I should leave this one to our resident expert on all things Argyle and Charlton. I hope to be watching on stream but it depends on the weather. If it's chucking it down I'm not going out. COYG
I wish I felt more confident about this one.....Charlton could be a better team than last season....and of course Steven Sassegnon is now on a seasons long loan to them....he will want to make a statement against us for sure. Jayden Stockley will need shackling he is a big strong striker.....last season winger Diallang Jaiyesime ran us ragged down the right wing and played a big part in ending our 16 game unbeaten run. To save face with my Charlton supporting family....a draw would do me.
I am shocked at the lack of any comment on here but then again perhaps given what happened I'm not. This was a shocking display by Argyle and I would go so far as to say the worst I have seen for a very long time. The back line was terrible and between them with disgusting passing out from the back contributed totally to our downfall. To be fair the passing by pretty much all of the team was poor. The sending off just before halftime was the last straw. I have to say I thought a red was very harsh. I am not sure how the Ref could argue that the handball was deliberate even if it did stop a goal. The shot was from very close to him. It killed the game there and then. Having said that we were already two down and Charlton were passing their way through us with ease. We made them look like Barcelona. I hope this was a one off and there are some very stern words on the way home. MOM Argyle wise?????? None of them.
I'm not going to be quite as drastic as that: we played some good stuff early on but every 5 good passes was followed by 1 suicide ball and that's no good at all. In tough away games I don't know why we can't just bore the pants off everyone for the first 15 minutes rather than trying to win immediately. They had a good guy down their right but is he that good or do Gillesphy and Mumba really not work? Where's Ryan Law when you need him? Galloway looked much more aggressive at the tail end. Never a penalty let alone a red if I ruled the world. It's blasted at him from 2 yards: is he supposed merely to dematerialise? Shocking result and a lot of thinking to do.
I have no dispute with the penalty being given. It hit his hand and was stopped from going in so denied a goal. However blasted from 2 yards and then a Red is totally over the top. Not sure what he was supposed to do to get out of the way. It looked to me that he tried to block it with his body but didn't do it fast enough and his arm was stuck out. Very harsh. To give a red the Ref would have to decide it was a deliberate handball. Yes we looked good at times but we looked very poor more often. We allowed them to pass through our lines and overlap at will. Suicide balls {sounds very painful} is putting it mildly. We just handed them the game and it was like watching "that defence" we grew to love in the past bad old days. They were shockingly bad. I don't know why we keep doing the same poor things when everyone can see they are poor and at times you have to put the foot through the ball. They should know why they are league one players and not playing in the Prem without having to prove it over and over.
Just back from the massacre....I just cannot understand how Charlton have the evil eye over us...it's not as if they're that good a team. I'll sleep on it and say something tomorrow.....we played some pretty football at times... but no one seemed to be committed to attacking their goal....Bali Mumba just looked pointless....a bad night for him I assume.....all of them in fact....I think a spell has been cast over Argyle at the Valley.....it is hard to cope with having a son and grandson who are ST holders down there....so humiliating. Having a player sent off followed by a penalty...just seems to be a double punishment....the game was over then on 39 minutes.
There’s a well known fact that if a goalkeeper doesn’t dive before a penalty is struck, the maths of it are such that he physically cannot save it. That’s from 12 yards. How then can it be deliberate handball from 6 feet? Since that mad Italian referee Pierluigi Collina got at the rules, we’ve gone from the substandard to the ridiculous. Fans and journos that bay for a penalty every time there’s a touch need to be tuned out of the conversation so we can get back to “hand to ball”.
I was doing a bit of mental maths. A well hit shot can travel at about 80mph and at close range, it's going to be at its fastest before air resistance starts to bite. Let's call it 60mph for ease: a mile a minute: 5,280 ft per minute: 88 ft per second. Wilson is standing 6 feet away and therefore has just under 0.07 seconds to deliberately block the ball with his hand. Quick reactions is all I'm saying. Just on a side note, I was watching Premier League football over the weekend; Nottingham Forest v West Ham from memory. West Ham had a goal (which would have meant a potentially £ multi-million ELP point) disallowed for offside. The offending player's shoulder was offside: the rest of him, including crucially his feet, which surely best define where he is, were onside. He had 30 yards to run to score, so one shoulder having a 6 inch advantage was hardly decisive. What advantage is there in having one shoulder slightly ahead?
My Charlton supporting family just see the Argyle fixture as a nailed on 3pts.....the last seven meetings have gone.....5-1...2-0...2-2...2-1...2-0...2-0...2-0.....you have to go back to season 2007/8 since Argyle last won...2-1. They listened to me last year in the car as we travelled to the Valley...and how we had gone 16 games unbeaten....and .....Charlton won 2-0 without any sign from Argyle of how they were unbeaten for 16 games.....I just got a sympathetic smile and yes grandad smile. Okay we beat them there in the FA Cup a couple of seasons back....but wasn't it Covid rules...behind closed doors...no one there....all easily forgotten of course. Then there's the memory of two seasons back...end of the season at Home Park....0-6 at a canter. You can easily come to the conclusion that we have upset the football gods regarding Charlton....what have we done to upset them ?.....did we kick the clubs pet cat....did we park the coach in some crippled Charlton ST holders special parking bay.....did someone pee up against the statue of famous keeper Sam Bartram outside the main club entrance....just tell us how we have upset the powers that be at CAFC and we will say sorry and start again. You had this feeling as the match went along that the curse was at work again....things seem to fall in place for them and silly errors kept happening to us.....our usually competent defence just weren't performing....an unease took over in all that we did. For me there was a moment late on that told me that the football gods were not on our side......Jephcott had the ball near the corner post and was 'tussling' with a Charlton player....Jephcott was trying to engineer a corner by kick the ball against the defenders leg...which he managed to do....but the ball came back at him and it touched him last before going behind for a goal kick.....one of those moments that reminds you that your getting nought out of this game...not even a corner. The penalty I didn't see from my seat....I was down that end but on the second tier of the West Stand...to far to actually see the detail (saw the video this morning)...it looked as if Wilson had done a last moment save for a corner....then the red card came out and the ex Exeter Stockley puts the penalty in the net.....Wilson was unlucky....he had not deliberately put his arm towards the ball....it just hit him moments after being kicked...no chance of moving his arm and allowing the ball to go in...at least we would then of had eleven players still on the pitch.......after the home crowd roared for the goal a quietness seemed to come down on the occasion and a feeling of game over...and just before half-time Sean Clare moved un-challenged to the edge of the penalty area and let rip a screamer that went in the top far corner.....game, set and match. Argyle never gave up but they knew that it wasn't there night.....Schumacher made changes at half time...probably to lessen the scars on some of his more attacking players for the next match.....who knows....but it must have brought back memories of how the season finished last year.....Schumacher's job now it to try and learn from it and somehow erase the players memories of what happened. Best defender was Joe Edwards who filled the gap left by Wilson on the right side he looked so small but played his heart out......concerns about Gillesphey....he had a poor game....poor back pass to Cooper and poor distribution at time lost us the ball and put us back under pressure.....yet the other week he played a blinder....When Galloway came on he brought some confidence with him...but it was far to late by then the damage had been done. I got wound up by Charltons attitude to goal kicks and free kicks....they never took a quick one....it looked more like a golfer getting his book out to check the lay of the land...they took ages to get the came underway again..... and there was one incident when they had a throw in opposite their penalty area.....when they all walked up field and no one went towards the ball to take the throw in...after awhile one player slowly walked back to take the throw in.....in the meanwhile Sam Purkiss the referee silently stood there playing statues and showing no interest in the lack of action from Charlton......pathetic.......just a game to forget.....I hope we're not playing Charlton next season....I don't know if I could cope with that again at my age.
I have been pondering this red card sending off situation.....and taken onboard notdistant's penalty maths (that would have left sensible brain numb before the second sentence). The question is was it a deliberate hand ball or not....the Ref needs to go to video recall....and then make a decision. 1.....If it was a deliberate hand ball the player get a red card and a penalty is given......and the offending team are down to ten men....simple as that. 2.....If the ball hits the arm and saves a goal....then a penalty is given....the Ref then needs to judge that if the player had no chance of avoiding the ball and he made no deliberate movement towards it...he his penalized with a yellow card....the attacking team have been given their reward....and the defending team have not been given a double sentence and still have eleven players on the pitch. The law at the moment I think on penalties can in this instance be a fool...giving the offending team not just one penalty (in this case a penalty) but the penalty of a player being sent off as well....that cannot be fair....that is surely a double punishment.
The first issue though is "what is an handball"? Everyone expects the keeper to spread his arms and legs to block a shot... they get congratulated for "making themselves big". Clearly, if an outfield player does that, it's a handball. After that, it's shades of grey. When you jump, you flap your arms to get lift and fend the other guy off. If in the process of that, the ball comes to your hand, to me that's NOT a handball.... perhaps your arms aren't in the natural position they would be if you were standing at the bar, but they ARE in the natural position for jumping in the air. When you slide in to block a shot, your trailing arm tends to extend under you as a counter-balance as a support and the other tends to come up as a counter-balance. Again, it's a natural position for what you're doing. Wilson half jumps to head the ball but realises he can't get it and twists around where Stockley is already swinging at the ball from very close range. His arm, still elevated from the jump is coming down, not going up, as it's hit and he has absolutely no chance of getting out of the way. It's not in a natural position except for hailing a cab, but he's not, he's playing football. They've been messing with this rule for a number of years and each change gets more complicated and less relevant to actual football. Hand to ball, like it used to be.
Hi chaps....at least our goal is a goal of season contender.....overall poor display and don't see us getting too many points in the next 3/4 games. Teams now will go all out attack and we will collapse unless Schuey bucks them up. P.S. don't need to play them up the road very soon lol!
You have gone a very long way around the houses notdistant and plymborn to actually get to the point that I was making. It was a save but it was not a deliberate handball given the distance the ball travelled to hand. Ergo penalty but only a yellow not a red. I actually think even a yellow is harsh in those circumstances but that's another argument.
I don't accept the idea that an accidental handball is a free kick. Shop Steward - Defenders' Union (Retired).
The deciding factor here...is that his arm stopped the ball going in the net....after all that it's deciphering the rules without a green tint.....a yellow would have been fairer....but the problem is if the penalty was missed......meaning that an illegal arm had won the day
In which case award a goal anyway without the need for a penalty. They do it in Rugby so why not in football. It's getting a red card for something you couldn't avoid that is wrong and not the goal award. It isn't or shouldn't be a green tint thing my opinion is general for whichever team it is.
