Not despondent this morning, just a little chastened. There are a lot of teams going to take points off each other and Saints will hang in there. Is it me or do you also wish it was anyone other than Watford coming to SMS on Saturday?:emoticon-0105-wink:
 
Watford have a good record against us but that was when they had a decent championship side and were challenging at the top,this season is all about survival for them so i'm not too concerned about the record,anyway this team has been breaking bad records for a while now! As for the game,i'm not despondant at all,just gotta look at the league and be happy!
 
Back down to earth after last night - as you've quite rightly pointed out, this league is not easy by any means. I think the players needed last night to give themselves a reality check - complacency will always set in at some point, it's only natural - remember Rochdale last season. I am confident that they will bounce back on Saturday, home advantage should really help.
 
Channon walked on H2O said:
Driving back up through Wales last night, I was reminded of the last time I'd made that journey after the Cup Final in 03. I'd felt pretty good last time. Seems a long time ago!

Anyway, not a lot of "feel-good" about this latest journey so plenty of time for reflection. The hard lesson was one we all knew at the start of the season, but our great start has allowed us to forget. This is going to be one hell of a tough league. The step up is a huge, and last night you could see why. Cardiff refused to let us play (the cads!) and while it was ugly it was pretty effective. In Miller they had a skilled front man who took chances that, had they fallen to a Div 1 striker might have got away.

In this league the opposition are not going to be swept away by dazzling football, and a good dozen or so teams have players capable of hurting other teams. We are in the mix, of course we are. But we need to be aware that our novelty value is fast fading; that when chances come they have to be converted and when we have the ball at the back route 1 is sometimes an option we need to take. Before the 76 Cup Final Lawrie Mac allegedly told Steele and Blyth that he didn't care if the Queen was watching, if the ball was in our area they should boot it away. Would have been good advice to our centre backs last night!

Not despondent this morning, just a little chastened. There are a lot of teams going to take points off each other and Saints will hang in there. Is it me or do you also wish it was anyone other than Watford coming to SMS on Saturday?:emoticon-0105-wink:
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We won't resort to hoofball.
 
The Saints under NA have an excellent record of 'bouncing back' after a defeat and have never lost two league games in a row (usually winning the following match), lets hope this is the case again on Saturday.
 
Saints Alive:1398165 said:
The Saints under NA have an excellent record of 'bouncing back' after a defeat and have never lost two league games in a row (usually winning the following match), lets hope this is the case again on Saturday.
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With the exception of Nigel's very first match in charge (a defeat away to MK Dons, which was followed up by a home draw vs Colchester), I think you'll find that we have ALWAYS followed up a league defeat with a league win.
 
Excellent post. We just need to take each game as it comes and acknowledge none is going to be easy. There will be slip-ups along the way, we just need to respond to them positively and learn the lessons.
 
There was a lot of time wasting last night by the Saints goalie especially right from the start of the game. It seems that if you waste time from the start of the game you are allowed to get away with it - as only one minute was added at the end of the first half. Great to see how much quicker the goalie was getting shot of the ball in the last twenty minutes, and that helped to make the second half fara more entertaining.
Is this normal tactics for the Saints? The idea seemed to be to slow the game down completely, hope for a goal, then slow the game down completely again. You were very good in possession (and had a lot of it), especially the first half, but spent a lot of that possession messing about on the half way line, and then passing it to the back four -to do the same thing again. I can see you being difficult to beat if you get in front as you do keep the ball well.
 
Guys I think we were due for an awakener. As previously said Cardiff are no fools..... the majority of their players have been playing championship football for sometime. They have been there or there abouts over the last 3/4 seasons. If we are to be promoted we are going to have to stop conceding. all this talk about them being a weakened side doesn't wash for me, as we have found out, they too have ample replacements.
 
iggypop said:
There was a lot of time wasting last night by the Saints goalie especially right from the start of the game. It seems that if you waste time from the start of the game you are allowed to get away with it - as only one minute was added at the end of the first half. Great to see how much quicker the goalie was getting shot of the ball in the last twenty minutes, and that helped to make the second half fara more entertaining.
Is this normal tactics for the Saints? The idea seemed to be to slow the game down completely, hope for a goal, then slow the game down completely again. You were very good in possession (and had a lot of it), especially the first half, but spent a lot of that possession messing about on the half way line, and then passing it to the back four -to do the same thing again. I can see you being difficult to beat if you get in front as you do keep the ball well.
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Yes there was a lot of that, very bizarre that we kept doing it, I think our fans got just as frustrated with it as the home fans did. I thought at first that maybe Kelvin had some sort of injury from the warm up or something and was struggling with long kicks, but clearly not. Then I thought perhaps it was tactical, trying to draw your midfield forward to open up the "hole", but that didn't seem to be that effective anyway. Very strange

Other than that the passing was good, final ball disappointing.

De Ridder was a breath of fresh air when he came on, really hungry for it. Has probably given NA something to think about for saturday's team sheet, although I wonder if he would have the same hunger starting rather than coming off the bench?
 
We're conceding too many goals and we can't rely on outscoring the opposition every time. There's been a feeling of 'you score 1, no problem we'll score 3' about Saints but that's not going to happen in a lot of games.
 
i always said the next two away games will determine if we will challenge automatic - and 1 point suggests that unless strengthened in Jan we will be more likely playoff contenders this year.
think our home form alone makes us decent playoff contenders as absolutely no-one will look forward to coming to SMS this year.

nothing wrong with playoffs of course! especially having come from L1 its an amazing achievement, but there are more tough away trips to come and until we plug the defence we will not be able to outscore opponents every single time. plus its still early days and i still fully expect the likes of west ham to click into gear and be in automatic after too long. of course derby away isnt too far off and with their form that too could be an eye opener to see if we have what it takes.

i think De Ridder has been knocking on the door for ages now and has to get a chance VS watford, if not i would be annoyed if i was him.

as the cardiff fan stated we keep the ball alot and this is key to our play - excuse the comparison but its what barca do all game every game and its good to dictate the tempo, especially as when you get that goal you just need to keep it up to retain possession and limit chances.
 
The occasional defeat prevents complacency. We'll still be in the mix this season if we play the way we've been playing since the start. Our defence could do with a little work though.
 
AdamBanana20 said:
We won't resort to hoofball.
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Quite right, and not what is advocated. Steele and Blyth were as cultured a pair of centre backs as you would want, but they knew when you could play it short or carry the ball and when to aim for Channon's head. Playing it from the back is laudable, but can be dangerous. I remember a scouser mate of mine complaining that Hansen was OK but played too much football for a centre back, and for any of us lucky enough to see both Bobby Moore and Hansen play we know that they could play killer passes and not simply hit row X. You may know the story, but in the last minute of the 66 World Cup Final Styles was screaming at Moore to put the ball in the stand. Instead, being Moore, he played the perfect pass for Hurst to get his hat-trick. But I have also seen Moore boot it into touch or hit a hopeful ball down the park. Good players know when is the time to play the fancy stuff and when you have to mix it. We looked like Arsenal last night, and that is not good!

In Adkins I trust. He is a good manager, and I expect to see progress continued so I am certainly not down, just as flat as I always am after a defeat.
 
Channon walked on H2O said:
Quite right, and not what is advocated. Steele and Blyth were as cultured a pair of centre backs as you would want, but they knew when you could play it short or carry the ball and when to aim for Channon's head. Playing it from the back is laudable, but can be dangerous. I remember a scouser mate of mine complaining that Hansen was OK but played too much football for a centre back, and for any of us lucky enough to see both Bobby Moore and Hansen play we know that they could play killer passes and not simply hit row X. You may know the story, but in the last minute of the 66 World Cup Final Styles was screaming at Moore to put the ball in the stand. Instead, being Moore, he played the perfect pass for Hurst to get his hat-trick. But I have also seen Moore boot it into touch or hit a hopeful ball down the park. Good players know when is the time to play the fancy stuff and when you have to mix it. We looked like Arsenal last night, and that is not good!

In Adkins I trust. He is a good manager, and I expect to see progress continued so I am certainly not down, just as flat as I always am after a defeat.
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nothing wrong with playing like arsenal.....as long as its the 1999-2005 version!
 
john hughs:1399723 said:
AdamBanana20 said:
We won't resort to hoofball.
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Please talk me thro your goal........Hoffed into the Cardiff area by a full back and nodded on by Lambert ,wicked deflection then landed nicely to your scorer?
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I'm sorry, but what is your problem? You wont stop banging on and on, on our board.

Are you incapable of using common sense? We were 2-0 down, with time running out. We had little choice but to get the ball into down the other end as quickly as possible. It's not like we were doing it for the full 90!! Give me strength!
 
st_brendy said:
I'm sorry, but what is your problem? You wont stop banging on and on, on our board.

Are you incapable of using common sense? We were 2-0 down, with time running out. We had little choice but to get the ball into down the other end as quickly as possible. It's not like we were doing it for the full 90!! Give me strength!
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Well said Brendy,about time these cardiff fans moved on to the next game.
 
st_brendy said:
I'm sorry, but what is your problem? You wont stop banging on and on, on our board.

Are you incapable of using common sense? We were 2-0 down, with time running out. We had little choice but to get the ball into down the other end as quickly as possible. It's not like we were doing it for the full 90!! Give me strength!
Click to expand...

It's ironic but if we had resorted to the hoofball a bit earlier we may got a result, having seen the goal on the highlights it was so simple and effective that I only wished we had taken the direct route earlier and more often, easy to say in hindsight, but we have that in our itinerary for future use.
 
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