Match Day Thread Vs Crystal Palace (H)

I agree, Klopp looked at the squad thought we were doing ok and decided to go with it, hindsight is wonderful as they say but I doubt many were looking at the January window when we were riding high in November/December.

 

Not denying that we didn't have a better team to begin with. I was just questioning about this big old rebuild, most of the team was already here which he then turned them around rather than us rebuilding the squad.

 

Serious question here... if you fail to get top 4 this year would you say Klopp has failed this season?

 

You think we are close to a first 11? I'm don't.

 

To be fair, the first 11 has shown it can match any team in the Premiership in head to head even with lousy fullbacks and no
strikers as such. The bench yesterday was a joke though and the lack of back up players has crippled the season. Maybe fatally.

 

We need a super sub in our squad. We have no one at the moment.

 

We're still on course for 70+ points this season which is still a massive improvement on recent years.

 

Yes. That's the job. Is it a fatal failure? No more than if a Mourinho, Guardiola or Wenger fail to do the same. There's a larger picture you take into account.

As others have said and I've said before: Klopp was clear he'd give the existing squad the benefit of the doubt. That was never going to just be half a season. I think the probationary period is over though and a lot of the current players if they stay will end up 3rd choice.

Big transfer window though..

 

He gave himself four years to win the league, he is going to have two years left after October. Can he win the league next season?.

 

Balanced response.

I agree about him saying he'd give the squad a chance, but given where you were before the new year I think it would poor to not make CL this year, espescially without Europe.

Also think he made some odd decisions in the transfer market this season, both in Summer and January.

Agree it's a huge summer for you and a big season for him next too.

We'll have a say it in yet, with all of you, United & Arsenal to play.

 

Not sure about that..first 11 in its variations has struggled against bottom 10 clubs. Both at the front breaking these teams down and in mid-field and at the back in keeping out what is the predictable tactics these teams will always employ.

And while not as tangible in comparisons I don't think a lot of this first 11 have spine or balls ...they either look lost and panicky when it isn't going the right way or seem to shrug.

Not enough bastards in it.

 

I'm still very happy with him as manager but it would be a poor season if at this point we don't get top 4. The word failure? I would say he failed as many have to understand the FA Cup and that you cannot play a group of kids in this competition, he's also failed to recognise the deficiencies within the squad and address them, he was of the opinion that his coaching and system would make the proverbial silk purse from a sows ear. He was wrong.

As Frank says "big transfer window", we as fans don't want him to continue with an old midfelder at left back, we don't want him to try and turn Moreno into Roberto Carlos, we don't want to wait for Sturridge to be fit! We don't want to wait for Lovren to pull his head out of his arse. If Klopp cannot see that what he has is simply not good enough then he'll start to feel the pressure.

 

Hmmm, I was with you up until that point. If we don't get CL again (and it's probably 75/25 that we won't now), then I think Klopp won't get his/FSG's first choices, and that means he'll do a Wenger and not buy much at all.

Anyway, after 12 hours kip - I needed it as I've just finished a week of earlies - I'm refreshed and less knckered now, so I'll do a sort-of balanced team rating:

Migs: 6 Did nothing wrong.

Clyne; 5 Really dire going forward this season, and his defending is now at the levels of Johnson.

Milner: 6 Did some good stuff going forward in the first half going forward (the pass to Windy was sublime). Non-existent in the second.

Lovren: 3 Jesus, every bit as bad as when we first bought him. The flop header against Townsend in the run-up for the corner that led to their second was almost comical. Probably was to our rivals.

Matip: 5 What happened to the player of the first half of the season? We're dragging him down to our level. Mind you, I wonder what happen to Beckenbauer or Moore if they played next to Lovren/Klavan/Lucas each week. I also wonder how he would have flourished next to Sakho or a defender bought/loaned in January. Even a Caulker, ffs.

Can: 4 Disappeared for most of the game, but his missed chance and his woefulness at the corner for the second goal makes me think he didn't disappear enough. A poor man's Tom Huddlestone, and that's when Can's at his best. Makes me remember Paul Stewart, and I really don't want to.

Lucas: 5 Bless him. A five yard pass to Clyne in the second half that he managed to put out of play sums up a Brazilian who has the touch of a giant Amazon sloth.

Windy: 5 He never does anything brilliant, but that's okay because he's normally everywhere doing something, much as Ronnie Whelan used to do. Yesterday he could have nipped down to Tesco and done the weekly shop, waled the dog along Crosby beach and nipped into the Albert for a pint and he still wouldn't have been missed.

Ford: 7 Brilliant free-kick, irrepressible in the first half, tired in the second, AND SHOULD HAVE GONE DOWN FOR A PEN! We'll miss him dreadfully next season, more than Suarez, I'd say.

Origi: 5 Missed a relatively easy header to make it two-nil (it didn't go over his head, look at it again), and spent the second simply running into defenders. Certainly not ending this season as strongly as last before that injury in the derby. At his best, not much better than N'Gog.

Firmino: 5 A few trics every now and then, but bottled a challenge one-on-one against their goalie. Consistenly inconsistent, in an ideal world he'd be on the bench as an option, not our plan A, B and C.

Team: 5 When we were one up it was stick or twist to go for another or ensure we didn't concede before half time - but why should going for another make us vulnerable? It always does against teams at this level though, doesn't it?

Jurgen: 5 I'm sure he'll make some snide comment about crowd, or maybe how we would have won the Treble had we not had injuries, but though he's more likeable than Bron, the defence isn't any better than the halcyon days of ****ing Skrtel. Note - if you decide certain players are out (and you have the right to, for sure) it might be an idea to replace them in some way.

 

Hang on.
I really don't want to seem overcritical but how is this hindsight? Did we (more importantly the management) not know that Mane was going to go away for the African tournament ? Has he not shown that he is critical to the team by scoring crucial goals and that without him we struggle? Hindsight: how is it possible that our performances in the FA and League Cups and our early elimination from those not shown to the management that our squad need reinforcing and that we were using inexperienced kids?

Yes, we and others outside the club hierarchy may not have been looking at the january window but is it not the job of the manager to preempt injuries and build when we are on a high?

Sorry to be slightly negative but these excuses are not really logical

 

Fair enough. I was thinking that if the first 11 can be unbeaten against the so called "top 6" it must be capable of competing in the league. The collective failure to react to the defeats by the so called lesser teams both during games and in subsequent games against teams playing in a similar way is just that, a collective failure. Management, players, owners.

 

Absolutely. Not hindsight at all - we knew Mane would be gone for a month, we knew Ford was injured, we knew we had a two-legged semi to play, we knew we had the FA cup (three games, as it transpired), and we knew we were playing Uniturd and Chelsea. As far as I can see, only one person didn't know this, or possibly was restricted by the board. I suspect the former.

 

As I said in November/December we were playing well, we did not know how much of an affect Mane leaving would have because we were scoring from all over the park so it is hindsight, same with the cups they were in January and at this point we're thinking all it's fine until it wasn't. Think back and remember how we were all looking at winning the league until January came and went. I'd agree with you though that regardless Klopp should be looking at what was available to him going into a busy period and maybe brought in one or two but there again I'm saying that with hindsight.

 

'We all'? No we ****ing weren't! Sorry to be a miserable pessimist, but I was far from being the only one who, though excited about our fine December, was saying that Mane going and Ford being out would mean a hectic January. I started off the season saying fifth at best, but by Christmas, and especially after the City result, I thought top four was nailed-on. Never thought we'd win the league unless Chelsea imploded, and with their squad there was little chance of that, compared to ours. But lots of us, on here, in the papers and on the telly, expected Jurgen to shore up the squad with loans and some of the money we never spent in the summer. I certainly expected us to be in the position Spurs are now, and it would be us waiting to see if Chelsea slipped.

If there were any doubts about this, we knew, having seen the team against Plymouth, that we needed signing or to recall some loans. All of this was said at the time, Luv. It isn't hindsight at all.

 

Yeah fair enough, not all thought that way but I'd say a fair few of us were happy enough and only slightly concerned with Mane leaving but generally thinking it would all be ok.

 

The scum still have city arse and spuds. Bad results yesterday, but it's by no means done with yet. ****ing grow some