Transfer Rumours United's ever on going rebuild , are we nearly there yet?

I completely agree with the point that Sweats is making here.

Ultimately, the goal is to select the best manager for the job based on their history - record of proper coaching to make the players better and ultimately make the team punch above its weight, solid man management and taking no sh**s from pig players, solid type of football, and leading a club this size. Allegri fits that bill and I would argue for Poch as well. Clearly, those two are well regarded in the game enough to be mentioned around Real and Barca. So why do we need to overthink the need when there are not many managers that fit the bill?

I don't see how taking on Allegri or Poch should be seen as knee-jerk reaction simply because they are out of work and using LvG and Mourinho as examples of what could go wrong. I think that thesis is flawed.

Part of the problem here at United is that it has become a club that operates on paralysis by analysis which is great when you are the CFO. But when you need to make rapid clear choices, it becomes a burden. It is the reason why we still don't have a Director of Football. If left alone, Woodward will probably conclude his analysis by 2025.

Also, it isn't that Ole is a terrible manager because we can see signs that he's been clearly learning while on the job. I'm just not sure that he will have enough runway to learn enough to bear the fruits. But I can see why he's left alone to continue. However, someone like Allegri would fit in seamlessly to execute exactly what he wants from the team. Why would we turn down such opportunity?

 

I don't what this has to do with anything. You make it sound as though they are on Job Seekers allowance. These men are unemployed because they choose to be. I am sure that they are by no means short of offers on their tables.

 

There's a point?

Guess it got lost between Lithuania and Claudio Ranieri.

 

I guess the Ranieri point is aligned with winning against all odds in a league that is locked in with the top 4. Similar to Scotland’s Old Firm and Aberdeen winning. But the Leicester event doesn’t necessarily make Ranieri a viable candidate.

Ultimately, I don’t see the farce. It’s not like the world is awash with brilliant managers. If managers that meet the criteria are currently not working, it shouldn’t trigger negative parallels with LvG/Mourinho.

 

If you revert right back to the start of the conversation it is more to do with the method of employing managers, rather than the managers themselves.

Although I do stand by my assertion that it would be employing someone just because they are available, rather than their suitability.

I am adamant that employing Pochettino just because Real might be about to consider him if they sack Zidane, is the wrong way of recruiting a manager.

If Poch is the right man, he'd have been employed by now surely? He's been available long enough.

And Ferguson wasn't employed because he had some one off miracle like Ranieri did. He was employed because he was clearly the right man for the job, the comparison is ludicrous.

 

Fergie was recruited because of what he achieved with Aberdeen, both on and off the pitch. He had taken them from being a rag-tag band of also-rans to dominating Scottish football and winning the European Cup Winners Cup. He rid the dressing room of troublesome players and replaced them with youth - the same for the drinking culture - he killed it dead. Sounds familiar?

SAF was appointed by Busby for those very reasons - he saw SAF as just the man for restoring discipline in an under-achieving United squad - and it worked. From that success SAF developed the club into the institution that it is today - the development of Carrington, investment is sports science et etc and those improvements brought further success but it was only after he left that his personal influence as manager was recognised as immense.

If we are are saying that Ole is not the man for the job (and I lay my cards on the table here and say I think he is developing into the role and will become a top manager for our club) then we can't just sack him because the sporting press are baying for blood or because we (like other top sides) have had a few dodgy results at the start of a very unique and challenging season. We have to ask ourselves what can a new face in the job bring to the table that is better than what we currently have.

The win over PSG was a tactical masterclass from Ole, particularly given that we were a bit 'light' in some areas of the pitch. Pep has shown himself to be tactically inept on occasions, his team selections are not always perfect - the same for Arteta, Jose and even Klopp - so nobody is perfect. The names being bandied around as replacements for Ole aren't better than he is. Allegri was good in Italy with a squad and a club culture that he was entirely familiar with - he can't even speak English and is totally unproven in the PL, the most challenging league in world club football. As for Poch, I was a strong advocate for him to take the job at one time, but for me he has been found wanting at the top level and has hit a glass ceiling - imagining that he could improve as a manager at OT would be another massive gamble - and gambling isn't what we want.

When and if a manager becomes available who is demonstrably better than Ole - then we should plan ahead and plan to sign them, but who might there be. I would argue that, at the moment, there isn't anyone who can do better than Ole.

 

I just don’t see him ever becoming a very top manager. Every time we have a good game we get turned over the next. He has overseen some of the worst results ever. Pretty certain moyes had a higher points tally in a harder league. Just because everyone is a bit **** doesn’t make ole good enough. I wanted him to do well but I just cannot see him ever being an elite manager taking us to the levels we need to be at to challenge for league. I’d say poch has potential to be that person. Allegri has the pedigree already. I don’t follow other leagues to know any managers ripping leagues up with unfancied teams. Only one springs to mind is athletico and I can honestly say I wouldn’t want simeone at all.

 

Barcelona is starting two 17 year olds today against Real. Pedri is benching Griezmann. It always fascinates me how they seem to willingly thrust young players that are good enough into the first team.

I look at Greenwood and he’s barely getting decent game time even though it’s been proven that he’s good enough to start games. We would rather spend millions bringing in players that turn into a gamble than be resourceful. If we are to believe the reports, we were also willing to bring in Fati for over £100m. Our transfer strategy is odd.

 

Well don't believe the reports, that one is bollocks.

You do realise that United are at 1000+ consecutive games with a graduate in the match day squad? Perhaps you should.

Greenwood has been having some discipline issues, plus a clear loss of form since the England thing.

I'm sure he'll come again.

 

Real Madrid beat Barca. So we don't need to be getting Poch anymore I take it?

 

The recruitment of the latest great manager is bollocks. We had employed Mourinho and Van Gaal. Two great managers at the time who did the most wonderful and beautiful things at other clubs (notice the language as used by an orange skinned lying scumbag at his rallies?) . United turned gold into turd. And it’s happened to countless of players too. Di maria, Depay, Sanchez, Falcao, Mkhitarian, Zaha. the list is endless.

who could be sure that wonderful Pochetino would not turn into a **** manager as soon as he joins us?

 

“When players come into a new league, a new team, it’s always going to be a time of (transition),” said Solskjaer, who was known as a so-called “super-sub” in his playing days at United. “When Donny has played, he’s played really well. I think it says a lot about our depth of quality in the squad that we don’t have to use him every single game because we have other players as well.
—-//—

Why is Solskjaer suggesting that it takes time to settle when players come into a new league? Is he talking about the same player that scored on his debut this season?

It pi55es me off that we were even chasing Sancho in the summer without any plans to sell players in a crowded team. We are dysfunctional beyond words.

 

Reading an article by Neville, it's suggested that Donny has seen less game time as a result of a change to 2 defensive midfielders in order to shore up the defence after the poor start against Brighton and then Spurs. The original plan may have been to play 2 of Bruno, Pogba, Donny in a game, but now that's been reduced to 1 and Fernandes is first choice, with Fred and McT.

 

****ing hell, so our whole way of playing is STILL being dictated to by the ****e centre halves we have!

Wasn't Maguire supposed to solve that?

It's ridiculous that we even have to consider playing two supposedly defensive midfielders.

 

Why not bring in Tuanzebe? Nurture him through good game time. Or perhaps we are looking to spend another £80m on yet another defender?

What a joke!!

 

And bear in mind this is also whilst playing with 3 at the back and 2 wingbacks

Why not play 3 at the back. Wan-bissaka and Telles as wingbacks and Fred as holding mf.

Then why can't DVB play in a 3 with Fernandes and Rashford. And have Cavani up front.

 

That's pretty much the team i just picked for tonight on the match day thread!

 

Asked if he fears for his job, Solskjaer said: "I decline to comment on such a thing. It is early on. Opinions are there all the time. We have to stay strong.

"I am employed by the club to do a job and I'm doing that to the best of my ability with my staff."
.....

The stupid thing here is why winning at Everton should that be factored into whether or not Solskjaer stays? We’ve been doing the same for some time. But given we usually end up winning two games and losing one, we will never have the stars aligned to definitively just call it in which appears to be what Woodward is waiting on.

That statement that Ole is doing his job to the best of his ability is the ultimate takeaway here. We lack ideas, leadership and organization. These lack are not going to get magically get better.

Woodward is pathetic!

 

One of the big problems seems to me to be the fact that most managers have around them a team of coaches etc that come and go with them - the 'backroom staff'. When the likes of JM gets fired, they take their entire staff with them to the new job - Poch mentioned the other night that he 'and his team' keep working, keep discussing games and tactics together.

I make this point because when Ole was appointed as manager he didn't have a trusted and established team of backroom staff - he literally picked up the phone and hauled Phelan back into the fray, grabbed Carrick and a few from the academy - and that was pretty much his backroom team. They have had to adapt and evolve into their individual new roles as much as Ole - and it is my gut feeling that it is they, rather than Ole that are to blame. That is not to point the finger at Ole himself, he is the boss and the buck stops with him, but I get a sense that the whole coaching side and the quality of those tasked with putting Ole's tactics into practice has literally, let the side down.

I can see how someone like Poch, a manager with an experienced coaching team accustomed to drilling players with his tactics and playing style would win over Ole's rag-tag team. Will it happen and what might Woody consider is the catalyst remains to be seen.