With all of the attacking options we have now at the club (Rooney, RVP, Welbeck, Hernandez, Nani, Valencia, Young, Kagawa, and Berbatov because as of right now he is still a United player), how are we going to set our team up? We have two of the best, if not the best strikers in the league with a variety of options to play up top, on the wings or behind the striker. There is only 2 attacking players in our squad that can't play multiple attacking positions, Antiono Valencia and Chicharito. Valencia has no left foot and his strongest attributes are pace and power in which wide right is really the only place he'd be useful. Chicharito doesn't have too much to his game other than his knack for being in the right place at the right time. Moving him anywhere other than CF is idiotic.We have the best set of wingers in the world and we have historically played a 4-4-2 utilizing our wingers, but now we have plenty of firepower through the center of the pitch and won't need to be as reliant on our wide men to create our chances. People seem to be upset that RVP may get in the way of Welbecks progress into developing as a player, but they're clearly forgetting Welbeck can play pretty much in any attacking position. When he was on loan at Sunderland he was used as a winger, and played there quite a few times last season. If we end up using a 433 or 4231, he can play anywhere in that attacking 3 or 4. I'm not entirely sure what will be our first choice back line, but last season we showed a number of players can step up at CB and RB when needed. Is Vidic fully match fit yet, or will he play 30-40 minutes against Everton until Ferguson and the team's doctors are certain he's ready to play? In my opinion Evan's was our best CB last season after his nightmare against City, and I wouldn't be surprised to see him start alongside Rio until Vidic makes a full recovery. When that happens I can see Evans replacing Rio in the back line. Anything can happen through out the season, but if Johnny Evans can keep improving the way he did last season I won't be worried about seeing his name in the team sheet. Right back is also a weird spot as Fergie seemed to prefer to play Smalling and Jones on the right over Rafael, but I think Rafael should be starting. He's a better right back than Jones and Smalling, and if we end up playing narrower attacking wise, his ability to attack will help give us the width we're used too. Assuming everyone is healthy at Center mid, I imagine it'll be one of Scholes, Cleverly, Anderson, Giggs, and possibly even Kagawa playing alongside Carrick. I really hope we can snag Sahin out from under Liverpool and Arsenal's noses. He's class and would greatly improve the weakest area in our team. I didnt get a chance to watch any preseason this summer (All games were streaming while I was at work and there's some pretty strict internet policies at my job), but I've read Kagawa actually played well in a 442 alongside Carrick in the midfield, but he himself has proclaimed that he prefers to play centrally in the hole behind the striker. If we were to use our trusted 442 it would like something like this. De Gea Rafael...Rio...Evans...Evra Valencia...Carrick...(CM)...Nani Rooney...RVP Not a bad team, but we're still leaving out some dangerous players that could possibly work their way into a starting line up. in a 4231 Same back 5 Carrick (Cleverly, Anderson, Scholes) Nani Rooney Kagawa RVP The biggest issue I see in the 4231, is the lack of CM to pair with Carrick. Scholes can do it, but he won't play enough to really merit us changing tactics to fit him into this line up IMO. Anderson has a lot of critics, but he is undoubtedly a much better player when he's pushed farther forward with a midfielder covering him. Cleverly might be able to play in this spot, but I see him more in the Carrick mold. He has guild ball retention and likes to keep it simple. He's young and has a lot of room for improvement, and can still adapt into a different type of player. An other option could be a 433, but depending on who starts we could lose our width. Cleverly Carrick Scholes Nani Rooney Young Would be more of a 451, and I'm personally not a big fan of Valencia in this formation. When he only has one person in the box to cross to, he seems useless. Cleverly Carrick Scholes Kagawa Rooney Rvp Kagawa would drift between the midfield and the defense with Rooney and RVP drifting out wide or into the box. I can see this being the most dangerous and potent line up, but we've almost always utilized our wingers throughout the Fergie era and I don't think we'll give up on that now. Plus with the options we have out wide, it would almost be a crime not to use them. So with that all said, what do you think we'll end up using most, and what will be most effective. In the spirit of Methh... Thoughts?
Was thinking the 4 2 3 1 one myself, with Cleverly the one alongside Carrick. I think that would probably get the best out of most of the players while slightly marginalising Rooney which, while not ideal, is about where he was playing when we had Ronaldo, just off the left with Kagawa the middle of the three. Scholes and Giggs are now subs, Valencia would have the opportunity to play himself into the side, as would Young. I thinking Anderson must be overlooked for now. So many options!
The problem with Anderson, is as soon as everyone starts to agree he needs to ago, he'll play 4 or 5 games where he's one of the best players on the pitch. Then get rested and when he gets put back into the side he gets hurt and is terrible for most of the season. I've been an Anderson fan, but I agree I think its best for both parties if he moves on, only if we reinvest in another CM that is. I like the 4231 too, as the attacking 3 could potentially all rotate positions. If it was a front four of Nani Rooney Kagawa and RVP, they could all potentially rotate with the exception of Kagawa. That would be extremely frustrating defend! I am a bit irritated the Everton game is on a Monday. I have to record the games on weekdays and try and avoid finding out during the day til i can get home from work and watch them.
Very good thread I would expect the 4231 simply because they make the best use of our new attacking talent while still keeping Rooney in an effective position. You're right though that it does expose our lack of steel in our centre midfield, but i would expect that to only be a major problem in games where we're going to struggle more for possession, where we would likely opt for a more conservative formation.
Guys I'm in a dilemma... I want to put Kagawa in my FL team, but will he start? My guess is that you will play this... Defence Carrick--Cleverly Nani----Rooney----Valencia/Young? RVP Where would Kagawa go if he played? Should I opt for someone else?
I would guess that Kagawa may take Young's place when both Rooney and RVP start, he could also be used in a deeper central midfield role in games where the opposition sits deep, although I doubt Fergie will be sticking to just one formation, I expect to see variations of a 4231, 442/4411 and 433/451 throughout the season.
This is an assumption so don't take it as gospel but I think Kagawa would play as the centre man of that three who will be behind RVP. Ideally that three would have Nani on the right, Kagawa in the middle and Rooney off the left but not cast in stone obviously. Alternatively should Kagawa not be a starter Rooney would be the middle man of the three with Young and Nani either side. Having said that, who knows? Fergie could go 4 4 2 on us!
Probably on the left. Everything I've seen from Kagawa makes my brain say he should start, but I have a feeling he won't.
So Kagawa isn't a guaranteed starter. Out of Nani, Valencia and Young... would you say Nani was the number 1?
I honestly don't think there is a number one, I think all those players offer something different and will be chosen depending on what they are expected to deliver in the formation on the day and against certain opposition, for example Valencia offers the best natural width and is much better defensively, Nani is the most unpredictable especially when cutting inside and both he and Young offer a goal threat when they are allowed to come off the line, Kagawa is much more of a playmaker type, he loves give and go type of football, short link up play to feet with good movement off the ball.
Good thread 4-2-3-1 is the one that i prefer. RVP as the sole striker with Rooney alongside Kagawa and one of the wingers (Nani, Valencia and Young) in those 3 positions just behind the striker. I would go for Carrick alongside Cleverly/ Scholes in the CM roles. It will be interesting to see what kind of system SAF goes with and how he will utilise all the attacking players in the team.
This. SAF is generally very good at choosing his team to counter the opposition and get what we need out of the game (although with some obvious exceptions). It's one of the main reasons we always do so much better than people say we should 'on paper' and I don't see it changing. Makes it a bloody nightmare for choosing FF players of course
To the top! With about two months of the season go so far, what do you guys think Gas been our best formation within our current setup that we've seen so far this year? We've seen a 4231, 433 with 3 strikers, 433 with 1 striker and two wide men, and the classic 442. We seem to stick to the 4231 when we have our first choice players available, but we also havent played a full game where we were impressive. (Whether that's down to formation, the players, or the coaches is a different matter). I personally think the 4231 is the way forward with the players we have now, we can easily switch formation to adapt our tactics throughout the game and still be more effective than most teams switching formations within the same 11 on the field. The 442 works well in the league for the most part but seems quite lackluster in the Champions league. So far the biggest disappointment for me this year has to be Valencia. I know he's been hurt but he's been inneffective when he has played. I know we all have given Nani slack lately about his performances (deservedly so), but I feel Nani is capable of producing a moment of magic even when he isn't playing well. Valencia just can't produce this moments. In Valencia's defense, I said this in the original post in this thread, he's not suited to playing a 4231. He needs to playing out wide in a 442 or 451 where he can just hug the touchline and force the fullbacks out wide to open gaps for the likes of Rooney to exploit and bull the CBs, or midfielders out of position. Rio has also been a dissapointment, but he wouldn't be playing much if Smalling, Jones, and Vidic were fit. I've been the most impressed with Rafael this season. He's been our best defender this season (not saying much), but he's definitely made that RB spot his own, and it'll provide a much needed consistency in the back 4. The last time we had a set in stone back 4 was what, 08/09 season when we went 1000+ minutes without conceding a goal? Since then we've tinkered with right backs and Rio was always hurt. I'm too lazy to go back and edit on my phone, but in tangent with the consistent back 4 we need a first choice keeper. We can't keep rotating between Lindegaard and De Gea, if we can get a consistent back five. I'd prefer De Gea, as I think he is better at this moment and has way more potential, but at this point Sir Alex just needs to stick to one of them. I'd also like to see Buttner play more, Evra is on the decline, and this kid looks like he could be a real gem. Evra either needs a break to rest or just be phased out of the team, and we a young kid with tons of potential waiting to take his place. I'm also glad to see Fletcher back, but I'm worried it's going to be an excuse not to bring in a midfielder in January or during the summer. I'd also like to Anderson get some more game time, he's played well when he's gotten a chance this season. So have at it! An actual thread about football!
Yeah, this is the one I was on about, I wonder if billy boy will join in? Doubt it! Slight change to my op in this thread, I wonder now if 4 2 1 2 1 would be best option, with Rooney playing at CM in front of Carrick/Jones and Cleverly and Nani/Valencia Kagawa/Young either side of striker van Persie. Lots of options and Giggs and Scholes nowhere to be seen.
Oi, theres loads of football threads but we like a laugh until some **** ruins it Anyway its hard to say what our best formation is so far, we havent played well and the 120 minutes that we have done were with a diamond formation lacking width. It was nice to a point but left us a little open and the addition of Valencia in the second half v Newcastle reverted us back to the tried and tested 442. I still want to see a 4231 formation with RVP up top, Rooney behind with 2 of Kagawa/Nani/Valencia/Young either side providing width. 2 deeper CM one of which will be Carrick obviously alongside Anderson or Cleverly. Scholes to come off the bench to tidy up games later on. Up top Powell gives us another option aswell in that 2nd line of 3. I havent included Fletcher yet as while hes getting minuts it will be a while before we have the full Fletcher back. Ease him in, watch his fitness and fingers crossed in the 2nd half of the season we can have him back as a regular. No need to rush him if we play that formation.
The 4231 also means Rooney becomes less of a out and out striker and more of a half breed midfielder/striker. Some would say AM but with how far hes willing to track back I wouldnt say its AM. Almost box to box with the added attacking ability. I think he enjoys that role, hes always involved and thats what Rooney loves. Hes always been more of a team player than an individual for me.
SAF seems to be employing a few different formations and changing them during matches. Don't have a problem with the formations as such but I don't like the lack of width we play with. Its not a formation thing because even when the FB's or someone gets down the wing they never seem to cross but always come back inside. Newcastle/Spurs games summed up our play style. Half a match we're **** hot and slicing teams apart with real intent, the other half we're battening down the hatches praying we don't concede. It's nice to be a few weeks into the season and not had a Rafael/Carrick/Anderson is crap fight yet.
The 4 2 1 2 1 is essentially a 433 is it not? Just have Rooney dropped a bit deeper and have more influence in the game isn't a bad deal, but at the same time you also want Rooney pushed up and in the box because he's a proven goal scorer, and it'll create more space for the rest of the team. Perhaps more of a free role, provided the 2 holding mods behind him are capable enough of essentially doing the defensive work of 3. That would allow us to keep the players up top so RVP doesn't become isolated when we don't have the ball, yet allow Rooney to dictate the game from further back if need be. Or push up and exploit the gaps whatever is needed. I've always felt Rooney's greatest strengths were his ability to adapt and his understanding of the game. He's successfully played multiple positions throughout his career, so he has ability and knowledge to be effective all over the pitch. He doesn't need a "defensive duty" per se, but he will work hard to shut out the other team, like he always does.
I think Cleverly and Anderson are both better suited for a more attacking role, Carrick too actually, although he is effective as a holding mid. The only real midfielder we have that would have that deeper role as a preferred role would be Fletcher, and there's no proof yet that he's going to be able to play as much and in a similar fashion to who he was pre illness. Phil Jones might be able to make that his position. If Pogba had half a brain he would have seen this an realized he had a genuine shot at becoming a regular in our team. Clearly he has the same intelligence capacity as Berb. . This is the area we need to improve in upcoming transfer windows. Is Powell playing up top for the reserves? When he came on against Wigan wasn't he playing CM? I know he got subbed on as one can't remember if someone else got shifted back. He clearly has a Scholes-esque shooting talent, wonder if Fergie is trying to have him replace Scholes.
