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2017 " revolution "

Discussion in 'Ipswich Town' started by Westlake33, Jun 17, 2017.

  1. San Diego

    San Diego Sir Mediator
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    Spence over Josh for me.
    Getting Josh out on a season long loan will be beneficial for his development. I still don't think he'll make it as a RB, he'll end up being a CB.
    I have much more faith in Kenlock putting in consistent decent performances than Josh at this point.
     
    #21
  2. Scowey

    Scowey Well-Known Member

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    My take on the signings so far, purely on the initial face of the deals and before they have kicked a ball

    Spence [6/10] - Solid appointment to bolster the back line and provide continuity after doing well last season
    Garner [5/10] - Not inspiring but could go on to be a shrewd signing. Purely on the face it, not one to get excited about
    Huws [8/10] - Shows some intent from ME & MM and a good bit of PR for the club in bringing in a player all the fans were crying out for
    Celina [7/10] - Exciting young prospect from a big club, looks like he could add some excitement
    Adeyemi [7/10] - Another solid signing and a possible upgrade on Hyam (a definite upgrade on Dougie) and adds some athleticism to the midfield


    Overall, it seems that we are making strides by adding some power and pace in areas that we have been short of, in particular the midfield looks a lot more dynamic and has some much needed depth (at this stage, before anyone leaves)

    It also looks like we'll be playing with a higher tempo this season and possibly looking to press higher up the pitch, which makes the Pitman exclusion all the more understandable as he has never been able to offer what Murphy did in terms of energy. If we bring in a couple more (and don't lose any first team players) then I expect we'll at least see some football that is less offensive and nauseating to watch.. we may even see some good attacking football from time to time.
     
    #22
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  3. Nuggets

    Nuggets Well-Known Member

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    Like Scowey, I am optimistic about our transfer dealings so far. Celina, Huws, and Adeyemi are good midfielders who will enhance our quality and provide us with better options than Coke, Douglas etc from last season. I'm also glad Spence is back. He's a good squad player and should ensure that Chambers will get used in the centre. I am unsure on Garner, who does not have a prolific scoring record in the Championship, but then if he gets good service, maybe he'll find his scoring boots like Murphy before him? I'm also relieved to see a lot of the deadwood from the squad has been trimmed, this should free up a significant portion of our wage bill, which I presume will continue to be filled by making more signings.

    The priority is another striker and a winger. We need somebody who can score regularly because Garner and Sears don't look like they have the consistency to do that in this division, and McGoldrick is aging and injury-prone. We struggled for goals last season, so I presume we're getting rid of Pitman (who's on the transfer list) and then bringing in one, maybe two more? Somebody with Championship experience would be a good shout. I don't think Dominic Samuel (the lad from Reading who was on loan here) is the right option, as I wasn't impressed with what I saw from him. In terms of wingers, we have Celina, Ward, and Rowe, so I think we could do with another there.

    As for the central midfield, I think that Hibs midfielder McGinn would be a good buy, but Tunnicliffe would only make up the numbers. We have a fair few central midfielders now, Skuse, Hyam, and Adeyemi for the more defensive options and then our attacking options are well stocked with Huws, Bru (out of favour, I know), Bishop, Dozzell, and then Ward can slot in if necessary. If we bring in another central midfielder, then I can only assume we're moving out Bru and either Skuse or Hyam.

    I think we could do with another centre-back in support, as Berra, Digby, and now Taylor have left. We could still bring Taylor back, if he finds fitness, but I don't think we'd get many games out of him. However, his experience and presence did provide some assurance to our back line last season. I'd like us to keep hold of Emmanuel, if only to challenge Spence, because the only other alternative would be Luke Chambers and he deserves to challenge for a centre-back spot now.
    Kenlock and Knudsen are fine, I'd sell the latter to Wolves for a couple of million, but I think they've signed another left back now.

    Overall, my concern is not so much the quality of the squad, but whether McCarthy can implement the talent in an attacking, consistent style of football. Last season captured Mick's most negative aspects of his managerial style: the long-ball, overly conservative style of football, playing the favourites, and antagonising sections of the fanbase. If we're not going to possession-based and attacking, then fine. But at least set us up in the counter-attacking style of football that teams like Leicester and Chelsea have used to devastatingly effective use of late.

    My line up would be:

    GK Bart

    RB Emmanuel
    CB Chambers
    CB Webster
    LB Kenlock

    RM Celina
    CM Adeyemi
    CM Huws
    LM Ward

    ST Garner
    ST Sears
     
    #23
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  4. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    Agree completely Nuggets been relatively pleased with Micks transfer dealings so far (Well over the past 2 years or so) but that's not the problem.

    I have to say I'd be happy if Pitman was given another go with someone like Garner up top. Given his game time he's been a pretty consistent goalscorer throughout his career but he's been unfortunate here in that Mick tried to use him as Murphy's replacement when he's not a target man. Why sell a fairly consistent goal scorer and try to get someone in who hasn't got that record?

    I hope Mick now starts playing to his players strengths oh and sells Skuse!!
     
    #24
  5. Scowey

    Scowey Well-Known Member

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    My guess is that there are a couple of factors in Pitman leaving:
    1: He doesn't hustle and harry (occupy) defenders and is more comfortable playing a slower tempo.. Which, looking at our additions we are looking to play with a lot more intensity and higher tempo this coming season, something more like our 14/15 team that served us so well and would be a welcome change.
    2: He probably is on one of the highest wages at the club, therefore not worth the weekly outlay for someone who won;t be contributing an awful lot

    I'd like to think that Skuse at least has some real competition for his place now as Mick has openly stated before that when he's fit he'll play. But after a disappointing season and being another year older Mick at least looks as if he's got some alternatives, especially as Skuse has the same issue as Pitman in slowing the tempo down to a crawl far too often.
     
    #25
  6. Westlake33

    Westlake33 Well-Known Member

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    Joe Royle may have been brave enough for such an attacking side with no stopper in the centre however Mick isn't. Not many would be, I'd certainly want one defensive body in there especially with 3/4 very young defenders. Would be a very interesting side to watch though!

    For me, if Celina is going to start and play wide left where Mick's hinted he's hoping and we play with a proper winger down the right with two forwards, we probably will need a firm base at CM to allow the front four the freedom to be progressive. I don't know how Bishop / Dozza in particular would fare however I'd imagine if that were the case Skuse would play along with a new strong CM.

    Appears we're going to play a much higher tempo, forward press team this term and Pitman just doesn't fit the mold sadly.
     
    #26
  7. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    To be fair Mick picked some pretty attacking sides last season, we just didn't play very attacking or good football.

    Over the past couple of years he's built a team with more attacking technical player unfortunately that hasn't transpired into how we actually play. Last season we had probably the most technical attacking team we've had under Mick yet we still played the same boring hoof ball football. Before that we had a far worse team but players who actually wanted to play that style of football so it was relatively effective
     
    #27
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  8. Westlake33

    Westlake33 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed - last summer we certainly added ball players and it appeared on the surface our style would change from being quite so direct. The " style of play " from last season was never going to work with the personnel - especially when no replacement ( sorry Leon Best but you were a disgrace ) came for Murphy.

    Provided we keep a Mr Webster fit for the full campaign and he performs well but not well enough for a massive bid come January that alone should certainly encourage us to play more footy. Mr Skuse - you will certainly be given the ball more out of defence. You certainly will need to do a hell of a lot more this term should you continue to be an automatic pick.

    Looking at the players signed - Garner I have in mind as being a semi battering ram but the three midfielders signed certainly will want ball to feet. Not seen Spence in a town shirt but always liked the looks of him going forward for others. Surely we'll attempt to play more footy with the players at our disposal this term.
     
    #28
  9. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    Oh dear,if we're to rely on Skuse bringing the ball out of defence and "starting" our attacks we're truly f'ed,more chance with the hoofed ball forward:emoticon-0114-dull:
     
    #29
  10. Westlake33

    Westlake33 Well-Known Member

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    He simply has to do a lot better in that department. I think Mick will expect more from Cole considering the attacking players he's assembled. That said, I thought the same last year. Even the year before with Niles / Fraser I thought " here we go Cole, I've defended you and said you need pace / movement and you'll thrive " yet from a distribution stand point, no, absolutely not.
     
    #30

  11. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    Having watched almost all our home games over the last three seasons (barring the odd tin pot cup games which I refuse to stump up for any more) I could count on the fingers of one leprotic hand the number of times he's brought the ball out of defence with any real purpose. From what I've seen it's just not in his skill set!
    Invariably when he comes back towards the defence he just pings the ball back to where it came from for the poor defender to then launch it upfield hopefully.
     
    #31
  12. Nuggets

    Nuggets Well-Known Member

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    I think Adeyemi could play the Skuse role, and play it a lot better. He is a box to box midfielder, comfortable on the ball, has an eye for a good pass, and is a quicker athlete.
     
    #32
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  13. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    I think that's optimistic thinking. Going on past form from Mick I would imagine he'll say to the team, we've got lots of creativity in there now just let them do all the work and let Skuse just break things up and keep tight.
     
    #33
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  14. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    I think it's in his skill set, it's not in his mindset
     
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  15. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    Completely agree, Hyam can play that role also. For me though you don't necessarily need a DM why not play with 2 CMs who cover each other like we used to play?

    Midfield is an area Mick has coached particularly poorly in his time here.
    Skuse is a joke, Hyam he's tried to play in a more attacking position which he isn't suited to, I'm not saying he should be used as an out and out defensive midfielder because he can do more than that but if played he should be used as the most defensive midfielder.

    I don't have alot of faith in Mick to sort this out, I'll never forget the fact that he changed one of the best goalscoring midfielders in the Championship into a crap DM (Tommy Miller)
     
    #35
  16. Westlake33

    Westlake33 Well-Known Member

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    While he's good going forwards he's not a defensive lad. I would say we need one very disciplined CM for sure as we're potentially going 4-4-2 with the likes of Kenlock/ Spence going from fullback ( potentially our most balanced back four in a long time and an actual RB ) which should add assists, with very inexperienced players in wide midfield. Definitely need an old fashioned #6 to hold everything together in my opinion. Alongside I would love a Matty Holland type, a goal scoring CM to ping the ball around. We've had many a gash CM partnership now for a good period of time - needs to be upped.

    Tommy Mller may have scored goals but I don't think he added an awful lot otherwise - a less bad Keith Andrews who bar his 10 goals in 19 games for us was like playing with 10 men half the time.

    Regarding Hyam - never been a massive fan however when properly fit he's worth having. I was actually amazed he was offered another contract, he would have gone if I was at the helm to be totally honest.

    * EDIT - Could Huws / Skuse be the combination, and where would that leave Dozza and Bishop?
     
    #36
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
  17. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    You're right with Tommy Miller but Mick took away the one thing he actually was good at
     
    #37
  18. Westlake33

    Westlake33 Well-Known Member

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    Bar the 04/05 season, the only good thing Tommy Miller was good at was penalties! Absolutely unreal spot kick taker - oh and scoring vs Preston. Our Nugent if you like! Maybe I'm being harsh but I wasn't his greatest fan.
     
    #38
  19. davy

    davy Well-Known Member

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    For what it's worth guys, I always liked Adeyemi at Leeds, and he has the odd goal in him too.

    Good luck with the new term, you're a proper Championship club with a proud history looking to re-establish yourselves, just like us.
     
    #39
  20. johnnywarksmoustache

    johnnywarksmoustache Well-Known Member

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    I've read that Tom Lawrence is subject to a £7 Million bid from Derby!!

    It would have been a perfect opportunity for Evans to show some ambition by signing him! <doh>

    But no lets keep rummaging around in the bargain bin!
     
    #40
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