Poch Watch

[Hoddle is a god]

Tottenham manager Mauricio Pochettino told Sky Sports: "We conceded so early, we started the game well, had a few chances, but the first long ball we conceded.

"We were a bit confused and that is my fault, I'm the manager, but we made a lot of mistakes and didn't work well in the first half. In the second half we fixed the problems, our positional game was completely different and we moved the ball better. Its very important for us to start with a victory, we have a lot of work to do."


I'll kick this thread off with this quote, because it belies something of that enigma with Poch, for me. On the one hand, I remember him telling the press that he wants to end his career as our greatest ever manager in the Prem era, but, on the other hand, I remember him recently telling the press that he will leave us as soon as he wins anything big.

It's clear that he could take any job in football, so his choice to remain at Spurs is humbling. Every year that he chooses to remain with us, we are going to have to suffer the "Poch to Real/United" tauntings of a media that seems determined to see us fail.

Most of us, I think, is paranoid about the situation, looking for hints in everything he says, trying to read into his mind, what he really wants.

Let's use this thread to keep a watching brief on the man who has transformed our club from a club that was previously there simply to play "attractive" football to one that has smashed apart Murdoch's cosy Top 4 club.

 

[Hoddle is a god]

By the way, I've always had a sneaking suspicion that he enjoys toying with the press, or using it as a whip to gently tap the board on the flanks to remind it to take heed of Poch's wishes.

It certainly worked in this window, with our highest ever net spend.

 

[Alfie Conn]

I think from reading Poch's book and about his reaction to the champions league defeat that he is a private and emotional man and finds the constant gnawing by the press a big frustration and that is seen by his sometimes strange reaction to their questions
If he had a better vocabulary I'm sure he would tell them to do one in no uncertain terms

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

I think from reading Poch's book and about his reaction to the champions league defeat that he is a private and emotional man and finds the constant gnawing by the press a big frustration and that is seen by his sometimes strange reaction to their questions
If he had a better vocabulary I'm sure he would tell them to do one in no uncertain terms

There's definitely been a few occasions where he;s told them to do one, on top of how at Southampton he had an interpreter so he didn't have to bother speaking with the press even though is English was pretty good even then

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

Bottom lip going now

 

[Spudulike]

WTF is going on?

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[Dier Hard]

WTF is going on?

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Nothing, that fat ginger spacker always talks ****.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

Bottom lip going now

Sanchez departure to Milan?

 

[gooner4ever]

WTF is going on?

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Adrian Dunham is the biggest cock in sports media and full of ****e

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

Bottom lip going now

Sanchez departure to Milan?

Adrian Dunham is the biggest cock in sports media and full of ****e

Sky might have filled in a few blanks, but he's obviously less than happy with the current state of affairs.
Too many restless players, not enough ambition shown by the board.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

...not enough ambition shown by the board.

At the end of last season, MP wanted list was Ndombele, Lo Celso and Sessegnon, all of whom we duly signed. We came close to landing Dybala and might still do so in January.

If it's true that MP is unhappy right now, this isn't the cause

 

[remembercolinlee]

Sky might have filled in a few blanks, but he's obviously less than happy with the current state of affairs.
Too many restless players, not enough ambition shown by the board.

We have spent all week bemoaning irresponsible owners risking clubs by spending what they do not have and now we are asked to slate Levy and co. for "only" buying the players wanted by a manager who is now unhappy.

We spent £110m plus a commitment for another £20m next season for Lo Celso.

If Pochettino goes he goes ... I will be sorry to see him go... but the lack of ambition stuff thrown around doesn't wash with me. I have been lucky enough to miss just one game at our new ground...that is part of our ambition...we just do not have enough money to do everything in one go.

Has Levy made mistakes? Yes
But so has Pochettino.

Neither should be accused of having no ambition.

I am not going to bore others with my usual "look at all those that have ****ed up" arguement as they deserve a break but I think accusing Levy of having no ambition is a joke.

He is looking long term...maybe Pochettino and some players are looking short term cos of their careers so maybe there is conflict...I have no idea...but Spurs are unrecognisable on and off the pitch and Levy deserves as much credit for our success as Pochettino.

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

At the end of last season, MP wanted list was Ndombele, Lo Celso and Sessegnon, all of whom we duly signed. We came close to landing Dybala and might still do so in January.

If it's true that MP is unhappy right now, this isn't the cause

I think it's the failure to deal with the Eriksen and Alderweireld situations which must be a concern. Possibly Vertonghen & Rose too. And there was obviously an issue with Trippier. The board has clearly done a lot right, but dealing with players who show dissent of some kind is a problem.

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

We have spent all week bemoaning irresponsible owners risking clubs by spending what they do not have and now we are asked to slate Levy and co. for "only" buying the players wanted by a manager who is now unhappy.

We spent £110m plus a commitment for another £20m next season for Lo Celso.

If Pochettino goes he goes ... I will be sorry to see him go... but the lack of ambition stuff thrown around doesn't wash with me. I have been lucky enough to miss just one game at our new ground...that is part of our ambition...we just do not have enough money to do everything in one go.

Has Levy made mistakes? Yes
But so has Pochettino.

Neither should be accused of having no ambition.

I am not going to bore others with my usual "look at all those that have ****ed up" arguement as they deserve a break but I think accusing Levy of having no ambition is a joke.

He is looking long term...maybe Pochettino and some players are looking short term cos of their csreers so maybe there is conflict...I have no idea...but Spurs are unrecognisable on and off the pitch and Levy deserves as much credit for our success as Pochettino.

It's all a question of perspective.
Spurs are a top four side now, not a 7th to 14th place yo-yo side.
That's because the club is well run.
But the dilemma now relates to problems with star players who have ambitions to win trophies, maximise their earnings etc.
How do you go from a competitive top four club to winners?
The answer is in keeping the likes of Eriksen happy.
It is still an issue.

 

[remembercolinlee]

I think it's the failure to deal with the Eriksen and Alderweireld situations which must be a concern. Possibly Vertonghen & Rose too. And there was obviously an issue with Trippier. The board has clearly done a lot right, but dealing with players who show dissent of some kind is a problem.

Eriksen simply refuses to sign a new contract and his dream clubs didn't bid for him.

Rose is so unbelievably hyped it's a joke. We can not shift him as no one wants him. The idea that he is crucial is funny as.

Alderweireld refused a contract of £120,000 plus add ons per week and looks certain to go on a free as no one bid for him.

Trippier was awful last season and I think I was the only spurs fan who wanted him kept!

Toby I do not understand...but that looks like an issue with Pochettino.

The board do not tell Pochettino who to play so are not responsible for what is going on with Vertonghen and Eriksen not starting.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

I think it's the failure to deal with the Eriksen and Alderweireld situations which must be a concern. Possibly Vertonghen & Rose too. And there was obviously an issue with Trippier. The board has clearly done a lot right, but dealing with players who show dissent of some kind is a problem.

MP left Rose at home when we went on pre-season tour to find a new club. The conjecture is we want him gone (including MP) more than he wants to leave. He can't find a better offer, so he stays for now but Sessegnon will replace him in time.

Toby Alderweireld's position is nothing new and MP has accepted it and picks him. For a couple of years it's looked like he'll leave on a free in 2020. As he won't move before then, there's nothing the club can do but make him good offers, which we have done. He's an issue but not a problem that can be resolved other than by junking our wages structure.

MP wanted Trippier out, He's gone.

Jan Vertonghen is a new and disappointing problem. Maybe it gets resolved...maybe not. It's impossible to know whilst there's no detail of what the issues could be.

These are players coming to the later years of their careers, who are looking for more money and longer deals, maybe to play in other countries. Spurs can't afford to chuck money around on players who are in that position without getting performances to match. Mauricio Pochettino understands that and won't have unrealistic expectations.

I forgot Eriksen....but see Toby Alderweireld/Rose. The players think there's a better deal out there. It just hasn't turned up....whether it ever will....who knows?

 

[remembercolinlee]

It's all a question of perspective.
Spurs are a top four side now, not a 7th to 14th place yo-yo side.
That's because the club is well run.
But the dilemma now relates to problems with star players who have ambitions to win trophies, maximise their earnings etc.
How do you go from a competitive top four club to winners?
The answer is in keeping the likes of Eriksen happy.
It is still an issue.

Since 2006 we had a 10th place finish in 2008 and an 8th place finish in 2009 and a 6th place finish in 2014.

So in the other 11 years we have had six 5th place finishes, three 4th place, two third place finishes and one second place finish.

I mention this to show we have not been a "7th-14th place yo yo team" for 15 years.

We are not yet at a place where we can match the top wages and buy the top players. But Eriksen has been offered £200,000 per week which is hardly cheap and chose to go public about a new challenge just a few days after we appeared in a CL final.
Before the final Pochettino said he may leave if we "win it"... therefore things are not as straightforward as implied.

United panicked and threw £500,000 per week at Sanchez, £100m and £350,000 per week at Pogba and have just spent £50m on a bloke who has played just 48 games and £80m on Maguire.
United can afford those risks...so it is worth it for them...but we can not so it is not worth it for us.

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

Since 2006 we had a 10th place finish in 2008 and an 8th place finish in 2009 and a 6th place finish in 2014.

So in the other 11 years we have had six 5th place finishes, three 4th place, two third place finishes and one second place finish.

I mention this to show we have not been a "7th-14th place yo yo team" for 15 years.

We are not yet at a place where we can match the top wages and buy the top players. But Eriksen has been offered £200,000 per week which is hardly cheap and chose to go public sbout s new challenge just a few days sfter we appeared in a CL final.
Before the final Pochettino ssid he may leave if we "win it"... therefore things are not as straightforward as implied.

United panicked and threw £500,000 per week at Sanchez, £100m snd £350,000 per week at Pogba and have just spent £50m on a bloke who has plsyed just 48 games and £80m on Maguire.
United can afford those risks...so it is worth it for them...but we can not so it is not worth it for us.

The management of Utd since SAF left has been abysmal. The wealth of the club has provided some insulation, but sooner or later the lack of success will have an impact on the club's income.
Spurs have had the opposite problem. Success has forced the club to reconsider the wages structure etc. At present, the club is caught between two stools.
Resolution of the current problems satisfactorily is the acid test for Spurs.
The new stadium and success on the field has massively improved Spurs' earning potential.
Players' wages is an issue which needs to be addressed going forward otherwise Spurs will be a profitable business with a squad of players not quite good enough to win trophies. Top players demand top wages.
This is a fork on the road for Spurs.

 

[redwhiteandermblue]

I don't blame anyone in particular. I hope that once the transfer window closes, everything will resolve itself. The biggest potential problem is if Eriksen goes. I think the chances of Real putting in a late bid of 40 million or so are high. Eriksen has been the player whose absence has hurt the team most. But even in that case, at least lo Celso and Ndombele are as good replacements as possible. Whoever is here Monday night ought to be motivated to play their best, either to help the club or to help themselves get a new club. There's no telling what will happen, of course, but I'm going to try not to worry about it, since that certainly won't help.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

The management of Utd since SAF left has been abysmal. The wealth of the club has provided some insulation, but sooner or later the lack of success will have an impact on the club's income.
Spurs have had the opposite problem. Success has forced the club to reconsider the wages structure etc. At present, the club is caught between two stools.
Resolution of the current problems satisfactorily is the acid test for Spurs.
The new stadium and success on the field has massively improved Spurs' earning potential.
Players' wages is an issue which needs to be addressed going forward otherwise Spurs will be a profitable business with a squad of players not quite good enough to win trophies. Top players demand top wages.
This is a fork on the road for Spurs.

Your analysis lacks context and balance. Players like Harry Kane, Dele Alli, Heung Min Son, Lucas Moura, Tanguy Ndombele, Lo Celso and Sessegnon have all signed long term contracts, on very good money

Our income is great now but we do have debts that have to be serviced. Failure to do so ends up in spending over £1 billion without repaying the original debt or going out of business. We're spending our money but not about to offer a 29 year old £500k per week. Of United's top earners, one's being paid to play elsewhere and the other wants to leave. More money is not the only answer.

Some more senior players are looking to see if they can improve their last big contract elsewhere. That's an issue but it isn't that catastrophic. Having **** all to spend for a decade has been tough. Now we have the capability to replace players, I expect us to do that more frequently.