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The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Friday 16th June)

Discussion in 'Leeds United' started by ellandback, Jun 16, 2023.

  1. ellandback

    ellandback Well-Known Member
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    Good Morning. It's Friday 16th June, and here are the latest headlines from Elland Road

    Roberts on his way to St Andrews

    Birmingham City are on the verge of completing the signing of Tyler Roberts, as Leeds start their rebuilding process with life in the Championship.

    Roberts spent last season on loan with Queens Park Rangers, but returned to Elland Road in March after a calf injury saw his season cut short. He made twenty appearances for the Hoops, scoring four times. As of yet, the fee has not been disclosed, but multiple reports suggest it's seven figures, and includes multiple add-ons.

    Leeds snapped him up in the dying hours of the 2018 Winter transfer window for £2.5m (from West Brom) but never really lived up to his potential. He made 101 appearances for the Whites, mostly under Bielsa's watch, and netted nine times.

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    Hammond bought in to navigate Summer transfer window

    With the transfer window in full flow, Leeds have bought in experienced Director of Football Nick Hammond on a three month contract to help oversee, what is expected to be a turbulent couple of months for the Whites. The 55yo former lower league goalkeeper has his work cut out. Departures are likely to run into double figures, whilst they also try to build a squad, capable of automatic promotion at the first time of asking.

    After retiring in 2000, Hammond stayed on at Reading, learning about player recruitment, handling incoming transfer offers, negotiating player contracts and scouting assignments. He left in 2016, where he then had successful spells at West Brom and Celtic.

    He joined Newcastle Utd on a short term contract to help them through the 2022 January transfer window, whilst they waited for Dan Ashworth to arrive from Brighton. During this time, he was instrumental in the signings of Kieran Trippier, Bruno Guimaraes, Dan Burn and Chris Wood.

    According to Phil Hay, Leeds are conducting a major review of their recruitment and scouting departments.
    Hammond’s arrival will allow 49ers Enterprises to take their time in making sure their next appointment is the right one.

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    Girona looking to hijack Roca deal

    Spanish media outlet 'Fichajes' have reported that Girona are poised to hijack Marc Roca's loan move to Real Bettis. The 26yo was due to sign a season long loan with the Saville based club in the next few days, subject to a permanent deal next Summer, but interest from the Blanquivermells, have put a spanner in the works.

    Roca, a €12m buy from Bayern Munich last Summer, started his Elland Road career strongly, before tailing off after the World Cup. Leeds will be keen to remove his salary from their books. It is estimated that Leeds spent £56,420,000 on wages last season (22/23 according to Capology); £48,390,000 more than it cost Luton Town to swap places with them.

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    Koch on Manchester Utd's radar

    Robin Koch is on Manchester United's shortlist according to Sky Sports in Germany. According to journalist Florian Plettenberg 'loose talks' having taken place between the bitter rivals over Koch's availability.

    Koch, 27 next month made the most number of appearances in a Leeds shirt last season (36 league), racking up 3178 minutes of game time. He's been a player who continues to divide opinion. Some see him as just above average whilst others rave about him. He joined Leeds during the Summer of 2020, as they headed to the top flight, for a fee in the region of £13m. He has twelve months left on his four year contract.

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  2. wakeybreakyheart

    wakeybreakyheart Well-Known Member

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    Morning everybody and salutations glorious leader.
     
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  3. Irishshako

    Irishshako Well-Known Member

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    Morning all. Not bothered with speculation, when and if it happens and appears on the OS then I'll believe it. In an ideal world I'd had hoped those players who let us down last season would have offered to stay and fight for a season and if we weren't promoted straight away they could then leave. But we don't live in an ideal world. <ok>
     
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  4. milkyboy

    milkyboy Well-Known Member

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    Opinion is indeed divided on Koch… there’s a third category though… those who’ve always thought he was gash defensively with the turning circle and acceleration of a super tanker.

    Be great to see him at old Trafford

    Sadly I suspect the ‘loose conversations’ went something like this:
    koch’s agent to Man U:” would you like Robin at Man U?”

    Man U: ‘well we need a new bus driver’
     
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  5. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Can't agree Shaks. I hope never to see last seasons mob in a Leeds jersey again (Rodrigo exception). Their capitulation since the Palace game was nothing short of disgraceful and they were simply an embarrassment. In an ideal world every one of their contracts should be terminated. Roberts 700k. Just about sums up an accurate value of him. Likely cost us that in agents fee to move him on.
    Not surprised 49ers are taking their time to go through entire operation. They are using many millions of investors cash and their reputation depends on producing positive results
     
    #5
  6. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    We can all slag off some of our players who in reality are full internationals and wanted by other prem clubs and indeed European clubs. Starting with the Bielsa boys who were brought in to play a specific way but through injuries or square pegging in season2 prem it never happened. Llorente, Koch, Firpo, Rodrigo. Rodders is wanted by Villa and Brighton as well as PSG and various Spanish clubs. Koch wanted by a few prem clubs as well as German, Llorente wanted by Roma and various Spanish clubs and even Firpo wanted by Betis. These players never really got to play the football they expected and under the last 4 coaches. The Marsch group again expected to play RedBullBall but Marsch tweaked it so much his players looked lost.

    its been the worst 2 seasons ever for Leeds fans and we were rudderless and going backwards but for me the management and coaches were to blame but yes some of the players deserve a kicking and some of the March boys were deffo not prem class but were left floundering and you knew they were upset with Marsch because not one said he was sorry to see him gone
     
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  7. milkyboy

    milkyboy Well-Known Member

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    I’m being flippant about Koch, Doc. He’s a good footballer and has a good attitude. Recognised he needed to bulk up physically after the first season, and made the changes. I personally don’t think his game is suited to the pace of the premier league but like llorente I think he’ll do fine abroad.

    Given he’s available cheap it will be interesting if another Prem club comes in for him. Big Sam knows a defender and liked him so I may have him wrong.

    I do agree that being a defender at Leeds under bielsa and marsch was a challenging gig due to the systems played… but it seemed like whatever system played these lot continually made individual mistakes
     
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  8. wakeybreakyheart

    wakeybreakyheart Well-Known Member

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    Yeah but koch i would not believe is 27 and does not have the fight for this league.
     
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  9. wakeybreakyheart

    wakeybreakyheart Well-Known Member

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    Sinner did fine when fit so must be worth keeping.
     
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  10. wakeybreakyheart

    wakeybreakyheart Well-Known Member

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    Too slow was our problems in defence last season.
     
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  11. milkyboy

    milkyboy Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure on this 'players were upset with Marsch' thing Doc. They might all have hated the football (though the redbull guys couldn't really be surprised). I think it's possible the players were reminded to keep quiet when marsch was sacked. Comments about ex-managers normally tend to come when the players themselves have moved on - they'e too busy at the time towing the party line by bigging up the current coach. The bielsa outpouring was a bit of a one-off. How many have come out and said they were sorry to see Gracia go?

    Feedback on Marsch from his time at previous clubs eg leipzig was that some players liked his system, and some definitely didn't. Most however seemed to like him personally and his man-management. Naturally that will depend on whether you're in the team or not and you've referenced Drameh, Klich and Joffy regularly in the past. But when asked directly Bamford said he had a good relationship, Wober said he missed him.

    Reality is footballers are happiest when they are in the team and winning. Whoever the manager is.
     
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  12. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    Milky don’t disagree re the RedBull boys but my view is that they came to play RedBullBall but Marsch realised it needed tweaking to work in the prem and so tried but failed badly. It was like he tried a different variant every week which again failed and was even uglier? Think they were a bit lost and scratching their heads
     
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  13. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Yes but far too injury prone so of little use to us either. 46 games plus couple of cup games. How many games did he play last season
     
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  14. Irishshako

    Irishshako Well-Known Member

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    I said in an ideal world Eire. Those players who want out are the ones who cost us our Premiership, but they are being rewarded by their failure and will still make their money else where. Pity they couldn't be forced to stay one season. But I get what you're saying.<ok>
     
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  15. Irishshako

    Irishshako Well-Known Member

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    More than Phillips:emoticon-0136-giggl:emoticon-0105-wink:
     
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  16. Irishshako

    Irishshako Well-Known Member

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    It won't happen anyway Wakey. I was just thinking, what if they had morals and wanted to try and fight for the club. FFS I wish I hadn't posted now.<doh>
     
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  17. milkyboy

    milkyboy Well-Known Member

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    What can a manager do?

    All 3 (Skoobs is still at the club) ex managers we had this season have all made the same comments.... We created chances, didn't take them, gave soft goals away. Gracia likened us to a chinny boxer and psychologically scarred, Sam that we made mistakes in matches we didn't make in training. Basically, we didn't have it between the ears as individuals/team. All have said we lost the key moments, played well until we had a set back.. just needed a break in luck etc etc,

    Of course Managers want to make it sound like the performances were ok. But the stats do generally back this up.

    I carp on about what a manager can control and what he can't. Anyone involved in coaching will tell you that you can influence the processes but can't control the outcomes. When Marsch came in last year he had a physically, but mainly mentally, battered squad and went about his chirpy 'we can do this team' motivational schtick to try and pick them up. This season we seemed up for it, under him but couldn't stop the flood of errors. New people came in, new strategies, the problem remained... and arguably got worse as confidence drained.

    So what would a 'good' manager have done? Under all 4 managers this season, playing very different styles and formations, we had games where, by all objective measures, we were the better team. So i'd argue it wasn't about styles and formations... it was about 1. ability - by which I mean inconsistent players, and 2. confidence/mental belief.

    Could a 'good' manager improve those points by strength of players just buying into him on past reputation? Could he ease the pressure by telling them their place is secure and to just express themselves. Or do you think that having a consistent system and playing style would string some results together and confidence would come from that? Interested in people's views.
     
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  18. Brizzlewhite

    Brizzlewhite Well-Known Member

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    IMHO there are good players somewhere in Koch and Roca and other managers obviously see something.
     
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  19. Brizzlewhite

    Brizzlewhite Well-Known Member

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    Or too slow for the style we tried to play? Plenty of old school CBs in the PL who make it work.
     
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  20. Brizzlewhite

    Brizzlewhite Well-Known Member

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    I'm very pleased that the 49ers are going through everything. Very slowly. They have too much at stake to do otherwise.
     
    #20
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2023

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