George Floyd R.I.P

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haslam said:
Thread too long for me to bother checking if someone has already said this but you don't need intent to kill to be done for murder in the UK.

Intention to cause serious harm (usually GBH) which then leads to death is enough. The main case on it is Vickers, a burglar who was interrupted by an elderly lady. He beat her up before running away and admitted that he attacked her but had no intention to kill her.

I'd have thought that under UK law you could try and argue that he did intend GBH and that it lead to death so try for a murder conviction, I'd usually say you'd never get a conviction in this type of situation but video is pretty damning. Whatever we think of racial tensions and police mistakes in this country (Stephen Lawrence and all that) we're just not in the same league of issues as the USA. As much as we do still have institutionalised racism it manifests itself in a much less violence manner and it feels like progress is made with each generation - I'm not sure the same can be said for America.
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I think because a lot of cases are downgraded to manslaughter to ensure a conviction if the defendant pleads guilty, there is a general assumption that you have to be Dracula or Julius from Pulp Fiction to prove intent. If that was the case, bombers who gave a warning would always be able to claim 'I never intended to kill anyone'. But as we saw in the 70's and 80's during the Troubles, that was no defence from a murder charge if your bomb went off and the area hadn't been cleared and so forth. And don't forget, you can still get life in prison for manslaughter in the UK anyway.
 
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* Points record said:
I did a few CND marches in the early 80's, and yeah - they ****ing stood out like sore thumbs then. It was the RAF haircuts and pressed jeans normally. And Wings t-shirts.
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We had one or more in the group I followed cardiff with..... Still no idea who it was that infiltrated us but they would have been active like the rest of us at the time........ Myself and others were filmed by a camera placed in jacket talking about the aftermath of what just happened and it was obvious that we knew them well and trusted them.

Few years before this take down of us we had a guy called Shakespeare who got found out undercover by the wolves crowd eventually when he followed us everywhere he was the head of football surveillance
 
aberdude said:
We had one or more in the group I followed cardiff with..... Still no idea who it was that infiltrated us but they would have been active like the rest of us at the time........ Myself and others were filmed by a camera placed in jacket talking about the aftermath of what just happened and it was obvious that we knew them well and trusted them.

Few years before this take down of us we had a guy called Shakespeare who got found out undercover by the wolves crowd eventually when he followed us everywhere he was the head of football surveillance
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I've now read that twice, any chance of a translation?
 
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haslam said:
Thread too long for me to bother checking if someone has already said this but you don't need intent to kill to be done for murder in the UK.

Intention to cause serious harm (usually GBH) which then leads to death is enough. The main case on it is Vickers, a burglar who was interrupted by an elderly lady. He beat her up before running away and admitted that he attacked her but had no intention to kill her.

I'd have thought that under UK law you could try and argue that he did intend GBH and that it lead to death so try for a murder conviction, I'd usually say you'd never get a conviction in this type of situation but video is pretty damning. Whatever we think of racial tensions and police mistakes in this country (Stephen Lawrence and all that) we're just not in the same league of issues as the USA. As much as we do still have institutionalised racism it manifests itself in a much less violence manner and it feels like progress is made with each generation - I'm not sure the same can be said for America.
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Thanks mate. You are about the 8th person to give me an example of someone who killed someone and I accept that to be the case... so I'm putting out a notice in The Times newspaper tomorrow saying NO MORE! Just out of interest, are you sure the case you quoted of the burglar wasn't classed as manslaughter?

Whilst I agree with the rest, that "progress with each generation" was true up to about 4 years ago. There seems to be a very polished agenda in the UK and US by it seems anyone with or without power, who can present themselves in a "civilised" manner and push institutional racism and make it sound so plausible. In that sense we've probably stalled in that generational progress.
 
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Archers Road said:
Having you as a mate?


Oh, sorry, thought you said depressed.
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I thought I was going to have to go a full day there without you having a random dig :emoticon-0107-sweat

You should probably start charging me for that space I’m occupying in your head.
 
Treble said:
Thanks mate. You are about the 8th person to give me an example of someone who killed someone and I accept that to be the case... so I'm putting out a notice in The Times newspaper tomorrow saying NO MORE! Just out of interest, are you sure the case you quoted of the burglar wasn't classed as manslaughter?

Whilst I agree with the rest, that "progress with each generation" was true up to about 4 years ago. There seems to be a very polished agenda in the UK and US by it seems anyone with or without power, who can present themselves in a "civilised" manner and push institutional racism and make it sound so plausible. In that sense we've probably stalled in that generational progress.
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Yeah but mine is current case law in this country so forget about everyone else, they're just white noise buddy.

More recent cases like Nedrick and (the hugely tragic) Woollin cement the point but bleh.

You're correct about the last few years and things that should be being pulled up as recist/ xenophobic seems to be getting airtime but I'd just say progress isn't exxactly a straight line and it's getting noticed as wrong and pulled up more than it would have been a generation ago. It's hard to be sure though.
 
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There's a riot/looting spree in the middle of a pandemic, and hardly anyone is wearing a mask.
Thick yank ****s.
 
The prayer vigil for George Floyd being led by his brother at the mo...can see it on CNN if you have that channel.
 
George Floyd's brother (Terrence Floyd) has asked for an end to the violence.
 
brb said:
Just seen it, mechanical asphyxia, which confirms what we all know, murder!
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At one point they said that a witness who was very close to the whole thing is going to speak out tomorrow.

They made a very clear reference to the fact, that the other two officers, were forcing their knees into his back as well, to make it even harder for him to breathe.
 
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