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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    Your impression on how Varadkar is perceived to be handling Brexit is completely wrong. The vast majority feel he is handling it exactly right despite the backlash he is receiving from the British press. He has the whole islands interests at heart and everybody I speak to respects him for that. He also has the backing of every country in the EU. They all know how important the backstop is for this island and they and Varadkar have all been consistent in insisting that it stays in the withdrawal agreement, even if it means a damaging no deal for everybody.
     
    #35821
  2. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I'll defer to you on that since your right on the source, and I'm using a British media filter.

    I do feel it's been incredibly easy for the EU to maintain unity to date, not least because the EU negotiators ran rings around Theresa May and her feeble advisors. As I've said, the next couple of months will be a much bigger test for the EU.
     
    #35822
  3. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    if Teresa May's advisors were so feeble, why did Boris vote for the deal?
     
    #35823
  4. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

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    I don’t really see what changes. Despite our ridiculous rhetoric, we need them more than they need us. Their consistency isn’t “intransigence”. It’s just sensible.
     
    #35824
  5. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I think, because at the time, there was real fear it was May's deal or lose Brexit.
     
    #35825
  6. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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  7. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Look at it this way. We get 1. Brexit done so we can move on with reaching trading agreements around the world 2. Keep £37 billion at least until the next round of EU negotiations

    The EU gets nothing but 1. Economic disruption that could push Germany, whose economy is presently fragile, into a recession (we are a BIG customer for Germany) 2. Real difficulties for Ireland (if you believe British media and not Fing) 3 Real prospect of pushing the UK away from European affairs and towards the US
     
    #35827
  8. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    So, a no deal will affect Germany and Ireland so badly that the EU will crack and give Boris what he wants? I would advise you to ignore the Daily Mail and Telegraph propaganda machine. What about the UK? How will a no deal affect the UK? According to the Bank of England, your economy is already on the verge of entering recession. Listen Goldy, face facts. The UK are the desperados in all of this. Your country is facing the cliff edge, not the rest of Europe. If you think trump will be your saviour, think again. He will only do deals to the benefit of the U.S. and the detriment of everybody else. Remember, democrats in the U.S. senate have said they will block any Trump US/UK trade deal if peace in Ireland is affected in any way due to a no deal.

    Wake up and smell the coffee Goldy before it's too late.
     
    #35828
  9. bobmid

    bobmid Well-Known Member

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    Goldy is more of a typhoo man I reckon
     
    #35829
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  10. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Well, you've set out the Remain argument succinctly, Fing, and I've just heard Anna Soubry on TV saying the same thing, and I don't envy you that company.

    And yes, I've heard the democrat threat like I heard Obama telling us we'd be at the end of the queue. I doubt it would be an issue if the UK gives an undertaking NOT to put a hard border in Ireland.

    We haven't got long to wait. Whatever you think of Boris, I don't think he'll fold because he can't afford to. He'd bleed votes to the Brexit Party like a fountain. But on the Germany argument, there are elected politicians looking at this, and their prospects if Germany goes into recession. Personally, I think that it will tell. But not yet. October 31 falls on a Thursday. Expect feverish negotiations and attempts to compromise the previous Saturday. That's my best prediction.
     
    #35830

  11. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Just my cup of tea!
     
    #35831
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  12. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    It has nothing whatsoever to do with remain or leave. That debate finished back in 2016.

    The undertaking is called the backstop, no hard border - ever. If a deal is done, the wording might be tweaked a bit here and there but the concept of the backstop will not be removed completely. That's my opinion.
     
    #35832
  13. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that could mean keeping the UK in the Customs Union forever potentially and curbing this country's rights to enter its own trade deals with other nations. That failed to get through Parliament 3 times, so I think it's dead. Technology is the solution imho
     
    #35833
  14. QPRoma

    QPRoma Active Member

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    Hahaha. And electronic devices will replace hard borders.
     
    #35834
  15. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    There is talk that the technology required may not be available for 10 years.
     
    #35835
  16. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    There's the EU's offer to time limit the backstop then, right there
     
    #35836
  17. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    "may" doesn't mean will. What if it is 20/30/40/50/60 years down the line? The backstop will cover all eventualities.
     
    #35837
  18. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Perfect for the EU. Impossible for the UK Parliament. You can't say May didn't try
     
    #35838
  19. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    Conclusion = defo no deal.
     
    #35839
  20. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I'd say the conclusion is that a negotiated deal is not possible, and WTO is the legal default position
     
    #35840

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