The Squad

All the freebies have now left and it seems a good time to actually assess our current squad. There seems little point in going over who might come or go as its just speculation and guess work. So I'll leave the Krul/Debuchy/Sissoko rumours out of this particular thread.

Goalkeepers

Krul, Elliot, Alnwick, Woodman

Verdict: Krul is better than he showed last season. He needs to improve but can. I don't rate Elliot. Is he ok as back up? Perhaps not but I can't see us commiting any of our paltry funds to signing a replacement. The two young lads are fine as third choice options.

Defenders

Debuchy, Santon, Dummett, Haidara, Colo, Saylor, Willo, Mbiwa, Raylor, Good, Satka, Streete

Verdict: Numbers are fine, quality is below par for me. Debuchy and Colo are quality. I don't have masses of faith in the others. Willo and Raylor are solid guys to have around (provided Raylor is fit), but just squad fillers. Saylor, Santon and Mbiwa look like complete liabilities to me. Haidara and Dummett are young but I'm not convinced either will cut it. The young lads we've seen very little of to really comment.

Midfielders

Tiote, Bigi, Anita, Colback, Kemen, Abeid

Verdict: Not much depth and you can't help but feel there is a big quality void yet to be filled.

Attacking Midfielders

De Jong, HBA, Marveaux, Sissoko, Gouffran, Sammy, Obertan, Jonas, Aarons, Ferguson

Verdict: De Jong and Sissoko are solid first team options. Otherwise its a bag ****e for me. Young Aarons looks a player and The Gouf is solid back up but we are spunking a **** load of wages on some pretty poor options. We'd be better off offloading HBA, Marveaux, Sammy, Obertan, Jonas and Ferguson. Replace them with 3 quality players i.e. First choice left side (Cabella?) and some back up for De Jong and Sissoko. Aarons can cover the left.

Strikers

Cisse, Armstrong, Perez, Campbell

Verdict: Frightening lack of quality/experience. You have Cisse who couldn't hit a cows arse with a banjo, and three unproven youngsters. I'd sell Cisse and buy two strikers (Ings and AN Other). Its no good saying De Jong plays striker, Gouf plays striker, you are just robbing Peter to pay Paul. Decide what they are and go with it. Their versatility should really only be utilised in a crisis.

Reality is we see versatility as a way to cover a multitude of sins. There are 35 players named above though, so are we just not misusing our resources too? Of those 35 I would say only Krul, Debuchy, Colo, Tiote, Anita, De Jong, Sissoko good enough to be first choice. 7 players. Of course our manager/owner will say Cisse, HBA, Santon, Mbiwa, Gouffran, Colback take that number up to 13.

I look at our squad and if I was the manager I'd be worried. We lack quality, we lack depth of quality and we have a lot of players who don't really want to be here or shouldn't be here. Cisse, HBA, Saylor, Mbiwa, Santon, Jonas, Ferguson, Obertan, Marveaux, Sammy, Dummett, Elliot - That is a lot of dross to have in your squad. Only Santon at a push could I make a case for, maybe Mbiwa can improve? That still leaves 12 ****hawks.

 

Bit too negative for me. Debuchy, Colo and Haidara (has shown potential when played) are decent options IMO. Santon, Taylor x2 and Williamson are all of mid table standard which is where we currently are. Mbiwa is unproven, thrown in and out of the team in a multitude of positions, has looked very good in some games and a complete liability in others, verdict is out on him for me. I think we're one CB/RB light, Micah Richards would be perfect.

Given we'll play either 4-2-3-1 or 4-4-1-1 then Colback, Anita and Tiote are competing for two positions with Kemen as fourth choice, again I think this is good depth for a 8th-12th placed team. De Jong will play off the striker which is fine. Out wide we have Sissoko & Gouffran, we are very lightweight in numbers here, Ben Arfa & Marveaux won't feature so IMO we need at least two wingers. Sammy, Ferguson, Obertan, Jonas can (and should) all leave.

Up front we have Cisse, Perez and Armstrong as Campbell simply won't feature. Good chance Armstrong will go on loan too IMO so we need two new strikers with Cisse & Perez 3rd and fourth choice. We're currently well short in this area, but by all accounts we're after two strikers so with Cisse and Perez 3rd & 4th choice again we'd be well stocked for another top ten finish.

I know you don't want to include new signings, but in doing that looking at our squad becomes a pointless exercise as our squad will get better in this window. We've alread sold our key man (Cabaye) so the only other fear we have is Debuchy going. I'm actually pretty positive, mainly because I believe Cabella will sign along with two strikers and a defender. If that doesn't happen then it'll be time to worry but very early days yet.

 

2 from A Ayew, Cabella, Grenier and Ince on the wings, plus 2 strikers and I'd be happy enough. A new CB as well would be good news.

Shipping out the dross I agree with but it's not often so easy to find new homes for them.

 

Lots of ifs buts and maybes in there.

The reason I have ignored strengthening the squad is quite simple, common sense and reality. History tells us we talk a big game every window and then do nothing. Every window we need certain players and we sign nothing. Only one window has seen investment and that was simply because relegation was a genuine threat. There is no real evidence to suggest we will invest this window. I'd love to be positive and think we will, but I can't help but think we will look at SDJ as Cabayes replacement, Colback as Gosling's, job done.

We might sign people, we might not, we might sell people, we might not. So I just prefer to look at the reality, which is the squad we have now. I understand fully what you are saying about mid table etc. However we are just about scraping mid table in reality. We were in relegation form in the 2nd half of last season. SDJ and Colback replacing Cabaye and Gosling does not look to equate to re-elevation into the mid table. I don't think we'll go down with that squad. I just think it has 11th-15th written all over it.

 

My concerns are prioritised as follows:

Strikers - We need two really quality strikers simple as...
Defence- Left back slot needs attention (Santon to replace MD with Raylor as back up if needs be)- With CB's... Colo/MYM/Saylor/Willo I'm not overly converned tbh.
Midfield- I'm happy wih Sissoko on the right but the left hand side needs urgent attention depending on formation.

All in all I expect more out the door, but as long as we can address the above 4 weak points I'd be happy.

 

But even last year Cisse & Shola were deemed not enough depth/talent up front so we got Remy. So now that Shola and Remy have gone history tells us we'll sign a minimum of one striker. We clearly want two strikers because the original plan was Remy and Luuk De Jong on permanent deals. In the end Remy had a great season and out grew us and Luuk did the opposite. If Luuk had done well I have no doubt we'd currently have two De Jong's on our books. I actually think history tells us we're after one striker as a minimum requirement but with two strikers being the "plan".

 

I think this is our big problem. How do you find a taker for the likes of Obertan and Jonas. You could probably find takers at reduced costs for the likes of HBA and Marveaux. People will be reluctant though as they have been exposed for what they are. French teams probably take them if the money was right. Saylor would probably attract some interest, being English would be a good selling point. Santon, Mbiwa and Cisse would probably attract interest too. The likes of Ferguson, Dummett, Sammy would appeal because of their age to the lower levels. I think we could offload a lot but there fees would be the sticking point just as it is when we buy

 

Fair enough history probably does tell us we will sign one striker looking at the Remy scenario (which I overlooked). We have signed Shola's replacement in young Perez. If we got one striker to add to SDJ and Colback though, I still think we are average to poor.

 

Agreed, we need two strikers to improve upon last season which should be the aim.

 

DMW proving why he wasn't recruited by Ashley instead of Joe Kinnear!

The squad's perfect man, can't you see. Perfect

 

Some good points DMW, and agree with lots. The bits I disagree with are:

Santon - Yes he has been a liability at times in defence, and yes I know he's a defender - but he shouldn't be. From a defensive point of view he is a wing back at best, but really more suited in a more attacking role - and I still feel he has potential if used in a more attacking way.

Mbiwa - He's a pull your hair out one. What you say makes sense, and yet I also see so much potential there. He has undoubted ability, and can have both composure on the ball and an ability to use it. Since his arrival he has generally played in an under-performing team and I think this has affected his development. I'd persevere for a bit. Not just with Mbiwa, but in general, we need to learn to accept a developmental side to the squad players. We cant/wont afford squad players who are the finished article, and so developing 'almost-ready' players is the next best option. I do think players like that struggle here partly because of us though. A passionate crowd is both a blessing and a curse. Haidara would probably fit a similar description as this to me.

The other one I can't make my mind up on is Cisse. The problem with Cisse is that we know he CAN hit that barn door, and hit it very well. He has the ability but not the form. I'd definitely stick with him as a squad player.

I think, in general, we need to accept that some of those not good enough to be starters are good enough to be squad players here. I do believe we will sign more this window, if for no other reason than it makes financial sense for the club to spend.

Some of the ones we need to lose will still be here simply because nobody will want them on their current wages and they have long contracts. I don't have an issue with that. If we're going to try and capture players like Cabaye and Debuchey and then accept that they will be sold on for a massive profit then we need to accept that they will need to be on long contracts to attract the fees. The other side of the same coin is that the ones who don't work out will be here until it is in their own financial interests to give up on a good contract, which will probably be the end of that contract. This is part of developing players and these losses are offset by the profits of the the ones who come good. The best we will do with some of these players is to loan them out while still paying part of their wages.

 

Re Mbiwa, try to remember back to Colo's first season when his most common nickname was Colo the Clown. Had an absolute mare for the first year then found his feet. Mbiwa may be the same.

 

That is what I am holding out for. I believe the ability is there.

 

Not a fair comparison for me. Colo's was being slated largely for being beasted and failing to cope physically with the league. The class was there from the very start, he just found the league too quick and too physical. Most professional footballers will adapt to that given time.

The worring thing for me with Mbiwa is he is not only pushed around, he seems a bit thick. He has a bit of the Steven Taylor about him in that he makes rash decisions rushing out of defence. The Everton game at home was an obvious one. Although he played right back, he took up the position on halfway for the corners. He cost us the Barkley going for a ball he was never winning (Colo slipped up after but Mbiwa was the source), and then proceeded to the exact same thing again at the next corner! This was not an isolated incident, he had more bad games than good. Hull, Everton away, the list is as long as your arm. Then there is his passing, he literally tries to pass through bone and sinue at times! He looks perplexed when it doesn't work out.

I'd love to put all this down to pressure but it doesn't seem likely. The excuse is made "ah but he played right back some of it". It doesn't wash, he played a whole season there for Montpellier and when he arrived he came billed as defender who could play right across the back four.

He has had 18 months now. I'd give him another 6 months max and then cut your losses before its too late.

 

Yeah I went a bit medieval on it I just long for the day when we have a good squad, some of them English and this whole charade comes to an end.

 

Have we all really given up so soon on MYM? The arguments against him are fairly weak, in my opinion. He was often out of position in the most competitive league and looked no worse than Liverpool's £18m Sakho. Imagine if the club had thrown the towel in so soon on Jose Enrique, Nobby Solano, Mathieu Debuchy and a whole host of others who arrived with talent and a decent rep, but took a while to settle.

I for one hope he gets the chance, but I would like to see us sign better than Willo to partner him. I don't think it's fair on a young foreign player to come in alongside the woefully limited Williamson or error-prone Saylor and expect them to work miracles. I'd like to see him start alongside Colo, but I'd like Colo to find a voice. That could mean having a better right full-back (i.e. Richards) to communicate, or maybe even a more vocal keeper (Forster?). Defence is a difficult one - for a mid-table club, can we do better than Colo (when on form)? Probably not. MYM was a very promising lad from France, Steven Taylor should have been knocking on England's door by now and by all accounts we have a talented young pool in Good, Streete and - especially - Satka. I can see Pardew's dilemma. The solution is to either buy decent and go 3 at the back (possible) or really go for a strong defender to replace Debuchy.

It's obvious we're going with 2 DM's. This will clearly be rotated between Tiote, Colback and Anita. None are injury prone, so we should get a consistent season here. Sissoko is an emergency choice, as is Santon. Well stocked at DM.

AM is rightly pointed at as another weird area. On paper, Ben Arfa, De Jong and Sissoko mmake for a hell of a threesome. But Ben Arfa doesn't work hard enough, so can't be relied on. The depth is woeful, though Aarons looks outstanding. It would be good for all to get HBA, Jonas, Egghead and Marv off the books. Probably same for Ferguson. I think Sammy deserves one last shot, as backup for the backup. But it's easy to see why Cabella is so essential here. RM is solid, our No 10 is canny and LM is a blank space. Gouff, Sammy and Aarons are all decent options, but that's all they should be. Cabella really gives us a shot at top-10 again. Lack of depth and variety in CAM and RM is a problem, though.

Up front remains a complete mystery. For a club who always prided itself on No9's, we're doing a remarkable job of destroying that. I think we should be spending Cabaye-type money here. Whether that's to tempt Lukaku is the big debate. Lacazette looks good, as does Lasogga, but for me I'd just fcking go for it and get Lukaku in. Chelsea will take less than £20m, and I don't think any CL club wants him. He's rarely injured, has everything in his locker and would offer a foil for both Arma and Cisse. I wouldn't even ask for a second striker if he came. And that would do it. Sorry to sabotage the squad thread with player porn, but:

Richards, Cabella, Lukaku as a must.

Janmaat, Van Dijk, Grenier, Lacazette, Lasogga all brucie bonus.

 

I still rate MYM.
Needs a wee bit more time.

 

18 months? I think that is stretching "so soon". How long exactly do you wait? Another 12 months. Best part of 3 seasons to adapt? Ok if you are 18-21, the lad is 25. He needs to start showing something pretty quick. I feared with him after watching Montpellier in the CL. He was poor. We have to be careful about this previous reputation stuff. No other club took him, Arsenal looked, and turned away. You can't bet countless others did too. Why? As I say the "out of position" excuse doesn't wash. he had more bad games at centre half than good. He also played a lot of football at full back earlier in his career and joined us as a versatile defender.

Enrique came good after 1 season. Nobby took the longest at about 18 months as he struggled badly physically. Debuchy by a month into last season had sorted his **** out. Colo took a season.

MYM is not only struggling physically, we look to have picked up a bit of a duffer. He can't pass the ball 5 yards half the time, is clumsy and looks a penalty waiting to happen, he rushes out of defence with no thought of consequence. He basically lacks a brain. As I say if in another 6 months he is still doing the same ****, we'll have to bite the bullet. There is a strong argument to do it now while he still has some value. Certainly I'd say the argument is far stronger against than for at present. His manager can help him but really it'll have to come from the player himself to change his fortunes. Same as it did from Solano, Enrique, Colo who all admitted they questioned staying after a difficult spell. He needs to show some strength of character, but more than anythign some quality.

 

Understand your pov. For 2014, it's clean slate but with short shrift. I'd sooner see his name on the teamsheet than Williamson, but of course I'd rather see a Richards or Van Dijk than either.

 

The others you mentioned all kept their place and played almost every week through their bad spells. I wouldn't be surprised if both Colo and Enrique had played more games in their first season than MYM has in his 18 months.

I do get what you are saying though. He has had brain farts of the highest order at times. He has also had one r two good spells tho. I still think there might be something worth waiting for.