Rival watch

[Spurlock]

Pep and Jose are in their first season with their clubs, Klopp has had a little longer. Doesn't it bother you that as bad as they all have been they are still quite close to you at this stage of the season.
I expect all three teams to improve next season, can you ?

This season we were supposed to finish 5th if we had a good season...6/7th was the accurate prediction. We were supposed to be rivaling Everton....maybe Pool, but they are Pool and were set for a glorious season like every season. The country was a Pep/Jose jizzfest, the rest of us were pondering whether to bother turning up. Then there is Arsenal, when there is Arsenal...you might as well discount 4th spot,it belongs to them by rights for 21 years of successive failure in the CL. Then we got Chelsea..a championship winning team who couldnt be arsed but everyone knew had it in them. Everyone was supposed to strengthen..we missed our chance against Lesta..the big boys were on their way back to take their rightful places...fast forward a year

Sat 10 points ahead of 3rd and 4 points off the top with 5 games to go......so no im not worried.

Arent you worried that Spurs dont have an endless pit of money like your club....yet they still manage to challenge? Most consistent team in the PL over the last 2 seasons....not a one night stand like Lesta's..this one looks like a healthy relationship.

 

[crackerman jack]

This season we were supposed to finish 5th if we had a good season...6/7th was the accurate prediction. We were supposed to be rivaling Everton....maybe Pool, but they are Pool and were set for a glorious season like every season. The country was a Pep/Jose jizzfest, the rest of us were pondering whether to bother turning up. Then there is Arsenal, when there is Arsenal...you might as well discount 4th spot,it belongs to them by rights for 21 years of successive failure in the CL. Then we got Chelsea..a championship winning team who couldnt be arsed but everyone knew had it in them. Everyone was supposed to strengthen..we missed our chance against Lesta..the big boys were on their way back to take their rightful places...fast forward a year

Sat 10 points ahead of 3rd and 4 points off the top with 5 games......so no im not worried.

Arent you worried that Spurs dont have an endless pit of money like your club....yet they still manage to challenge? Most consistent team in the Pl over the last 2 seasons....not a one night stand like Lesta's..this one looks like a healthy relationship.

This post is worthy of more than one like from me Spurlock!

I was listening to Talksport last night after the match and all that Andy Goldstein could say when Cundy was saying Spurs and Chelsea were miles ahead of city and united was that we haven't won anything.

It's such a joke when you look at our resources and what we are doing compared to the Manchester clubs. So what if we don't win anything, it doesn't mean that we aren't a better side than United.

 

[Spurlock]

This post is worthy of more than one like from me Spurlock!

I was listening to Talksport last night after the match and all that Andy Goldstein could say when Cundy was saying Spurs and Chelsea were miles ahead of city and united was that we haven't won anything.

It's such a joke when you look at our resources and what we are doing compared to the Manchester clubs. So what if we don't win anything, it doesn't mean that we aren't a better side than United.

Did you hear that fan trying to say he would rather have the league cup and 5th over where Spurs are...United fans, not all...but many are really struggling to come to terms with their new found status in the English hierachy of football. Its strange but in the last few years English football royalty has started to take the Mickey mouse cups seriously and their seems to be alot more hype about these cups again...i wonder why

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[crackerman jack]

Did you hear that fan trying to say he would rather have the league cup and 5th over where Spurs are...United fans, not all...but many are really struggling to come to terms with their new found status in the English hierachy of football. Its strange but in the last few years English football royalty has started to take the Mickey mouse cups seriously and their seems to be alot more hype about these cups again...i wonder why

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Yeah I did. I don't normally listen but thought I would listen to the feedback to see if united fans are happy with where they are right now.
Amazingly some of them were. How they are playing is very similar to us under AVB. Really poor football and hovering around 5th.
But we weren't happy with that and this is the mighty Manchester United we are talking about!
At the end of the day if they win the europa league along with the league cup then fair play. But for me it papers over the cracks when they were being bigged up as title contenders pre season with all the millions they spent.
I'm sure they will do the same again this summer and Mourinho will be heralded as some manager God for making little old Man U title challengers again.

 

[vimhawk]

If the Manchester's don't win it, it's because they "are in transition" or some similar excuse - because nothing can be allowed to get in the way of their ENTITLEMENT to the top. And hundreds of millions later (again, again), if they finally get it right, then the managers will be praised for their brilliance. Meanwhile, despite the evidence of this season, before last nights match TalkShite were still bigging them up, and suggesting more than once that next year's title will be a straight fight between the Manchester clubs. You can also be sure that regardless of our performances over the last couple of years, we will be no better than fourth favourites for the title (maybe fifth).

 

[The RDBD]

Pep and Jose are in their first season with their clubs, Klopp has had a little longer. Doesn't it bother you that as bad as they all have been they are still quite close to you at this stage of the season.
I expect all three teams to improve next season, can you ?

Jose is PL experienced, has a huge transfer/wage budget, and has effed it up.
He has got his usual defensive regime working, but the attack is poor.
This is the reason why he is only 10 pts behind Spurs, but over 20 goals behind on GD.

Pep has more potential excuses to make about his squad, but only that.
Nobody forced him to sign Bravo etc AFAIK.

 

[The RDBD]

If the Manchester's don't win it, it's because they "are in transition" or some similar excuse - because nothing can be allowed to get in the way of their ENTITLEMENT to the top. And hundreds of millions later (again, again), if they finally get it right, then the managers will be praised for their brilliance. Meanwhile, despite the evidence of this season, before last nights match TalkShite were still bigging them up, and suggesting more than once that next year's title will be a straight fight between the Manchester clubs.

This is the second "decline" phase of a league empire I have seen in my lifetime.
Whether Man Utd will go the way of the Poool, I know not.
But if it does happen, I will be nowhere near as surprised as I was around
1997-8 (he Poool had still not returned back to their former glory) .

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

Moronho says that Aguero was "smart" in getting Fellaini sent off.

Last time I checked, it wasn't "smart" to walk into a headbutt. Quite the opposite in fact.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

Fake news headbut. The footage has been doctored. Justice for Marouane!

Mark my words, next game their remaining players will be wearing tracksuits bearing the 'oppressed one's' name like The Mousers did for 'Racist Suarez'

 

[SpursDisciple]

I am the real Mrs RCL and so is my wife.

I've heard these things go on in the suburbs.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

I've heard these things go on in the suburbs.

I'm under strict instructions to stay schtum. I invoke my 5th Amendment privilege on the grounds that anything I say may serve to incriminate me.

 

[Citizen Kane]

Pep and Jose are in their first season with their clubs, Klopp has had a little longer. Doesn't it bother you that as bad as they all have been they are still quite close to you at this stage of the season.
I expect all three teams to improve next season, can you ?

We will improve as long as we can keep this group of players together. Out of our main group of 18 in our strongest match day squad, only 5 can be said to have reached their peak, and 2 of those are goalkeepers.

We are like a fine wine, maturing with time and age.

City don't worry me whatsoever. Pep has strengthened them in the only way he knows how, because it is the way he relied on throughout his career: on the attack. Defensively, they are shambolic and more or less need an entirely new back line (GK, CB, LB, RB). Sure, they can afford whoever they want. But Pep's handling of the Hart/Bravo situation shows his lack of knowledge about defensive strength.

Liverpool, whether they like it or not, also need an overhaul. Here again, Klopp has now had 3 windows to address their gaping flaws but has failed to do so despite massive financial backing. They need a new GK,CB,LB and DM as well as a proper out an out ST. What makes you assume he will magically get it right 4th time lucky?

It is also worth noting that of all the big 6, Pool are closest to us in terms of transfer fees and clout, especially since our recent wage hike following CL qualification. We have been scuppering their transfers for years now (Dempsey and Siggy spring to mind). So again, I'm not worried about them.

As for United. Mourinho's arrogance will remain your one true shortcoming, as it was at Chelsea. Of all the managers you have cited, he knows the league inside out back to front and was also fully aware of the flaws at United having played against you while managing Chelsea. His arrogance has led to an inherent distrust of youth and over-reliance on 'his veterans'. You are the only big club aside from ourselves producing home-grown talent. It has always been a mark of pride for United since the Busby era. Under Mourinho, that talent will rot on the bench at best.

On paper, United have the most balanced squad of the 3 teams you've mentioned. Miserly at the back, strong in the midfield and with an array of wide options and attacking talent. Of all the big teams, given the experience of your manager, you should be doing much better than you are. Again, Mourinho's stubborn, paranoid nature will be your undoing. Ultra-conservative, mind-numbingly boring tactical choices as soon as he feels the heat (see last night for a prime example of this). These were the same tactics that got him sacked from Madrid, the same tactics that got him sacked at Chelsea. Again...what makes you think that the old dog will learn new tricks? Your performance against Chelsea proved how dangerous you are when the shackles are released. So why not play like that all season? Fergie managed it.

So in conclusion: excellent attempt at a wum, but the past 3 seasons have demonstrated that we have nothing to fear.

(Apart from playing all of our home games at Wembley )

 

[PleaseNotPoll]

I expect all three teams to improve next season, can you ?

People said this last season.
We improved and they didn't.

 

[yossarian]

Pep and Jose are in their first season with their clubs, Klopp has had a little longer. Doesn't it bother you that as bad as they all have been they are still quite close to you at this stage of the season.
I expect all three teams to improve next season, can you ?

I think next season could be a step back if we're playing at Wembley but i'd love to be proved wrong.

 

[BobbyD]

We will improve as long as we can keep this group of players together. Out of our main group of 18 in our strongest match day squad, only 5 can be said to have reached their peak, and 2 of those are goalkeepers.

We are like a fine wine, maturing with time and age.

City don't worry me whatsoever. Pep has strengthened them in the only way he knows how, because it is the way he relied on throughout his career: on the attack. Defensively, they are shambolic and more or less need an entirely new back line (GK, CB, LB, RB). Sure, they can afford whoever they want. But Pep's handling of the Hart/Bravo situation shows his lack of knowledge about defensive strength.

Liverpool, whether they like it or not, also need an overhaul. Here again, Klopp has now had 3 windows to address their gaping flaws but has failed to do so despite massive financial backing. They need a new GK,CB,LB and DM as well as a proper out an out ST. What makes you assume he will magically get it right 4th time lucky?

It is also worth noting that of all the big 6, Pool are closest to us in terms of transfer fees and clout, especially since our recent wage hike following CL qualification. We have been scuppering their transfers for years now (Dempsey and Siggy spring to mind). So again, I'm not worried about them.

As for United. Mourinho's arrogance will remain your one true shortcoming, as it was at Chelsea. Of all the managers you have cited, he knows the league inside out back to front and was also fully aware of the flaws at United having played against you while managing Chelsea. His arrogance has led to an inherent distrust of youth and over-reliance on 'his veterans'. You are the only big club aside from ourselves producing home-grown talent. It has always been a mark of pride for United since the Busby era. Under Mourinho, that talent will rot on the bench at best.

On paper, United have the most balanced squad of the 3 teams you've mentioned. Miserly at the back, strong in the midfield and with an array of wide options and attacking talent. Of all the big teams, given the experience of your manager, you should be doing much better than you are. Again, Mourinho's stubborn, paranoid nature will be your undoing. Ultra-conservative, mind-numbingly boring tactical choices as soon as he feels the heat (see last night for a prime example of this). These were the same tactics that got him sacked from Madrid, the same tactics that got him sacked at Chelsea. Again...what makes you think that the old dog will learn new tricks? Your performance against Chelsea proved how dangerous you are when the shackles are released. So why not play like that all season? Fergie managed it.

So in conclusion: excellent attempt at a wum, but the past 3 seasons have demonstrated that we have nothing to fear.

(Apart from playing all of our home games at Wembley )

Pretty balanced but i think teams with their managers in the 2nd season will improve (this is a response to your thing, not Diegos half wum)

Conte is a bit of a one off. Scrap that add Ranieri.

Guardiola is an unknown entity. Guy only knows how to attack and had joined teams that were ready made and dominating. Whether he can get the defence right with another splurge is another matter.

Klopp i think you are being a little harsh on. Whilst it's partly his fault in terms of not strengthening his team/squad for whatever reason, he's not really spent much net or bought in that many players. Also even though they are battling for 4th, that's an improvement on last year. I agree with your assessment that they need a lot of new players in many positions (or a change in tactics).

Mourinho we will see if he will improve them. But united were dire last season and they've been creating a lot more this season even if they've not been scoring much and are playing out bore draws in the big games. One thing about him though, I think since porto, every 2nd season he's had at a club, he has improved them and won the league. I think it's a bit unfair to say because he played against them, he should know the players and the team. Not even Poch performed miracles on the Spurs team having played against them as the Soton boss.

Not sure about the comment about Mourinho knowing the league back to front means anything. He's always done things his own ways and i think he's suffering a bit of Wengeritis in that they are not evolving with the new tactics.

Anyway lets get this season over with first!

 

[SpursDisciple]

I think next season could be a step back if we're playing at Wembley but i'd love to be proved wrong.

The Wembley thing is a psychological problem. Poch needs to build confidence and they should be fine. In theory it is harder to park the bus on a bigger pitch and should work to our advantage.

 

[BobbyD]

The Wembley thing is a psychological problem. Poch needs to build confidence and they should be fine. In theory it is harder to park the bus on a bigger pitch and should work to our advantage.

That's true. Conversely you could say it's harder to press a team on a bigger pitch as theres more space for them to dribble into/pass the area into.

Who knows what this Wembley hoodoo is all about!

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

While the press are happy to keep going on about our Wembley hoodoo, they somehow seem to overlook quite a few facts coming from this season...

1-2 vs Monaco: at the time that result looked like an utter disaster, especially considering how easily we swatted Monaco aside in the Europa League last season - but with their scoring three goals in every single one of their knockout games against Dortmund and City, does this result really look as bad now as it did at the time?

0-1 vs Leverkusen: while there's no denying that we were utterly shambolic in this match, as the team decided that night was the perfect night to remind the fans of that joyous period where Jacques Santini was our manager and passing the ball forwards was verboten and punishable by having a whistle blown at you in training every time you tried to do something positive with the ball, it's still worth pointing out this fell smack dab in the middle of the period where our form stuttered due to Kane's injury - a fact that's always overlooked

3-1 vs CSKA Moscow: otherwise known as The Narrative Smasher, as not only does this result mean we won a match at Wembley (which doesn't fit in with the whole talk of a Wembley hoodoo) but given we came from a goal down to lead by half time before comfortably seeing the game out it also boots the idea of having a mental block down the stairs

2-2 vs Gent: the worst thing to happen to Portuguese football since that evening where, after a bottle of Moscatel, Mr & Mrs Mourinho felt frisky and forgot about using birth control happened to be the referee for this match, and there's reasons why Benfica fans called a fatwa on him

2-4 vs Chelsea: Martin "Cyclops" Twatkinson was in charge of the match, and unsurprisingly this led to ninety minutes of one team getting yellow cards for standing on the wrong blade of grass while the other team were allowed to kick, stamp and elbow their opponents with impunity until it was far too late for a booking to mean anything (see also: Manchester United vs Chelsea back in October, or the Manc derby from last night)

In other words, our Wembley hoodoo mainly consists of getting ****ed over by incompetent refs, coming up against teams having their best season in over a decade, and the team's domestic form carrying over to European competition against opponents who were more than capable of exploiting it. Is that really a hoodoo, or is it something the press have made up and hope nobody points out the gaping holes in their logic?

 

[PleaseNotPoll]

Who knows what this Wembley hoodoo is all about!

I do.
We face very good sides there and keep either leaving important players out or being forced to.
We also concede from virtually every shot on target, even managing to go one better against Gent when down to 10 men.
They had one shot on target. We conceded twice.

 

[littleDinosaurLuke]

Spurs are now a settled side, playing a style which suits the players available.
Your overall squad depth is questionable, but when the first XI players are fit and in form, it's not a concern.
The club has done well in improving young players, who might not have been given the same opportunities elsewhere (Walker, Rose, Dier & Kane could all have been discarded when they looked flawed initially).
Add to that the excellent recruitment of Lloris, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Alli, Dembele, Wanyama, Eriksen & Son (all of whom should have attracted the attention of clubs with deeper pockets) and a very strong group of players has been assembled, who perform as a team.

Utd have spent a lot of money and do have a big squad of good players.
But there is no settled formation or tactics and the players are not used to playing together as a team.
This season Ibrahimovic has been both a blessing and a curse. His individual ability and goals have been invaluable at times, but his lack of pace has forced the team to play in a certain play. He becomes the focal point, but the slower tempo with the emphasis on retaining possession in front of the opposition can make for some turgid play and negates the skills of the young, raw talent Mourinho has at his disposal. Mkhitaryan doesn't fit into this style either.
The defence looks solid because they have a top class 'keeper behind them and the slow possession game means that they are rarely exposed to the threat of players running in behind them (which they probably would be if Mourinho played a more expansive game, which allowed Martial and Rashford to run with the ball more often). I don't think Ibrahimovic will return. Griezmann seems to be heavily linked. Can he score goals and link up play with Rashford and Martial?

Liverpool and Arsenal have significant weaknesses - the same shortcomings - which are never addressed season after season.
It would probably take four or five of the right signings at £100M+ to cure their problems.
I can't see that happening.