Off Topic General Election Special

[Leon...]

John McDonnell - communist. Seams Milne- communist. Andrew Murray - communist. There may be more but I don't take an active interest in politics.

Deffo for the best that you remain in ignorance.

You into Icke and stuff like mindedt? Comes across like that.

 

[Building 7]

Spread.

I was told but the head of category of a major supermarket chain that margarine does not exist in U.K. supermarkets.

I've done 5 mins research on floragate.
Margarine is primarily made from vegetable oil. Flora is primarily made from vegetable oil, but 'healthier' because it contains less fat that margarine. When I worked in food manufacturing , fat was relatively expensive. Ergo Flora is a cheapened version of margarine but once in the hands of Marketing ****ers it becomes a premium product.
Stick to butter and you won't go far wrong.

 

[Spook]

Maybe I am politically illiterate- I certainly don't read any books or manifestos, and switch it over when a party political broadcast comes on.
Some people are not really literate at all, and have no time for party politics. But they can spot a phoney or a bullshitter a mile off.
Which is what Corbyn and co are. None of em done a 'day's work' in their lives, have no affection for or connection to the 'working classes' - they have nothing in common with them.
What motivates Corbyn and his coterie is a move to what they see as 'socialist' governments like Cuba, East Germany or in the case of Seumas Milne, Soviet Russia.
They love the abstract concept, the idea etc ...but the actual rank and file people of Britain are of no interest to them. It's all about attacking the rich, the Establishment, the Church, the Forces, the Monarchy...all the big building blocks of our country (for right or for wrong). They have spent most of their adult lives protesting about them, trying to undermine them , doing their best to be a spanner in the works.
Which is fair enough.
But they appear to be utterly incompetent, unreliable, irresponsible, inexperienced and lacking in any kind of meaningful expertise in anything which a top level politician might actually need. They are unworthy of office and not fit to run any country, let alone ours, which is the best in the world.
It beggars belief than anyone can have any faith in them to deliver one iota of what they espouse - put simply, they are utterly incapable of government. It's depressing that so many people see them as having 'integrity' or being a 'breath of fresh air'. They've finally ditched Abbott, after one carcrash interview and porky about 'not being well' too many. What kind of group would have someone like that at the top of it?

Bewildering.

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[City Man]

You're right. Easy meat for anyone.

But in Britain, virtually all the print media are controlled by right wing interests.

TV too.

The BBC is **** scared of the Cons - and struggles to remain impartial. All of their political commentators I can think of, are right wing too.

It's stacked against anything else.

I raise you QT & HIGNFY as being left of centre. Hislop is given his own little soapbox every week.
Plus the BBC News, Channel 4 news.
Dunno about Ch 5- I only watch the football on it.

 

[City Man]

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Cheeky ****.

That was before I had some dental work done.

 

[Off The Line]

I reckon that makes me like 98% of the population, in that I don't digest the official sanitised party versions and prefer to make my own mind up on what I see/ hear first hand, and after many decades on this planet.

That's why Hull voted Brexit, despite the Corporation and our 3 MPs slavishly following the Remoaner line.
Real life experience> toytown Trot theory.

It's interesting as to how many of the recent conversations I see are along the lines of -

'Did you go to University'?

'Me? I went to the University of life mate'.

'Did you now'.

 

[Edelman]

I reckon that makes me like 98% of the population, in that I don't digest the official sanitised party versions and prefer to make my own mind up on what I see/ hear first hand, and after many decades on this planet.

That's why Hull voted Brexit, despite the Corporation and our 3 MPs slavishly following the Remoaner line.
Real life experience> toytown Trot theory.

To make the points you made I would suggest that you do take notice of politics.
There's no way we could ever be dragged back to the days of mass strikes no matter who gets in.
James Callaghan wanted to work with the unions in the 70s to resolve matters quicker but the unions refused it because they virtually ran the country.

 

[Leon...]

Think it was as much a 'up yours' to Westminster as Brussels.

The alleged financial benefits never trickled down to the hoi polloi, all we got was static wages and more competition for jobs.
Loved it.
Best political event for decades.

I think you're right.

Obviously, I want a Labour win. But part of me (a big part) would like the Cons to win with a reduced majority/ideally no majority.

Brexit is a poisoned chalice, whoever gets it (like a Labour minority even) is in serious, serious trouble.

Trust me, it's going to smash the Cons like the Irish question did.

We've alreadfy seen that May is a "a blowhard who collapses at the first sign of gunfire" by a one-nation Tory

 

[Fez]

If you were to tear up the way everything was set up and start again, then the Scandinavian model is probably the one you'd go for, but it's obviously not that simple.

There is a completely different mentality there, along with a very different set of circumstances.

The gap between the highest paid and lowest paid is much smaller, which is a good thing, but they're very small countries to manage, with a very outward looking attitude and decades of building to where they are now (they didn't have to build from a position of being country decimated by war, which ended up covered in sprawling council estates and integrating millions of people from its colonies and all sorts of other factors)

British businesses usually concentrate on building businesses in Britain, which expand beyond our shores if they're successful. In Denmark, they think very differently, because Denmark is so small, they see their market as Europe not just Denmark. With a small population and a great deal of income generated from outside the country, their model is a far more practical proposition.

Germany is a slightly different situation, unlike us, they managed to maintain a manufacturing business by moving into manufacturing premium goods and they remain a massive exporter of goods internationally. While they were building VW/Audi, Mercedes, BMW and Porsche into worldwide premium car brands, we were merging all ours into a nationalised industry making utter ****e that nobody wanted.

You left the bit out about them not having a sponging underbelly of benefits scroungers; otherwise good post.

 

[Off The Line]

The British Broadcasting Corporation didn't even write an article about Corbyn's rally in front of 10,000 people. Not newsworthy apparently. Imagine if it was May?

 

[City Man]

“Can spot a bullshitter a mile off”

Not very precise is it? How does one measure/prove that?

No it's not very precise, but more often than not such folk are extremely canny judges of character and are adept at spotting phonies.
Bosses, salesmen, politicians, do gooders...and anyone else who claims to be 'on your side'.

 

[Leon...]

The British Broadcasting Corporation didn't even write an article about Corbyn's rally in front of 10,000 people. Not newsworthy apparently. Imagine if it was May?

She only does rallies that are populated with special selects or parachuted-in activists.

 

[Leon...]

No it's not very precise, but more often than not such folk are extremely canny judges of character and are adept at spotting phonies.
Bosses, salesmen, politicians, do gooders...and anyone else who claims to be 'on your side'.

I wish it were so.

 

[Fez]

What is everyone's opinion on changing Human Rights? And their civil liberties being 'attacked'?

I have seen a lot of rubbish about this on my Social Media feeds about us needing to defend our civil liberties and this idea of changing Human Rights laws to stop terrorist is a terrible idea. I would happily be watched on every street in the UK if it stopped one more child from dieing due to a terrorist attack. It really doesn't bother me if I am watched all day long as I am doing nothing wrong.

Going by social media they seem to think the complete opposite to me, and I wondered if I am crazy...

I can share your sentiment, but I would not embrace the principle. It sounds freat, until it is another form of terrorist doing the watching.

 

[Building 7]

A Chinese friend of mine once said he had an election for two days. I didn't know what the hell he was talking about.

 

[Leon...]

I raise you QT & HIGNFY as being left of centre. Hislop is given his own little soapbox every week.
Plus the BBC News, Channel 4 news.
Dunno about Ch 5- I only watch the football on it.

QT crowd can sometimes be left of centre. Dimbers though isn't and you get your fair share of Tory plants in the crowd too.

Can't stand HIGNFY so don't know mate.

Ch5 doesn't count anyway.

Sky - Dandelion and Murdoch - enough said.

 

[Obadiah]

Maybe I am politically illiterate- I certainly don't read any books or manifestos, and switch it over when a party political broadcast comes on.
Some people are not really literate at all, and have no time for party politics. But they can spot a phoney or a bullshitter a mile off.
Which is what Corbyn and co are. None of em done a 'day's work' in their lives, have no affection for or connection to the 'working classes' - they have nothing in common with them.
What motivates Corbyn and his coterie is a move to what they see as 'socialist' governments like Cuba, East Germany or in the case of Seumas Milne, Soviet Russia.
They love the abstract concept, the idea etc ...but the actual rank and file people of Britain are of no interest to them. It's all about attacking the rich, the Establishment, the Church, the Forces, the Monarchy...all the big building blocks of our country (for right or for wrong). They have spent most of their adult lives protesting about them, trying to undermine them , doing their best to be a spanner in the works.
Which is fair enough.
But they appear to be utterly incompetent, unreliable, irresponsible, inexperienced and lacking in any kind of meaningful expertise in anything which a top level politician might actually need. They are unworthy of office and not fit to run any country, let alone ours, which is the best in the world.
It beggars belief than anyone can have any faith in them to deliver one iota of what they espouse - put simply, they are utterly incapable of government. It's depressing that so many people see them as having 'integrity' or being a 'breath of fresh air'. They've finally ditched Abbott, after one carcrash interview and porky about 'not being well' too many. What kind of group would have someone like that at the top of it?

Bewildering.

Corbyn comes across to most people who will vote Labour tomorrow (and many that won't) as decent, sincere and a man of principle. He is offering the electorate the opportunity to vote for a fairer, more caring society and this explains why 10,000 people stood in the rain to hear him speak in Gateshead. Why 5,000 heard him in Hull. The majority don't care he spoke to Sinn Fein or even the IRA, that war is over and peace in Northern Ireland is universally seen as a good thing. The Tories will do their best to get Sinn Fein back into a power-sharing government if re-elected. All the newsprint about Corbyn will not stop a Tory government handing the North to Eire to get a Brexit deal if that's what it takes. The protestant working class will find they no longer matter and will be Ireland's problem not Great Britain's.

Corbyn promises more police on the street, more for anti-terrorism work and will stop selling arms to Saudi Arabia, which funded terrorists in the past and may still be doing so. May promises more control of the internet and a reduction in all our civil liberties whilst ignoring intelligence from abroad that Islamic extremists coming into Britain could be planning attacks.

We may disagree but I don't think Corbyn is heading towards a socialist government like Cuba, East Germany or even the Soviet Union. The railways are a mess as is the national grid and both need major investment. That investment will be cheaper to acquire if they are nationalised. The Tories can only attract investment for the national grid by promising mega profits for decades to the Chinese and French. Same with the railways. Business will have to meet those costs as well as facing demands for bigger pay rises from its employees to pay for higher gas and electric prices. The same for the railways. Higher rail fares have to be paid for out of wages, especially in the South East, thereby eating into profits.

Corbyn's programme isn't that much different from Blair's in my opinion. It just feels different.

I would say the national Labour campaign has been, with one or two exceptions, professional and competent. More so than the Tory campaign.

 

[Leon...]

A Chinese friend of mine once said he had an election for two days. I didn't know what the hell he was talking about.

Ba-dum tish.

 

[Off The Line]

No it's not very precise, but more often than not such folk are extremely canny judges of character and are adept at spotting phonies.
Bosses, salesmen, politicians, do gooders...and anyone else who claims to be 'on your side'.

It's well known that if people are told something often enough they'll start to believe it.
The London School of Economics did a study and found that Corbyn's policies were only correctly presented by the media 11% of the time, the Daily Fail and Telegraph were at 0%

 

[City Man]

She only does rallies that are populated with special selects or parachuted-in activists.

Unlike Corbyn??!?
Both sides favour the drugged goons holding up sloganed placards as a backdrop, as if they're gushing believers in the message.

Such stage managed **** will not wash with Johnny Public, whatever the party.
I missed Corbers' big day out at Zebedee's Yard but the gushing fawners and hyper zealots I saw on telly and in paper do not seem in any way present in the normal everyday working life of our great port city.
To use a line from Eleanor Rigby, "...where do they all come from?'