Heard through the grapevine it’s gonna be pretty lively on Saturday in London.....best avoided
Off Topic The Politics Thread
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I heard about this. Apparently ’Wall’ are going up mob handed to protect the statues. Tarquin's better watch out!
Oh I didn't realise you meant he was advocating violence.
This isn't excusing what he said in the slightest, more an aside, something a touch more sinister in the world of political and environmental protesting. Fifteen years ago the only things people would take with them is a sign, their lunch and if they were feeling a touch hardcore a chain to attach themselves. In the last decade or so a lot of protests and protesters have become targets for groups looking for a fight including some who would have kicked off at football matches, some of those 'footy lads alliance' boys as well as other groups. This has led to two things, a few dickheads attaching themselves to movements who are happy to fight with these dumb ****s and moderate people taking things with them to protect themselves, and I'd have to include myself in that. I will emphasise I would never start violence, I will always be on the lookout for signs things might happen and try and avoid them wherever possible, we have people who infiltrate the groups to warn us if something is being planned and change the protest route and contact the police to avoid the confrontation, however we have been ambushed on a couple of occasions and trust me there are no depths these people will go to including hitting women and children to get a reaction (I've seen that on videos taken at other protests), I've been very lucky in the respect we have always been able to take a defensive stance and back away, despite being spat at, vile language including telling us after they are done with us they will rape the women in the group pelted with bottles,rocks among other things, yeah a classy bunch
Remember this is an aside, it does not excuse the violence or destruction done in the current protests.
Protect the statues haha, what makes me laugh is a lot of them have absolutely no idea what the statue is of and why they are there. Got a link sent to me about people saying about protecting a war memorial up in Durham, only it wasn't a war memorial at all, one of there own was trying to educate them what the statue was and it's significance and the majority of the people on the thread turned on him, a couple of others pointed out there was at no point anything going on anywhere near this statue, and the protests in Durham were 100% peaceful, this didn't seem to matter with these good ol' boys.
Oh and I hope we all know Antifa just means anti fascism and whilst you will get groups who try and high jack and use the name there is no big antifa organisation, to be antifa is a stance, one I'd hope most people would identify themselves with to be honest.
Oh and I hope we all know Antifa just means anti fascism and whilst you will get groups who try and high jack and use the name there is no big antifa organisation, to be antifa is a stance, one I'd hope most people would identify themselves with to be honest.
Would love those ****s to try it on with the wrong targets but they’ll stand around a war memorial in Stone Island chanting about Tommy Robinson and slap a student walking away from them on the back of the head.
This will go down well with the masses!And people wonder why?
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is that lord nelson, the one at trafalgar square?
mmm you sound like you don't mind statues being attacked. Thing is it won't be just Millwall it will be others as well. The huge majority of the country found those acts of vandalism as disgusting. I say if those freaks want to deface National memorials then I have no sympathy for them.
Absolute bullshit. Where does it suggest that I don't mind statues (that being statues as a whole, not individual) being attacked? Please point this out or retract your statement. You can't just post these presumptions without any justification, you are making unjust assertions about me, which shouldn't be allowed on this forum.
I'm not bothered about the statue in Bristol but firstly that is an individual case, one statue among what must be thousands in the UK, so not bothered about what is probably 0.2%, does not mean I advocate statues being attacked.
The real issue is why was it still up? Why were countless requests to have the statue removed ignored? Something you choose to ignore because it doesn't fit into your narrative and attempt to discredit all the protesters by the actions of a few.
You've pushed this narrative for days now, relentlessly focusing 100% on the actions of a few, ignoring the reasons why the majority are protesting. You are trying to discredit the whole movement and those who support it, including your Tarquin comments. Some of us would wonder why you would want to do that, why would you constantly try and discredit an entire equality movement, that's not for me to draw conclusions but people will, you aren't stupid so I'm not believing you don't know exactly what you are doing here
Bloody hell you didn't need to write the Gettysburg address to answer! You did say ’protect a statue ha ha’ as if you don't believe or feel that they have a right to defend it? You then mocked them regarding what they know about the statue? It doesn't take an academic to know what the Cenotaph is there for? However you are correct in some part because the Abraham Lincoln statue was also vandalised ( which does show that some idiots don't have a clue?) I also have a right to refer to people as Tarquins. Get over it! You should understand we call Fulham fans Rupert and Tarquin ( if you are QPR that is)
Anyway there is no point worrying anymore because the police won't put up with idiots causing violence.
I was mocking some!! Important word there some, citing an example of those that are out to defend something... yet have no idea what they are defending and in certain cases totally misidentifying it. I know you'd find it hard to believe but some people are defending the statue of a slave trader, mad I know. It seems a bit crazy to be outraged for something certain people have no idea about, almost as though they are being outraged for the sake of being against the protesters.
I am well aware of what a Rupert or a Tarquin is in respect to a Fulham and you have every right to use it, but how and where you used it was quite telling. What it shows is how you used it as a sweeping, derogatory and dismissive term, language matters. In pretty much all of your posts in the last few days you've done nothing but focus on the actions on the few, totally ignoring the actions of the many as though that's the only thing that matters. Bit like when people bang on about football hooligans, as though that is the only thing in football, the same could be said when they only focus on the actions of people like Kyle Walker and his hooker party, but ignore what the likes of Marcus Rashford has done recently, which is quite incredible.
Then you have the audacity to question my football allegiance, you really shouldn't be making such comments or making totally unfounded assertions, but if you do you will have no right to complain if they come straight back at you.
TBH I really didn't know much about the fella on the statue and it only came to light when the idiots ripped it down. However, they do not have the authority to do that. The opted to be vandals and acted like a mob. Those responsible should be prosecuted, as should the idiots that defaced the monuments in London. I am sure you would agree with that?
I said previously that the message would get lost with the idiots that cause violence and it has. Please do not try and tell me what I think is right and wrong. Like you, I have an opinion but sadly whenever decent people complain about idiots you will always get the apologists who try to turn the argument away from what is actually about... funny that
You say you go to these marches peacefully (and it seems you belong to groups) so why would you need to protect yourself? Just curious?
It Seems a bit strange to carry obviously some sort of protection to a march, doesn't it? I have been to many away games where there has been trouble but normally it's the ones looking for it that find it? I have never taken something for protection.
As for me, I am Rangers born and bred and I come on here to discuss my club. I don't go on any other forums or talk politics and TBH I hope when the football comes back the mods shut this thread down because we don't need to attract all the political types (not saying you) that come on the boards to talk nothing but politics.
besides talking QPR is far more important than discussing those anarchist tw2ts.
No offence meant Wills, but you come over as playing the victim card a bit.....
Honestly, just saying as I see it. Really curious now about what kind of demos you go on that are constantly attacked....(Not expecting you to say publicly of course)
My grandad and his mates were Antifa, Wills.......the ****s tried to desecrate a memorial to them last Saturday...didn’t you see ?
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Well as I've just responded to Ellers, we have been victims. Oh I've never said constantly by the way, important that. The protest itself is of no relevance to those wishing to disrupt it and cause trouble. There are numerous groups now who actively seek out protests in an attempt to cause trouble and start fights, as I also stated in my response to Ellers we now (didn't happen years back) do risk assessments on pretty much all protests we do, we have people who have infiltrated groups just to listen into the chatter in order to avoid these groups.
Can you please clarify this comment? Your grandad and his mates were Antifa? By that I'm assuming rightly or wrongly that they fought fascism, the ****s? (who I've condemned) tried to desecrate a memorial to them last Saturday.. didn't I see? Yeah I saw the news and I repeat I do not support there actions at all. So what's your point?
You can't say these idiots represent the entire anti fascist movement they have acted independently or as small groups. If you want to go on that, you have groups of people who identify themselves as patriots who go around demanding non whites/people all certain religions/ethnicities leave the country, commit attacks on people purely due to the colour of their skin, so by that logic anytime that happens we should be calling out anyone who considers themselves patriotic? Is that what you are saying?
Yeah but surely it is relevant Wills. I mean if you were say marching to advocate having sex with children then of course it would elicit public outrage and leave you open to attack....Like wise if you were marching to have peace in Tibet I would say violence against you would not happen.
And on your point about no troubles and fights years back, I totally disagree. The 80’s and 90’s were a hotbed of civil disorder on the streets of Britain during protests and marches...with AFA/Red Action etc on one side.....and Combat 18/BM etc on the other....it was ****ing war every weekend.......to say any different is quite simply incorrect.
You mentioned Antifa Wills.....I came back at your point with a point of my own (which you yourself clarified for me)
I can’t clarify, agree or disagree with your last paragraph ‘cos I don’t quite get what your saying.
Are you supporting the actions and deeds done under the umbrella of ‘Antifa’ ?
Oh ok, I get your point. I am not involved at all with any of the groups of who you described, more things like anti weapons trade, equality groups, a few high jinks, more likely a sit in, maybe minor disruption, never violent and never confrontation, like I've said we actively seek intelligence to avoid any sort of violent confrontation