Most of those running mega businesses involving long supply chains etc seem to think it is. What all of them need (business mgt) is certainty. At least with all the imperfections this seems to tick that most important box.
Off Topic Politics Thread
- Thread starter ChilcoSaint
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A general election is not the same as a referendum for goodness sake. We had a referendum and the vote went for out. No matter how you look at it that was the vote. The government of the day has to honour that vote. You just can’t decide because things are difficult we should change our minds........
its exactly the same a general election for goodness sake. you cant just decide that we cant change our minds because its difficult. ( its actually easier though)
So if I understand you right then.....you are saying that if you do not like the way the voting went we should have another vote........is that it? Until you personally get the party you want.
no im saying if the public decides that another way is better then government should be able to follow the will of the people rather than being constrained by an out of date vote.
I don’t see that the vote is out of date how can it be? They are still negotiating based on that vote.
I agree people have not agreed how we should leave. However at this point in time there is no reason to have a second vote on in or out. My view is that if any of the main parties tried to do that at the moment there would be an out cry. I know the remain voters would like that but I truly cannot see it is constitutionally possible. It would probably cause more problems than is necessary if not a revolution.........
youre seriously suggestion there's no chance public opinion has switched 2% since referendum given all thats happened? if there is any chance it has then the poll is obviously out of date.
edit: and the original vote wasnt even binding so your Constitution bit is just bollocks
and i doubt leave votes would cause a revolution over getting a say over what type of leave they will get. i think people generally prefer democracy over tyranny.
It's shambles though Beddy, and there is so much uncertainty from so many people. Its just turned into party politics for the Tories. It's embarrassing. I'm for a proper vote now we are all able to make a grown up decision, and the fantasy brexit has been shown to be the hoax that it is. We can all vote again for what we voted for. I honestly don't think it is undemocratic.
I’m not saying any such thing. I think it was nearer 4% difference but that’s neither here or there......... you have to remember all major parties did not want the exit vote. It was always known it was going to take time to negotiate. Also a notice period had to be given. I won’t say all but most thought it would be difficult to come out either way. They are still negotiating which is what the people originally wanted.....you just cannot ignore the last referendom because you don’t like it. Sorry but there it is......
luckily were ignoring it because its out of date and no longer relevant. saying we are ignoring it because we don't like it is you justifying your own tyranny by making up bullshit.. sorry but there it is.
Oh man no I don’t deny it’s a shambles........... The politions got it wrong by asking for a people’s referendum perhaps. But it’s been had and sadly you can’t just ignore it because you don’t agree......
I’m not trying to justify anything the whole bloody things a shambles and has been handled badly. But you just cannot ignor the referendom. Sorry that is how it stands at the moment ...it is obvious we are not going to agree.....just as others don’t ...but there you go.......all the best to you.....
Impossible to ignore it Beddy, and as a democracy we shouldn't!
Your entire argument is based on your belief of what other people are thinking. people who willlknow what they are thinking a damn sight better than you do. that type of argument is never going to convince somebody.
I'm sorry, but the government can ignore a vote. its very easy,. they just don't do anything. so now that arguments been proven to be factually wrong. what have you got? nothing.
i was hoping you would at least say try and look at if from the other side. because i have done so as the american gun control has this exact issue. they need a super majority to enforce gun controls. should every american with a gun be forced to sell it and ged rid in a decision that could be overturned the next day? i had a hard think about it but my answer is no. americans need to have a firm decision before making the choice that will have a large affect on hundreds of millions of americans that cant easily be undone. so i think america is right that they need a supermajority to change their gun control laws. i think it is too high but thats another matter.
same goes here.
so i am not ignoring the vote i have thought long and hard about it researching the problem in other countries even before coming up with a solution while you are burying your head in the sand relying on an argument that is clearly not even true, especially to me when youre trying to tell me what im thinking!
Of course the government can ignore the vote, because nowhere in the European Union Referendum Act 2015 does it say any government has to do anything. It was purely an advisory vote, a snapshot of what people thought at the time about a vaguely worded question.
Time to let it go, it’s never going to work.
Here’s the Act in full if you’ve never read it:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/36/contents/enacted
Sorry to selectively quote you there Beddy (and change your whole meaning), but that sentence sums up the whole shambles.
We elect politicians to run the country. The problem was they asked the idiots (us) what we should do. Be a bit like Southampton FC coming on here and holding a poll on how to run the football club. Surely we can agree it would end in disaster.....
for me its not that the public were asked to decide. its that the government + experts hadn't created and given the country any actual plans to choose from. they were just asked to guess . and now they have given us plans, we're not allowed to choose between them.
we have no idea whether there's a majority in favor of any of these brexit plans or not.
at least when you have a GE they create a manifesto first.
Yep exactly. The government came to us to say in or out, how about they come to us to how to do it.
You know why they won't? Because we would make a hash of it. One of my favourite expressions is that you don't get a dog and bark yourself, so why the hell would you as an elected government ask the people what to do.
There never should have been a people's referendum. The fact as many (on both sides) have alluded that the main political parties were in the main against leaving probably says it all. We elect them, surely they know what they are doing? Leave them to it. If they get it wrong, every 4 years or so we get a chance to change them. Unfortunately, this will take a lot longer to sort out. The way I feel is that the rest of my adult life will be ruined by this.
You know why they won't? Because we would make a hash of it. One of my favourite expressions is that you don't get a dog and bark yourself, so why the hell would you as an elected government ask the people what to do.
There never should have been a people's referendum. The fact as many (on both sides) have alluded that the main political parties were in the main against leaving probably says it all. We elect them, surely they know what they are doing? Leave them to it. If they get it wrong, every 4 years or so we get a chance to change them. Unfortunately, this will take a lot longer to sort out. The way I feel is that the rest of my adult life will be ruined by this.
Totally agree ...........polititions have been pondering about staying in Europe for decades. I believe it was Blair that was thinking of pulling the plug but was told he couldn’t not without a referendom. He was on the wain then so I guess he decided against it. Going right back when the EU changed things from the common market. There’s has been rumblings but no one had the courage (or stupidity if you like) to do anything about it.
I’m not trying to tell you what you are thinking........I just have different view to how I think democracy works. It really doesn’t matter how I voted or you for that matter. A vote was taken and you can’t ignore it. No political party can. You were saying earlier how that vote was out of date. Truly it is not....hence why they are negotiating based on the original vote.
You mentioned general elections ....well we had one didn’t we.......now they have got to get on with the job in hand. That’s the politions job......... if they call another one so be it.
But calling another general election is not going to end this matter. It still has to be dealt with. Europe was never going to make it easy for us to leave. They are frightened if they do a lot of others will follow. The Dutch for one.......Austria is another Greece is another and the Italians just to name a few. So there is a lot more riding on this than perhaps you think.
There is no doubt no matter which way things go from now there is bound to be controversy either way. If they decide the people should vote on the deal. Then let’s vote....... but on the deal nothing else. Then if the people vote that down they have to try and renegotiate I guess ......but what ever the government comes up with not all are going to agree. That I guess is human nature........
The one thing we all can agree the whole saga is a bloody mess............