Over-achievement

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Oldsparkey

Oldsparkey

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Jan 27, 2011
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Porthcawl Riviera
That's the buzzword about City at the moment - you see it everywhere - "punching above their weight" is another one. Do you regard that as a compliment, or alternatively something of a put-down on the club?

By all accounts the multi-million pound spenders last summer should take this league by storm because they've bought the players to do it, but it's just as important to recognise what it takes to get out of this division as just splashing the cash.

On that basis, the Chairman, CEO , Warnock, his staff and the club players deserve the credit having been previously labelled as probable "also rans".

Currently sitting in 2nd spot in the table, we're obviously well above our perceived status, but in reality who cares. Maybe the media and fans of the teams below us use those terms more in envy than actual praise??
 
It' s a way for managers who have spent 10s of millions to feel better about themselves. If they tell the owners of their clubs that they are doing a great job and would have got the club promoted if it wasn' for some upstarts over achieving........


......On the flip side we could say we've fulfilled our potential and the teams that have spent zillions are underachieving.

Can't imagine those owners and managers wanting to tread that path though.
 
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Got to admit I like us being thought as over achievers and under dogs, it takes the pressure off us and on to our opponents.
 
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Dai Jones said:
Got to admit I like us being thought as over achievers and under dogs, it takes the pressure off us and on to our opponents.
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Agree with this. Keep us out of the lime light and pressure off us. Sod what they say. It's a definite compliment considering we spent next to nothing this season!
 
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Hi Sparkey - don't know if this was at all inspired by my post on the Bristol City forum, but I would definitely take it as a compliment.
 
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NickH said:
Hi Sparkey - don't know if this was at all inspired by my post on the Bristol City forum, but I would definitely take it as a compliment.
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Hi Nick - not necessarily because of your excellent thread over there, but it did make me wonder..........<laugh>

Those stock expressions have been used so many times now I'm beginning to wonder about people's real feelings and motives - I'm talking about media pundits, other managers etc, not individuals on here. <ok>

Out of interest, I see some of your lot reckon you're "punching above your weight". From what I remember about your early season expectations, that seems a bit of a cop out now after your excellent first half of the season. The fact that you haven't pushed on from there seems a good excuse to voice that opinion.

What do you think?
 
Oldsparkey said:
Hi Nick - not necessarily because of your excellent thread over there, but it did make me wonder..........<laugh>

Those stock expressions have been used so many times now I'm beginning to wonder about people's real feelings and motives - I'm talking about media pundits, other managers etc, not individuals on here. <ok>

Out of interest, I see some of your lot reckon you're "punching above your weight". From what I remember about your early season expectations, that seems a bit of a cop out now after your excellent first half of the season. The fact that you haven't pushed on from there seems a good excuse to voice that opinion.

What do you think?
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Similar to the blurb at the top of my thread there, compared to expectations at the start of the season, it's been a very good season, however, given that we were flirting with the top two at the turn of the year, that we're now looking more likely to miss out on the playoffs than reach them, it does seem like a waste of a glorious opportunity.

That said, it's not done yet - we've picked up 7 points from the last three games and should return from the international break with the whole squad available, whereas we've spent the majority of the season with people out. When it comes to the playoffs, it's more about hitting them in good form than whether you finish 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th...
 
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NickH said:
Similar to the blurb at the top of my thread there, compared to expectations at the start of the season, it's been a very good season, however, given that we were flirting with the top two at the turn of the year, that we're now looking more likely to miss out on the playoffs than reach them, it does seem like a waste of a glorious opportunity.

That said, it's not done yet - we've picked up 7 points from the last three games and should return from the international break with the whole squad available, whereas we've spent the majority of the season with people out. When it comes to the playoffs, it's more about hitting them in good form than whether you finish 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th...
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Very true Nick.

Couldn't be a better time to get your whole squad together and push for results to get you into the playoffs. Perhaps even getting back to the style of football that brought you praise in the first half of the season.
 
NickH said:
Similar to the blurb at the top of my thread there, compared to expectations at the start of the season, it's been a very good season, however, given that we were flirting with the top two at the turn of the year, that we're now looking more likely to miss out on the playoffs than reach them, it does seem like a waste of a glorious opportunity.

That said, it's not done yet - we've picked up 7 points from the last three games and should return from the international break with the whole squad available, whereas we've spent the majority of the season with people out. When it comes to the playoffs, it's more about hitting them in good form than whether you finish 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th...
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I must say I thought some of your guys on your forum were pretty casual about the fall off in performances let alone your results since Christmas - it almost seemed an acceptance of the inevitable to me.

Having done so well up until then, there seemed to be a lack of focus about your play. The blame culture usually descends upon the manager and it looks as though Johnson's fans prevously singing his praises have begun to have doubts.

Having said that, you are where you are and the playoffs are well within your grasp. Putting away teams in the bottom half is an essential - no more Sunderland, Bolton and Burton type results will do. If you're going to break back into the top 6, you've got Brentford and Millwall coming up shortly - those must be crucial games because they are both very good sides in their own individual ways.
 
Oldsparkey said:
I must say I thought some of your guys on your forum were pretty casual about the fall off in performances let alone your results since Christmas - it almost seemed an acceptance of the inevitable to me.

Having done so well up until then, there seemed to be a lack of focus about your play. The blame culture usually descends upon the manager and it looks as though Johnson's fans prevously singing his praises have begun to have doubts.

Having said that, you are where you are and the playoffs are well within your grasp. Putting away teams in the bottom half is an essential - no more Sunderland, Bolton and Burton type results will do. If you're going to break back into the top 6, you've got Brentford and Millwall coming up shortly - those must be crucial games because they are both very good sides in their own individual ways.
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I think some feel the need to act for the defence in the face of those that are highly critical and want wholesale changes in the face of a bad run, whereas the truth is somewhere in between. Some reasons/excuses lie in injuries and how the remaining players have succumbed to fatigue, but I'm not sure if our bad luck has been so much more than other teams' to fully justify the tail-off in results.

Though falling out of the playoff spots is definitely disappointing, at least we're still in the fight going into the final stage of the season, so it keeps things interesting.
 
NickH said:
I think some feel the need to act for the defence in the face of those that are highly critical and want wholesale changes in the face of a bad run, whereas the truth is somewhere in between. Some reasons/excuses lie in injuries and how the remaining players have succumbed to fatigue, but I'm not sure if our bad luck has been so much more than other teams' to fully justify the tail-off in results.

Though falling out of the playoff spots is definitely disappointing, at least we're still in the fight going into the final stage of the season, so it keeps things interesting.
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Nick - I agree with the danger of over emphasis on that. I wont bang on about our injury problems other that to say I don't believe any other Championship club has had worse. All teams have injury and fatigue problems - look at our hospital cases - but it's the way the management and their squad reacts that's important.

The first half of the season is always important but it's how you perform in the second half that will win you anything. Points on the board from the first 23 games are always a bonus and provide a cushion against a bad patch. We had ours over Christmas with 4 defeats on the bounce, but we could easily have slid out of contention had we not had the manager and squad we've got to pull it back.

Good luck to you guys - you proved you can play some very good football when things were going for you - now it's time to "grind" rather than "please" if you are going to claim a playoff spot.

I've already mentioned on your thread over there that of the bottom 6 clubs at the foot of the table, there are some grinders who'll battle till the final whistle. A team like Stam's Reading may make the mistake of trying to play themselves out of the drop zone - that could be a big mistake.
 
Saw a bit of the doncaster vs bradford game yesterday. There was a lot of hoof ball in that. Genuine up and under stuff.
 
If we are honest, we HAVE over-achieved compared to where most expected us to finish, this season. Similarly, Bristol city have done the same. The rub is in how the first part of the season performance has continued or not. Someone over there commented that it is a 46 game season and one club may get an 'easier' start and flatter to perform. Of course, we don't know which are the easier games till halfway through. Who'd have thought Sunderland would be a pushover at the start?
But it is team management team ethics and guts and determination that always win out. It's not a beauty parade and big money, badly used will always get caught out.
NW should be recognised as the great manager he is. Maybe only at this level but who knows.
 
Maybe Colin is a great manager (and he is) but also, with the amount of injuries he's had to contend with, his hand has been forced into making changes to the team and playing squad members (32 in all inc Matthew Kennedy who only played 1 minute) thereby keeping some players fresh
That said .... when called upon... every single player (and some married ones) have battled hard for the shirt even when playing out of position.
Another point to note would be that the watching scouts for upcoming matches would be struggling to compile a dossier/report as even NW didn't know who would be fit for the next game.
 
If you believe in over achieving then you must believe there is a natural pecking order in a league and that the final outcome of a season's competition is a done deal before any ball is kicked in anger. I can't see how that can ever be the case simply based on what a club spends or doesn't spend on players. If it were true then what would be the point in any of it.

There is no such thing as a club ending where it should or shouldn't be according to the pundits verdict. You finish where you are because your players and backup did what they are paid to do better or worse than the next club. If every player you have cost £10m and you paid them £20k per week to do their job does not make them play any better. There have been many players over the years who have fallen on their arse at one club and then excelled at another. If you are lucky enough to get the right blend of players together at the same time and they click into a proper unit then success is only around the corner. Otherwise you would never get a Leicester situation. I do think that the old saying in football is true in that the league never lies and you are where you are because you deserve to be there. Lets be honest, if Warnock really believed you had over achieved then you have to ask why he got the players in he did if he thought they weren't good enough to succeed. That wouldn't be doing his job properly would it.
 
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