General Football Thread

[Walsh.i.am]

As I recall, at the time it was said that they knew and respected Moxey from before the appointment, so I think they let the buddy bit get in the way of actually thinking whether he was the person they wanted to work with, could work with and might take City where they wanted to go.

Nail / head once again, wordsmith
The whole post is excellent but I hoiked this bit out as your observations were reinforced in that Times interview when they said "we don't even listen to enquiries, when we step down our nephew Tom will get all our shares".
Because of statements like that, and hiring Moxey largely because they knew him already, this club is in perilous danger of becoming too insular, cut off from reality, 'chummy' - verging on incestuous

 

[canary-dave]

I think the truth is somewhere inbetween. dave is right and wrong about it being foolish to judge an available candidate by listening to fans. If you ignore the fans and their opinions you can lead yourself to an inevitable backlash. It is also churlish to dismiss any experience or feedback about a candidate who you are about to pay a kings ransom. The fans opinion is just not top of the list for assessment criteria.
Plenty of employers now for much lesser jobs will look at a candidates online profile, so at the very least they should have looked at what Wolves fans have said so they could be forarmed with interview questions. (Maybe they did?)
Whether or not he did a good job at Wolves is up for debate, but Wolves did not see fit to sack him for many years so at the very least you would expect an experienced and competent man. However, clearly we were not fully dilligent in our approach of hiring him, very quickly it became clear he was the wrong man for Delia and Michael. Why did they not forsee some of the problems? Perhaps because they are generally useless? As I recall, at the time it was said that they knew and respected Moxey from before the appointment, so I think they let the buddy bit get in the way of actually thinking whether he was the person they wanted to work with, could work with and might take City where they wanted to go. To play devils advocate, an experienced candidate like Moxey may interview very well and then once in the role the awful truth must have come out. Might someone else have seen through his interview? We don't know. But we do know hiring him was a mistake, so good interview or not, it cannot be anything other than a costly mistake.
Moxey was no different to any other chairman, some transfers were good, others bad without looking I doubt his decision making on this was any worse than most.
With respect to McNally, Between him and Bowkett, I believe we had the best team running City. Were they perfect? Of course not, but that doesn't change that it was a predominantly successful stint with the club generally on an upward trejectory. They were a gamble at the time, Moxey was much more of a known quantity and as such, I would think D & M should have known that perhaps he was wrong for them.

Bah!

Good post GM and you are right in the main. I said what I did about not listening to the fans based on our forum here. We have lovers and haters in roughly equal numbers on just about every aspect of our lovely (imo) little club, and by little, I don't mean "little old Norwich!"

 

[JM Fan]

Too right, Sean Dyche is doing a magnificent job.
Just heard (Burnley fan) radio 5 presenter Tony Livesey interviewed &
he pointed out that there are fewer people living in Burnley (73,021)
than it takes to fill Old Trafford (75,635) - just for some perspective of their achievement to date.
Plus the average wage for their players is circa £18k a week - many top PL players earn £18k per day!

I'm sure MANY PL players wouldn't consider getting out of bed for £18k per week!!!!

 

[Walsh.i.am]

Just checked on transfermarkt & according to them both Jarvis and Naismith are still syphoning off the dwindling Carrow Road reserves until the end of June, 2019

 

[Walsh.i.am]

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[ncgandy]

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Didn't we have a designated 'Wes is ****' thread? Where did that go?

I think we all know his day is more or less done, why keep going on about it. He's hardly playing these days anyway. I refuse to applaud some bod on twitter stating the bleeding obvious.

 

[Walsh.i.am]

I think we all know his day is more or less done, why keep going on about it. He's hardly playing these days anyway. I refuse to applaud some bod on twitter stating the bleeding obvious.

I trust you read the well reasoned argument that prompted the tweet in the first place?

 

[canary-dave]

Didn't we have a designated 'Wes is ****' thread? Where did that go?

I think we all know his day is more or less done, why keep going on about it. He's hardly playing these days anyway. I refuse to applaud some bod on twitter stating the bleeding obvious.

I trust you read the well reasoned argument that prompted the tweet in the first place?

As I said above, we have lovers and haters

 

[ncgandy]

I trust you read the well reasoned argument that prompted the tweet in the first place?

I did, and there was nothing there I didn't already know.

I guess it's more that I'm amazed how many times he's referred to on here (I don't use twitter), in a detrimental way. I'm more interested in the poor quality players we've been landed with more recently.

 

[General Melchett]

Good post GM and you are right in the main. I said what I did about not listening to the fans based on our forum here. We have lovers and haters in roughly equal numbers on just about every aspect of our lovely (imo) little club, and by little, I don't mean "little old Norwich!"

Having lovers and haters surely means we have at least a reasonably balanced set of opinions. we are not all devided on all things, I don't think there is one of us on here who thinks that Delia et al haven't made mistakes, we just differ in how we see the best way forward for our club. Webber is a case in point, I think most were excited by his arrival, where I like this forum is that I think inspite of a tough period, most/all on here are still behind the appointment and the new direction, go to the pinkun and that isn't so.
I think if i were a rival club looking at hiring a current or past city member of staff a site like this would be a half decent why of getting a balanced and moderately sensible feel for the person.

Bah!

 

[canary-dave]

Having lovers and haters surely means we have at least a reasonably balanced set of opinions. we are not all devided on all things, I don't think there is one of us on here who thinks that Delia et al haven't made mistakes, we just differ in how we see the best way forward for our club. Webber is a case in point, I think most were excited by his arrival, where I like this forum is that I think inspite of a tough period, most/all on here are still behind the appointment and the new direction, go to the pinkun and that isn't so.
I think if i were a rival club looking at hiring a current or past city member of staff a site like this would be a half decent why of getting a balanced and moderately sensible feel for the person.

Bah!

So if it is evenly split between lovers and haters, which side would you take in making your decision?

 

[General Melchett]

So if it is evenly split between lovers and haters, which side would you take in making your decision?

neither definitively, both sets of comments would be added to the dossier of information, if any raised concerns about an appointment then look to gain more info, test the validity of the assertions. Be diligent in turning over each stone.

Bah!

 

[canary-dave]

neither definitively, both sets of comments would be added to the dossier of information, if any raised concerns about an appointment then look to gain more info, test the validity of the assertions. Be diligent in turning over each stone.

Bah!

It's still not enough to make a decision on. Let me give you an example, Carrowcanario rates Jerome highly for all the work he does, JM Fan rates him poorly because of his poor conversion rate, so they are both right and both wrong so you have learned diddly squat

 

[goldeneadie]

A lot of people are diddly squat experts.

 

[canary-dave]

A lot of people are diddly squat experts.

I'm not having a go at anyone, I'm just saying it as I see it

 

[General Melchett]

It's still not enough to make a decision on. Let me give you an example, Carrowcanario rates Jerome highly for all the work he does, JM Fan rates him poorly because of his poor conversion rate, so they are both right and both wrong so you have learned diddly squat

In a players instance, I would expect that a buyer/Scout would be fully aware of those traits. If they weren't then it would give them something to look at for when reviewing videos of him playing, its a pointer nothing more. The scout would have access to stats too, but opinion of the quality of chances he's missing may help to put some flesh to the stats. Add to that that whilst you have some polar opinions but many in the middle and it can be viewed as a relatively balanced information source. If then you get everyone unilaterally against someone (Wolves Moxey) then maybe you should be very aware there is an issue.
As an example, whilst CC rates him for work rate he isn't saying that he rates him for finishing, that is kinda in concensus with JM F, JM F mearly see's the finishing as more important than just work rate. Going beyond that, if they read a little more and looked at how Nelson has also faired they would see that we see a team that is not creating good chances, not scoring and not playing in a way that suits either/any striker. I think that those sort of insights might be helpful even if as fans it would be viewed with only moderate thoughts of reliability.

Bah!

 

[canary-dave]

In a players instance, I would expect that a buyer/Scout would be fully aware of those traits. If they weren't then it would give them something to look at for when reviewing videos of him playing, its a pointer nothing more. The scout would have access to stats too, but opinion of the quality of chances he's missing may help to put some flesh to the stats. Add to that that whilst you have some polar opinions but many in the middle and it can be viewed as a relatively balanced information source. If then you get everyone unilaterally against someone (Wolves Moxey) then maybe you should be very aware there is an issue.
As an example, whilst CC rates him for work rate he isn't saying that he rates him for finishing, that is kinda in concensus with JM F, JM F mearly see's the finishing as more important than just work rate. Going beyond that, if they read a little more and looked at how Nelson has also faired they would see that we see a team that is not creating good chances, not scoring and not playing in a way that suits either/any striker. I think that those sort of insights might be helpful even if as fans it would be viewed with only moderate thoughts of reliability.

Bah!

All fair points GM, by the way, I think CC rates Jerome mainly for the fact that we defend much better when he plays! I have to admit though, I'm with JM Fan on this point. The main job of a striker is to strike and at the very least make the keeper work, I also had the same opinion of Robert Rosario, yet I have seen many defend him, mainly on the view of one (1) super strike!

 

[JM Fan]

In a players instance, I would expect that a buyer/Scout would be fully aware of those traits. If they weren't then it would give them something to look at for when reviewing videos of him playing, its a pointer nothing more. The scout would have access to stats too, but opinion of the quality of chances he's missing may help to put some flesh to the stats. Add to that that whilst you have some polar opinions but many in the middle and it can be viewed as a relatively balanced information source. If then you get everyone unilaterally against someone (Wolves Moxey) then maybe you should be very aware there is an issue.
As an example, whilst CC rates him for work rate he isn't saying that he rates him for finishing, that is kinda in concensus with JM F, JM F mearly see's the finishing as more important than just work rate. Going beyond that, if they read a little more and looked at how Nelson has also faired they would see that we see a team that is not creating good chances, not scoring and not playing in a way that suits either/any striker. I think that those sort of insights might be helpful even if as fans it would be viewed with only moderate thoughts of reliability.

Bah!

<hitsnailonheademoji>
To be fair, at least with the return of Pritchard, we did see Basil test the keeper twice in open play (plus a glaring miss in the first half just after the Owls scored!!), so maybe things are on the up.
Edit - I won't be totally convinced until after we've played Millwall on 1st Jan!!!

 

[KIO]

All fair points GM, by the way, I think CC rates Jerome mainly for the fact that we defend much better when he plays! I have to admit though, I'm with JM Fan on this point. The main job of a striker is to strike and at the very least make the keeper work, I also had the same opinion of Robert Rosario, yet I have seen many defend him, mainly on the view of one (1) super strike!

You're forgetting Rosario's sublime finish in added time against Millwall in the Zenith Data Systems Cup almost 27 years ago to the day

I'm joking of course the ball literally deflected off his @rse for the equaliser, City going on to win 6-5 on pens aet.

I remember it well because me and my Sis were part of the 4,741 in attendance that night and it was bl00dy freezing, the coldest I've ever felt at a football match. We stood on the lower River End terrace and were looking forward to going home when that goal fecking went in , we had to stay still the bitter end 'cause that's what you do when you're a true fan ain't it???

https://www.11v11.com/matches/norwich-city-v-millwall-19-december-1990-291072/

 

[canary-dave]

You're forgetting Rosario's sublime finish in added time against Millwall in the Zenith Data Systems Cup almost 27 years ago to the day

I'm joking of course the ball literally deflected off his @rse for the equaliser, City going on to win 6-5 on pens aet.

I remember it well because me and my Sis were part of the 4,741 in attendance that night and it was bl00dy freezing, the coldest I've ever felt at a football match. We stood on the lower River End terrace and were looking forward to going home when that goal fecking went in , we had to stay still the bitter end 'cause that's what you do when you're a true fan ain't it???

https://www.11v11.com/matches/norwich-city-v-millwall-19-december-1990-291072/

Of course you have to stay till the end, I know you are a proper supporter and that is why you get so passionately wound up when things go wrong, whereas I'm just a cool, laid back sort of a guy