Timeform ratings on the Flat stretch right back to the first Racehorses annual, which came out in 1948, and over jumps to the time of the first jumps Black Books in the early-60s. Timeform's Greatest Racehorses - Flat Highest Timeform Annual Ratings (Flat 3yo+) 147 Frankel 145 Sea-Bird 144 Brigadier Gerard, Tudor Minstrel 142 Abernant, Ribot 141 Mill Reef 140 Dancing Brave, Dubai Millennium, Harbinger, Sea The Stars, Shergar, Vaguely Noble 139 Arrogate, Generous, Pappa Fourway, Reference Point Timeform's Greatest Racehorses - Hurdlers Highest Timeform Annual Ratings (Jumps - Hurdlers) 182 Night Nurse 180 Istabraq, Monksfield 179 Persian War 178 Comedy of Errors, Le Sauvignon 177 Lanzarote, Limestone Lad, Constitution Hill (profile to follow at end of career) 176 Bird's Nest, Bula, Faugheen, Golden Cygnet 175 Baracouda, Gaye Brief, Salmon Spray, Sea Pigeon Timeform's Greatest Racehorses - Chasers Highest Timeform Annual Ratings (Jumps - Chasers) 212 Arkle 210 Flyingbolt 192p Sprinter Sacre 191 Kauto Star, Mill House 187 Desert Orchid 186 Dunkirk 184 Burrough Hill Lad, Moscow Flyer, Long Run 183 Don Cossack, Master Oats 182 Azertyuiop, Best Mate, Captain Christy, Douvan, Carvill's Hill, Kicking King, See More Business, Well Chief Timeform's Greatest Racehorses - Jumping Mares Highest Timeform Annual Ratings (Jumps - Mares) 173 Dawn Run 171 Anaglogs Daughter 170+ Annie Power 166 Dubacilla, Flakey Dove 165 Lady Cricket, Lady Rebecca, Honeysuckle(profile to follow at end of career) 164 Quevega 162 Apple's Jade, Asian Maze
Every chance we’ll be seeing two of the all-time greats this season over hurdles (Constitution Hill) and fences (Galopin Des Champs). Exciting times indeed.
I think it's great that you can click on any of the horses to get an article on the horse, especially for the younger generation, for whom most of the names will be unfamiliar
Long Run showing that bias is produced when other horses are rated highly at the same time. Not a chance should he be in that list.
Yes, even this old geezer has difficulty remembering the great sprinter Abernant. who raced shortly after the end of WW2. Just beaten a short-head by eventual Derby winner Nimbus in the 1949 2000 Gns. when his stamina just didn't last out. He was indeed a superb sprinter, as this article from Wikipedia also relates (additional item to the above Timeform section on Abernant): Abernant (horse) - Wikipedia
The ratings don't reflect versatility though do they? In April 1988 Desert Orchid won the Whitbread Gold Cup over 3m 5f at Sandown carrying 11st 11lb and 7 months later he won the Tingle Creek over 2 miles on the same track again giving lumps of weight away. Not many chasers in the list had that trip versatility
Similar story on the flat with Ribot; not to mention his understated 2nd Arc win. Sill, it's nice to see their names and backup articles for a little reminiscing
Yes, that is a strange one. I can only think that his heart problem prevented him achieving a higher rating. Whereas "Kauto Star was a constant record-breaker, the only horse to ever regain the Gold Cup, win five King George VI Chases, four Betfair Chases and the Stayers’ Triple Crown.". But should he be 10lb below KS given that he did beat him fair and square once, and that being a GC?
I reckon "we" could argue about some of the relative ratings. Should have just listed the greats in alphabetical order and let us just read the articles we are interested in
Since you have started a thread about the subject of “all-time” ratings, I am going to throw the cat amongst the pigeons... I simply do not think that these ratings (especially for the flat) over a long period of time hold any validity; a statement that I will support thus: Go and look at a racecard today and the race distances as listed, for example Wolverhampton 5:00 1m 1f 104yds, Wolverhampton 8:00 5f 21yds, Hereford 12:45 2m 3f 147yds, Hereford 2:45 2m 5f 163yds. Modern race distances are much more accurately measured and reported than they used to be years ago. Back in the 1950s or 1960s, how many races were actually run over the reported distance? On the flat in the days before starting stalls were commonly used, that Wolverhampton 5:00 would have been “about 10 furlongs”. Can Timeform really rely upon times set in different eras when comparing horses of other eras when the races might not have been run over the same distances? I have old racecards dating back to the 1980s where race distances are given as “about 1 mile and 4 furlongs” because, as still happens today, the clerk of the course would move the running rails around to find the best possible ground, especially when it was easy ground as it regularly was at the York Ebor meeting after it had rained on a track that John Smith had watered. In the National Hunt game, I suspect that race distances are even more dodgy as starters let the races start at various distances from the designated start point and presumably those timing the race start the stopwatch when the flag falls not when the first horse passes the designated start point. In a race today, if the flag falls while the horses are five feet from the start or five yards from the start could have a material effect on the result if it is a photo finish. Surely improvements in the quality of the racing surfaces have resulted in times improving with time under both codes. And is Constitution Hill not supposed to be winning the 2023 Derby? I am sure I saw that mentioned somewhere...
We are going over very, very, very old ground here but must say (I think I'm contractual obliged to) that's a bit harsh, old boy. My goodness what a true champion Long Run was. Expertly handled and placed by the forum's favourite trainer and the Waley-Cohen's were equally superb in their respective roles as owner and Corinthian rider. A legend of the sport and, in my opinion, one of the best horses to grace the 21st century.
