Match Day Thread World Cup Watch

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lazarus20000 said:
They need to be encouraged to move abroad, but English people are petrified of leaving England. It's this whole english-centric view which is so damaging to our country and gets in the way of growth.
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i've said for years the International team would benefit from more of our players going abroad.
The PL clubs won't encourage youngsters to go though as they will worry that they will want to stay .
 
Swedish_Air 2 said:
i've said for years the International team would benefit from more of our players going abroad.
The PL clubs won't encourage youngsters to go though as they will worry that they will want to stay .
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You blame them. Italian teams will want to buy them for 2 pints of lager and a packet of crisps the cheap ****s.
 
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moreinjuredthanowen said:
you are right there. This world cup only starts now. We just played two **** sides then put out b team. None of that is a test so irrespective of what has gone on so far england can't be said to have fallen short nor can it be said they are looking good.

Columbia looked a decent outfit to me. James made them play a lot better in match 2 but there is nothing there to fear for me.

Same for swiss and sweden. In many ways thats familiar territory and while the swiss are the better side england should at least match them for pens.

Even costa is more familiar territory for england in terms of a bruiser up top.

it all boils down for me to walker, stones, maguire.
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Maguire is a liability, Stones is 50/50, only Walker there who looks like he knows which way is up.
 
jenners04 said:
You blame them. Italian teams will want to buy them for 2 pints of lager and a packet of crisps the cheap ****s.
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English players have skewed our market. Why should they carry an extra premium? Most of the time they are inferior to the foreign player yet cost more!
 
lazarus20000 said:
Clubs like City and Chelsea are not helping by hording the best English talent and then have them rot on the bench. At least with clubs like


English players have skewed our market. Why should they carry an extra premium? Most of the time they are inferior to the foreign player yet cost more!
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We are talking Italian teams ffs.

Cheap ass ****ers.

Unless selling of course. You agree with their valuations then :bandit:
 
jenners04 said:
Southgate will come out of this good either way.

He has the excuse the media will give him of building for the future.

We learnt nothing from Belgium game and will start cold again Tuesday when it matters.
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hodgson got the same.... that first tournament he skated by.

in fairness the parallels are startling.

that was euro 2012 . england got an "ok" group but it was not that easy. ukraine, sheva was on his last legs, sweden (****) and france. beat sweden 3-2 in a mess of a game then go out on pens to italy after a bore draw in QF.

Looks great til you remember the details

then there's 2014 and england are out in group pathetically and then euro 2016 the iceland debacle.

so..... really Southgate can skate by but REALLY now is the time to seize the moment and really go for it.
 
lazarus20000 said:
We let him go because he was injury prone and wasn't good enough. The fact that rumours are saying he'll be joining Fenebache shows his true skill level. Another over hyped English player.

It's not like we didn't give him LOADS of chances. We even farmed him out for a season long loan at Bournemouth but he was just decent and nothing more there.
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not even any decent. Was inconsistent and imo average for you boys.

Bournemouth started him but benched him in the latter half of their season before he got injured.

It speaks volumes that even on a free transfer, none of the big clubs or even the mediocre clubs fancy picking him up
 
moreinjuredthanowen said:
in short yes they do.

Lets just look at the top young english talents.... CURRENTLY..

what do they have in common? Pace, power, athletic ability

Rashford. Pace power. decent striker technique but would never consider as a guy to look up and pick a pass.
Loftus Cheek - just a battering ram player.
TAA - some pace. stuck right back as physically considered not strong enough for midifeld. half decent pass on him
Chalobah - another powerhouse
chilwell another pace merchant playing lb
Gomez - our own joe. fast and powerful. zero left foot
Alli - again never creative. all power and running really.
sterling - all pace. no finish. he's not really a passer either.

Like....

theres no debryune there, no hazard par se. certinly no silva or dare i say it scholes.

The academys filter i think but i also think first team managers put a huge filter on as well.

Keeping the ball and playing intelligent passes forward are not valued in england. Playing fast end to end is. Hence the amount of "athletes" i nthe game.

Contrast a game in spain to a game in england.

maybe 5 real chances each created but much more possession and probing and two decent defences making it hard.

England 20 chances each, end to end lots of errors.
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generally agree but disagree with Alli. He is creative and is technically good and he's not that powerful or fast. He does a lot of running but imo has gotten lazier.

The reason he's not progressed (we say not progressed still bagged plenty of goals and assists) is because he's too busy playing hollywood passes and flicks that don't come off and to me thats down to arrogance and ego.
 
BobbyD said:
not even any decent. Was inconsistent and imo average for you boys.

Bournemouth started him but benched him in the latter half of their season before he got injured.

It speaks volumes that even on a free transfer, none of the big clubs or even the mediocre clubs fancy picking him up
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It does. This guy was hyped up by the hierarchy as the next coming, but flopped like the rest. Not one Arsenal player through our youth academies during the Wenger era has survived, and we supposedly had a good youth system.
 
lazarus20000 said:
It does. This guy was hyped up by the hierarchy as the next coming, but flopped like the rest. Not one Arsenal player through our youth academies during the Wenger era has survived, and we supposedly had a good youth system.
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not sure you can 100% blame the academy players. The more Wenger has stayed in charge, the more players have stagnated.

In the current arsenal teams of recent times, i cannot for the life of me name anyone that wenger has improved beyond their ability but most of the players have gone backwards.

The only one i can think of is Alexis and maybe monreal. I'd have put bellerin if it was the year before but he was pretty bad last year.
 
BobbyD said:
not sure you can 100% blame the academy players. The more Wenger has stayed in charge, the more players have stagnated.

In the current arsenal teams of recent times, i cannot for the life of me name anyone that wenger has improved beyond their ability but most of the players have gone backwards.

The only one i can think of is Alexis and maybe monreal. I'd have put bellerin if it was the year before but he was pretty bad last year.
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I agree, things did stagnate under Wenger so it'll be interesting to see what new man Emery does with the same resources at his disposal. I do hope that he uses the youth and doesn't solely rely on transfers.
 
BobbyD said:
generally agree but disagree with Alli. He is creative and is technically good and he's not that powerful or fast. He does a lot of running but imo has gotten lazier.

The reason he's not progressed (we say not progressed still bagged plenty of goals and assists) is because he's too busy playing hollywood passes and flicks that don't come off and to me thats down to arrogance and ego.
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I wouldn't put him in debruyne or silva category

I think alli has fallen for the same ****e that fabregas and gerrard ended up in.. more or less. They are powerful and can score goals so they got pushed further and further forward and become a quasi second striker but one who's job is more late runs that creating a lot of goals.

Fabregas imo was pushed into a role previously occupied by bergkamp and when he moved to barca and cheslea they have seen the issues with him not really leanring the complete midfield trade.

Gerrard started as a real midfielder, proper hard then he ended up behind torres under rafa or as RW til he got the hump and wanted the central role. great player and all that.

Really alli is very young to be pushed forward like this and i think he will end up being a guy who's just in between. not a great striker not a great midfielder. just very good but not being all he could have been.

THe guy talks a good game about going to real but the reality of that is... real bought modric and bale. is alli good enough to play as a real forward? I don't think so.
 
BobbyD said:
generally agree but disagree with Alli. He is creative and is technically good and he's not that powerful or fast. He does a lot of running but imo has gotten lazier.

The reason he's not progressed (we say not progressed still bagged plenty of goals and assists) is because he's too busy playing hollywood passes and flicks that don't come off and to me thats down to arrogance and ego.
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Alli has got the look of someone who thinks he is better than he is. A lot of media use him and he is advertised as though he is up there with the best. Oh and he has an issue with his top lip. He just needs to go back to being a bit more Lampard esque, a good goal scoring attacking midfielder who can link well with the striker but don't start trying to be more. He has a long long way to go to getting near Lampard though.
 
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moreinjuredthanowen said:
I wouldn't put him in debruyne or silva category

I think alli has fallen for the same ****e that fabregas and gerrard ended up in.. more or less. They are powerful and can score goals so they got pushed further and further forward and become a quasi second striker but one who's job is more late runs that creating a lot of goals.

Fabregas imo was pushed into a role previously occupied by bergkamp and when he moved to barca and cheslea they have seen the issues with him not really leanring the complete midfield trade.

Gerrard started as a real midfielder, proper hard then he ended up behind torres under rafa or as RW til he got the hump and wanted the central role. great player and all that.

Really alli is very young to be pushed forward like this and i think he will end up being a guy who's just in between. not a great striker not a great midfielder. just very good but not being all he could have been.

THe guy talks a good game about going to real but the reality of that is... real bought modric and bale. is alli good enough to play as a real forward? I don't think so.
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agree Alli is no where near De Bruyne and Silva. That's because they are technical and are the playmakers.

Alli in a sense isn't that at all, he's a poor mans del piero/totti, not a centre forward.

He could probably do a job in midfield but he's too busy feeding his ego and trying the fancy ball/goal as his first option whereas Silva and De Bruyne aren't unless its the correct ball.

Not sure it's because fabregas got pushed forward, he can still dominate a game with his passing. It's because he's a ****ing soft light weight midfielder who gets pushed off easily. Unlike Xavi who has a bit more muscle and Iniesta who is nippy and can nick the ball (when he was in his prime), Fabregas has the acceleration of an oil tanker so people breeze past him like he isn't there whether using speed or power. That's why he can't ever be in a dominant midfield.

I wouldn't even put Fabregas as a lampard type, he's more like Silva in that he can spot a pass but he cannot finish and his shooting is pretty weak compared to the likes of Lampard and Gerrard who could hit them consistently.
 
BobbyD said:
agree Alli is no where near De Bruyne and Silva. That's because they are technical and are the playmakers.

Alli in a sense isn't that at all, he's a poor mans del piero/totti, not a centre forward.

He could probably do a job in midfield but he's too busy feeding his ego and trying the fancy ball/goal as his first option whereas Silva and De Bruyne aren't unless its the correct ball.

Not sure it's because fabregas got pushed forward, he can still dominate a game with his passing. It's because he's a ****ing soft light weight midfielder who gets pushed off easily. Unlike Xavi who has a bit more muscle and Iniesta who is nippy and can nick the ball (when he was in his prime), Fabregas has the acceleration of an oil tanker so people breeze past him like he isn't there whether using speed or power. That's why he can't ever be in a dominant midfield.

I wouldn't even put Fabregas as a lampard type, he's more like Silva in that he can spot a pass but he cannot finish and his shooting is pretty weak compared to the likes of Lampard and Gerrard who could hit them consistently.
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I think that's even harsh on totti and del peiro.

I think alli could be a great box to box player, really strong but i think he has been fed a lot of bullshit and pushed forward by poch. It is ego.

Fabregas I agree very soft in midfield and seems only interested in standing with hands on hips looking back while others work. Wenger taught him this IMO. Barca couldn't beat it out of him!

It really shows what a young player is taught as good habits early stays with him forever.
 
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