Bruce out..?

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RLB's Beautiful Face

RLB's Beautiful Face

Well-Known Member
Jan 28, 2011
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Norfolk
It looks like the bruce out brigade has gathered a lot of momentum in the wake of the derby defeat, and I must say it seems like an overreaction to me..

Up until yesterday everyone was well pleased with Bruce. Now on the back of one game he's an inept failure?

While I wasn't happy with the result obviously, I don't think Bruce is all to blame - he put out the same squad that drew with a very strong Liverpool side at Anfield, and actually had the better of the game in the second half. This makes sense to me. Yes Larsson on the right isn't ideal but all he can do is use the players he has. Considering Larsson's goal last week from that position, again it makes sense.

You can say he should have been more attacking but this formation has been working, and the only way he could be more attacking is to play Wickham or Ji, both unproven in the PL, and both very young. I'm of the opinion that he was right not to chuck them into the derby, especially how well we played last week without them, it was fair enough in my opinion to think they wouldn't be needed. I must admit I'm of the mopinion Gardner should have started but it's very close what with how well young Colback has played recently. I don't think it was completely unthinkable to play the lad.

We bossed the first 25-odd minutes of the game and imo were the stronger team right up until the mags managed to get a goal out of nothing. It happens, I again don't understand how people can blame Bruce so vehemently.

If we'd have got a goal in the first 60 minutes there was only one way that game was gonna go in my opinion. It's a shame that gyan had such a shocker for whatever reason, but again, it happens. I agree we should have another striker, but we don't know a) what funds Bruce has available or b) what the market is like. He can only buy players which are available, if there's noone going there's noone going. It sucks but it's the way it is. Bruce has acknowledged the need for a striker and a lw so I'm sure he is trying but if there's noone available for the funds he has been given what can the man do?

Yes after the goal went in we sort of fell to pieces but, whilst I'm obviously not thrilled about it, it is understandable. To concede quite late on, in a local derby at home, desperation is bound to come into play. We all know how much this game meant to Bruce and the players. People have said "Bruce has no plan b, and his plan a isn't very good either", well I disagree, plan a WAS working, there only looked like one team who was going to win that match right up until the mags pulled a goal out of nowhere. If we'd have stuck to playing our game I daresay we would have pulled one back, but everyone panicked, including Bruce. After a few minutes he felt he would have to be seen to be trying to do something so he just threw all our strikers on with gardner and hoped we would pull a goal out of somewhere. This, imo was quite unprofessional (although, again, understandable), and he should have stuck to his guns, but then if that hadn't worked he'd have been torn to shreds for not playing the young strikers. The bloke can't win.

So all in all, I don't think he made any real cockups, it just wasn't our day, it happens and we move on. Based on the performance yesterday I'm still confident we're the better team and will finish above the mags, but unless we can bring in a top striker / lw Europe is most certainly not on the cards. Hopefully Bruce can convince Ellis to put his hand in his pocket but if he's not willing to then there;s not much Bruce can do about it. Calling for his head at this point is imo ridiculous, though.

I don't post on here much and I know that was a bit of a wall of text but I wanted to get it off my chest!
 
Oh and I forgot to say, if anything Bruce's biggest mistake is keeping Catts as captain. Yesterday proved to me that the lad just isn't ready for that sort of responsibility yet. When the goal went in and everything started to get scrappy the captain should be the one to calm everyone down, get the team to focus on our game, and keep playing the way we know we can. Instead, he was the biggest offender in terms of panicking. He was the best player on the pitch by a mile for me until that goal went in, at which point, as much as I hate to say it, he turned into the scrappy thug the mags all think he is. He's clearly not mature enough for the role yet, we need someone who can lead by example...
 
I agree with your post on some points but bruce is clearly a manager who is reactive not proactive. apart from the first 20 mins we didnt look like scoring. gyan can not play the single striker role in the premier league as he is not strong enough and for me we play too many high balls into him and sess which is unbelievable. imo 10 mins into the second half when the game was going nowhere bruce should have brought on gardener (who should of started imo) to add a bit of drive to the midfield. another reason im not part of the bruce fan club is the fact that he has spent a very large chunk of his transfer budget on a 18 year old striker with no pl experience and who is clearly one for the future but sunderland at the moment are not a club who can spend that much cash for someone who cant do the job now i would of rather he spent that cash on a striker who can help gyan and take the increasing pressure off him. no doubt the result against liverpool was a great one especially at anfield but this was a derby game at home and it cried out for 442 but without that proven striker we were always going 4411 and it backfired and reading todays papers the prospect of the welsh numpty from man city looks more plausible which could upset the bond the young squad may have.
 
"Everyone was well pleased with Bruce!"
I don't personally know anyone who that statement would stand with, and I'm talking 30 to 40 guys long time season ticket holders.

I also don't personally know anyone who rates Richardson any where he plays.

Catts and Sess were our best players yesterday.
 
Bruce out..?
It looks like the bruce out brigade has gathered a lot of momentum in the wake of the derby defeat, and I must say it seems like an overreaction to me..

Up until yesterday everyone was well pleased with Bruce. Now on the back of one game he's an inept failure?
Click to expand...

This Bruce out thing is not new, it was always simmering away underneath. For some time last season this feeling was known and aired by many here, it was mearly suppressed, due to the signings.

The match against the mags was a disaster for us, and this brought the feelings of many back,

It is going to be there for a long time.

You have your Bruce supporters, of which i'm one.

The middlemen, who are giving him time.

The non Bruce supporters, who may change if he actually played an attacking team in games like this.

Then the Bruce is a mag **** him off, even if we won the league.

But the way i see it, is it's gonna be harder for Bruce to get people on his side, rather than against him.

I support Bruce, for now, but there is only so much you can take, but while SNQ and ES support him, i'll give him the benefit.
 
I'm not convinced that Bruce has the nous to be a top level Premier League manager but I'm not one to say get rid because he is a Geordie and we have lost to the unwashed at home;my opinion may well change if we don't get anything out of the Brighton and Swansea matches.
What does concern me is the fact that he persists with Ricco at Left Back-he hasn't got a clue about defending;if he can't do the job we bought him for then move him on.I am not making him a scapegoat but he doesn't utilise the talent that he has.
I'm looking forward to tomorrow night and you lads making the long trek down here will have a good night.
 
newtonlee2 said:
He lost me last year and his signings this summer are steady rather than fantastic. Bruce out!
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Don't think you guys had a choice really. With the players you sold and the players you lost from loans you were pretty much building a squad instead of just adding quality to an existing squad. in that situation, the budget had to stretch much further. I think you guys could have had a top quality 11 if you could have afforded to spend 30mill on only 2 or 3 players, but Bruce had to fill too many gaps with the budget he had.

This step had to be taken imo because you guys relied so much on loans last season. This summer might have just seen a lot of steady buys, but at least you have a full squad of your own players now.
 
Chappaz said:
Don't think you guys had a choice really. With the players you sold and the players you lost from loans you were pretty much building a squad instead of just adding quality to an existing squad. in that situation, the budget had to stretch much further. I think you guys could have had a top quality 11 if you could have afforded to spend 30mill on only 2 or 3 players, but Bruce had to fill too many gaps with the budget he had.

This step had to be taken imo because you guys relied so much on loans last season. This summer might have just seen a lot of steady buys, but at least you have a full squad of your own players now.
Click to expand...

Behave chappaz, you're making far to much sense...
 
The thing with Bruce seems to be that he picks a team that 90% of Sunderland fans would not. Yes he's the manager, Yes we think we can pick a better team. Before the derby everyone sitting one around me saying. Why is ?? playing, he should be doing that, Why doesnt he change it round a bit and in the whole everyone agrees.
When I trundle out of the match and bump into a mate, the first thing he said was (almost word for word) what we had been saying before the match.
When I bump into some one else in the pub he says the same thing and so on.
The fans can see it pretty obviously. Bruce cannot. WHY.
Richardson cannot be in that team.
We should not be negative at home. Two defensive centre midfielders.
Two out and out strikers against a bottom third team at home.
Play players in their correct positions.
 
Moorsleymountainman said:
The thing with Bruce seems to be that he picks a team that 90% of Sunderland fans would not. Yes he's the manager, Yes we think we can pick a better team. Before the derby everyone sitting one around me saying. Why is ?? playing, he should be doing that, Why doesnt he change it round a bit and in the whole everyone agrees.
When I trundle out of the match and bump into a mate, the first thing he said was (almost word for word) what we had been saying before the match.
When I bump into some one else in the pub he says the same thing and so on.
The fans can see it pretty obviously. Bruce cannot. WHY.
Richardson cannot be in that team.
We should not be negative at home. Two defensive centre midfielders.
Two out and out strikers against a bottom third team at home.
Play players in their correct positions.
Click to expand...

<ok>

Even put over so eloquently I fear the pro Bruce guys will pick holes.
None of us saying these things would claim to be Premiership Manager material.
But we should be capable of spotting someone else who isn't too.
 
Moorsleymountainman said:
The thing with Bruce seems to be that he picks a team that 90% of Sunderland fans would not. Yes he's the manager, Yes we think we can pick a better team. Before the derby everyone sitting one around me saying. Why is ?? playing, he should be doing that, Why doesnt he change it round a bit and in the whole everyone agrees.
When I trundle out of the match and bump into a mate, the first thing he said was (almost word for word) what we had been saying before the match.
When I bump into some one else in the pub he says the same thing and so on.
The fans can see it pretty obviously. Bruce cannot. WHY.
Richardson cannot be in that team.
We should not be negative at home. Two defensive centre midfielders.
Two out and out strikers against a bottom third team at home.
Play players in their correct positions.
Click to expand...

I'm one of the 'giving him time' crowd i guess, and your post here sums up exactly why i'm not 'Bruce in'.

He has done a lot of good for the club, and to jump the gun after 2 games is crazy IMO, but the 'square pegs , round holes' approach simply has to stop.

Playing Sess as a striker, for me, achieves nothing, as Sess drops deep looking for the ball anyway and powers forward with it, all we are doing is leaving him no outlet to give the ball to other than Gyan once he's made these runs.

Sess would create as many chances to shoot for himself from midfield, he hits them clean so if we had Gyan and A.N.Other up front, they culd get onto rebounds off the keeper, on Saturday, there was noboby to do this, and no option for Sess but to go it alone.
 
Bruceys Beak said:
I'm one of the 'giving him time' crowd i guess, and your post here sums up exactly why i'm not 'Bruce in'.

He has done a lot of good for the club, and to jump the gun after 2 games is crazy IMO, but the 'square pegs , round holes' approach simply has to stop.

Playing Sess as a striker, for me, achieves nothing, as Sess drops deep looking for the ball anyway and powers forward with it, all we are doing is leaving him no outlet to give the ball to other than Gyan once he's made these runs.

Sess would create as many chances to shoot for himself from midfield, he hits them clean so if we had Gyan and A.N.Other up front, they culd get onto rebounds off the keeper, on Saturday, there was noboby to do this, and no option for Sess but to go it alone.
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A plus point for me from the game was how well Sess handled himself under pressure and showed he is strong enough to stand his ground.
He brushed past Tiote and Barton on a couple of occasions as if they were lower league players. (And before the Mugs start I do think they are both good footballers when on their game.) He even did them both at once on one occasion that stood out.

One of my worries about him was his small stature, just goes to show how appearances can be deceiving. <ok>
 
MackemsRule said:
A plus point for me from the game was how well Sess handled himself under pressure and showed he is strong enough to stand his ground.
He brushed past Tiote and Barton on a couple of occasions as if they were lower league players. (And before the Mugs start I do think they are both good footballers when on their game.) He even did them both at once on one occasion that stood out.

One of my worries about him was his small stature, just goes to show how appearances can be deceiving. <ok>
Click to expand...

He's just a wonderful talent MR, i'll put my hands up and admit he's way too good for us.

He could play for pretty much anyone.
 
Sess looked so good. If someone else, a Gyan, Gardner or whoever hits goalscoring form we could be in for a good spell.
 
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