In the wake of all the recent praise thrown at the Frenchman I thought I would chime in with my opinion. Just a few bits of info before I get started on my rant.. 2011 - 2012 Season 47 Goals conceded, with a game to go (Manchester City - 28 goals conceded) 2010 - 2011 Season 44 goals conceded. Laurent Koscieleny 41 apps (43 in 2010-2011) Per Mertesacker 27 apps Thomas Vermaelen 28 apps Bakari Sagna 28 apps Johan Djourou 18 apps Firstly I want to address our biggest defensive problem. Our defence lacks 'balance'. Vermaelen and Koscielney are both 'ball-playing' centrebacks. Their strengths lie in taking the ball forward from the back and starting an attack. They are both quick and technically accomplished. But they should'nt be played together. They lack height, weight and upper body strength. It's no coincidence that most of the leagues larger strikers have scored against us this Season (Zamorra, Drogba, Ba, Carroll,Morisson, Crouch etc..) The greatest defenses throughout history have always had one more robust ballwinner alongside a more technical defender (either that or two robust defenders and more technical DM sitting just in front) We dont have a Vidic, Kompany, Terry, Adams, Campbell type player in our squad and it's sorely missed. This is what a TOP class centreback looks like. 6'3 Robust and aggressive. The guy was vocal and a natural leader. 6'1 and unbelieveably lightweight. He's built like a ****ing marathon runner NOT a centreback. If you were to list all of the good attributes of Adams, Campbell, Keown, Bould etc.. you would get: 1. Strong. 2. Good in the Air (height normally plays a part in this) 3. Reads the game well 4. Vocal and organised. 5. Aggressive 6. Intimidating.(psychology plays a huge part in sport) ..among others. Most of which CANNOT be applied to Koscielney. My problem with Koscielney is that he's not a natural defender. He's a good player but he's poor defender. I dont think he has the physical or mental attributes to be one of the very best in this position. And this is what confuses the fans, he looks composed, is quick and skillful yet our defensive record while he has played at Arsenal has been diabolical. The Frenchman has played more games than any of our other defenders over the last two season which have been our worst defensively since Wenger took the reigns. We dont have a Vidic, Terry, Adams, Campbell type player in our squad and its sorely missed. I'm not going to say ALL our defensive issues lay on the shoulders of one man but our defensive record speaks for itself and the Frenchman is certainly part of the problem.
I think he's improved this season. You have to consider all the injuries we've had in defense, and some freak results like te 8-2. However, I do agree with you, he's over-rated by a lot of people. Vertonghen would be a better choice, and Mertesacker may be too.
As I defender I rate him higher than Vermaelen, and I believe the problem is not Kos or Verm, but our style. When even Wenger says that conceding more goals than other top teams is inevitable because of our attacking style, where our midfield has no defensive discipline, there is nothing Kos or Verm can do. Put Terry, Vidic, Adams in this team and they will concede a lot of goals, becasue they will have to play much higher than they played before. This is a damning job to be an Arsenal defender these days. Koscieleny is one of the few players in this team I have no problems with.
Better than Vermaelen this season. End of. No one is saying he's absolutely better than Vermaelen. By your same logic Szczesny would be the worst keeper out of Almunia, Mannone and Fabianski with the goals conceded stat. Vertonghen is a 1 to 1 replacement for Vermaelen, not Koscielny. Having 2 left footed CBs isn't preferred for a reason...
By the way people who have said Koscielny was better this season never said he is top-class. Only one who said anything about our defenders being top class was you, about Vermaelen. Considering the season of elementary mistakes he's had that is hilarious.
No your just misunderstanding me. I'm not laying all the blame of Koscielney, Vermaelen has played badly recently and he does'nt look comfortable in this current defensive line up. (Vermalen is the teams vice captain and a really doubt he'll be dropped ahead of Koscielney if we do sign Vertonghen.) I'm just saying that he is a part of the problem. Also its too easy to blame an attacking style. WE have ALWAYS had an attacking style and high line under Wenger.
i wouldn't mention koscielny being better than vermaelen, thebear will start throwing every stat in the book at you to try and prove you wrong. anyways, you may not rate koscielny due to stats, but i don't rate vermaelen because he is a defensive liability. its great when he goes forward and scores (i.e. newcastle), but more often than not he doesn't, and we lose the ball with 1 CB completely out of position, leaving koscielny to try and clear up the mess he has created. i think 2 of yesterday's goals were vermaelen's fault. one of them he was upfield and it led to them breaking and scoring via a deflection. sure someone should have covered, but if vermaelen is the great "leader" everyone says he is, he would have told someone (Song) to stay back and hold his position. the other goal, he failed to follow morison, instead trying to move to the ball when, as a CB, you should ALWAYS stay with your man. too many times this season that has happened.
Yes but you have to admit the first quarter of this season WAS very different, which has affected this bad stat as well. It also makes Szczesny look bad, for example, even though he's had a pretty solid season, bar his tendency to get out of goal too often. I don't think we have a really top class defender, but I think we compare well to say Man Utd without Vidic. We've conceded most when our midfield was shaky. We always look solid when Arteta is having a good game. Our system relies on us being comfortable in possession. Once that goes we are very vulnerable.
1. I can if you want but the only stats you need is 47 goals this Season. Our WHOLE DEFENCE have been awful. 2. Song pushes up because of our formation. Thats not his fault it's a tactical decision. (a bad one IMO)
Exactly what I was pointing out to TheBear those other threads. If you look at actual performances this season Koscielny has been doing his job, while Vermaelen has put us in some really really bad situations. (and I'm being generous by not including his defensive lapses while he played LB)
Koscielny has some top class qualities - his pace and speed of recovery is superb. However he is deeply flawed when it comes to his starting position and his awareness of those around him. He will never improve under Wenger, because he just does not understand defence. Overall we need more intelligent defenders. TV is another who is clueless positionally, but is an athlete.
He's a defender his job is to stop the other team from scoring. So NO he has'nt been doing his job.(not well anyway) That's like saying Andy Carroll has been 'doing his job'. Carroll as a striker his 'job' is primarily to score goals. As a defender Koscielney's job is to stop the other team from scoring. This is an over simplification but you get my point.
I can point to plenty of goals where Vermaelen was directly at fault, while I'd doubt you can find half of that for Kos. That's what I meant, you act like you haven't watched a single game this season. As I said, by the same logic you should be calling for Almunia to get back as first choice, as we've conceded a lot more under Szczesny.
