The July Cup!

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If I may just wind up a little more, for a laugh, poor old ****er Watson, having only his second run after 2 years of a different sort of exercise, reared on leaving the stalls and was still only 6l behind at the finish having clearly not been punished when no chance of winning.
 
Personally Ron I wouldn't be drawing formlines from sprints, we know how inconsistent they are, and on there days any horse can win, it's like they take it in turns to win.

But DA looks like he could be a cut above, he has run in 3 G1 sprints and won them all, and was only beaten when running over further. The way he won today was so impressive, as soon he hit daylight, he just burst to the front with just hands and heels, he looked to me like he had loads in hand on the field. My worry would be the trainer, I'm not a fan of Mr Simcock, he has made plenty of errors with DA already, but I do feel that DA can dominate the sprints and notch up win after win :biggrin:
 
I dont think anyone is suggesting Dream Ahead could be as good as Dayjur.He wont be and never will be.
But if we are mentioning DA in the same sentence that cant be a bad thing can it?Its been 21 years since the great horse raced,and there hasnt been a Euro horse anywhere close to him.
Its about time we did have one.
 
Ron said:
If I may just wind up a little more, for a laugh, poor old ****er Watson, having only his second run after 2 years of a different sort of exercise, reared on leaving the stalls and was still only 6l behind at the finish having clearly not been punished when no chance of winning.
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I think you're right about old Winker, he'll win something before the years out <ok>
 
Cheers Beefy. Good fun last night. I was just winding down from an eventful day.
 
DB....Obviously it's premature to compare him to Dayjur, but you can never say never, if you ignore DAs runs over further, he is unbeaten in sprints, winning 3 G1s. Yesterday was his first race against "proper" experienced sprinters and he beat them very easily, without even needing the whip.

So DA has done nothing wrong over 6f, bar impress. Unfortunately he will probably win a couple more sprints and then be retired at the end of the season, but if he is allowed to race on til 5 or 6, I'd be confident he can win many G1s :biggrin:
 
I agree Shergy, I was very taken by him yesterday. Unfortunately it's in human nature to be slightly cycnical when it comes to believing what we're seeing it going to be one of the greats but as you imply there's nowt to suggest he won't go on to become very, very good and who knows?
 
beeforsalmon said:
I agree Shergy, I was very taken by him yesterday. Unfortunately it's in human nature to be slightly cycnical when it comes to believing what we're seeing it going to be one of the greats but as you imply there's nowt to suggest he won't go on to become very, very good and who knows?
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I was very taken too and that's the best Euro performance ive seen since Dayjur.Hes obviously a very talented horse and i would love him to sweep the sprinting honours for the next couple of years.
 
beeforsalmon said:
I think people must be very well informed to go around and state that 'It appears full well that Simcock knew he wasn't a miler' <laugh> Sometimes I wonder why they even pay trainers to do the job at all!

I would suggest the the fact he stayed 6 furlongs in soft ground as a 2 year old gave him some hope that he would stay but who am I to question <laugh>
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If interpreting the trainers comments makes me "very well informed" then i suppose i am. From everything that i have heard from David Simcock it seems pretty apparent that he has always been of the belief that he was a sprinter and not a miler. It is ludicrous to argue otherwise. There is absolutely no way that he would have been running in the July Cup if connections actually believed he was a miler. If they were confident, or had any belief at all, in his ability to stay a mile then i am sure he would have been given other opportunities to prove it. It is well known that the sprinting division is the poor relation to the milers and middle distancers.

My suggestion would be that the owner was keen to 'give it a go', against the better judgement of the trainer. He had one attempt, where there were valid excuses (seasonal reappearance, etc), and was then put straight back over sprint distances. That hardly smacks of a trainer who is confident in his charges ability to stay a mile.

I know Simcock's pupil assistant well, and was speaking to him earlier in the season. I asked how the horse was and he strongly suggested that the mile attempt was more in hope than expectation. This was on the day of the 2000 Guineas and he was already suggesting that we would see him at his best over sprint trips when he had yet to attempt a mile.

I hope that goes someway to justifying my comments. :emoticon-0105-wink:
 
Lovely win by Dream Ahead. Finished like a train and looked nice and fresh. I know nothing of the trainer, but he had the horse spot on the money.

I've seem Delegator being written off already, but he put in a sterling performance, as did Genki.

I have to say though, that the race seemed a bit flat, with a load of chances still alive at the furlong. This hardly heralds great things any of the runners, winner included. A very nice G1 win by an above average 3yo, but he'll have to improve some to be a Global contender. Very nice start to a career though.
 
Zenyatta....Have you seen the prize money in races such as the Golden Jubilee and July Cup, they are certainly not a poor relation to mile and middle distance races, yes there isn't a classic over 6f but it is a far harder division to dominate, than the mile division, that's why we haven't seen a dominant force in the division since Dayjur, it takes a special horse to win 3 or 4 G1 sprints in a season, as they will often have to overcome bad draws, and traffic problems :biggrin:
 
King Shergar said:
Hardy.....I did not say he would prove the real deal just over a mile, I said he would be the real deal over all distances up to a mile. I have always maintained he was a top class sprinter, and I made an article on Golden Juvilee day on this forum that Dream Ahead would have pissed home had he been entered in the race with the soft ground. I didnt fancy him today because of the ground, but he is clearly still a very good animal on good to firm.

Like i told you all along Wooton Basset was the most overrated 2yo of last season, he beat next to nothing, and was targeted at poor races, that's why he was unbeaten. Dream Ahead is a completely different class of animal!

Beef....Id completely agree, Dream Ahead was hugely impressive, I remember Starspangledbanner getting loads of praise last season, yet he was flogged in every sprint he won. As soon as DA seen daylight he just cruised to the front :biggrin:
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shergy i can assure you that you said he would be top class over a mile and i was the one saying he was bred for sprinting, so what if you made an article a few weeks ago about targetting him at the golden jubilee i'm referring to last year when you would not accept that he was bred for sprinting.


And if you think wootton bassett beat next to nothing last year then i think you might just need to reassess how you read form.
 
While it was a nice win I think I would like to see Dream Ahead do it again before we start comparing him to horses such as Dayjur. As Shergar says these sprints tend to be shared around and it would be good to see this horse jump out from the pack. But for me he still has to do that. Also I don't think enough credit has been given to Turner - she did the job well on what was a big occasion for her and it would be good to see her keep the ride.
 
I said he would stay a mile Hardy, but I never said that would be his optimum distance. he ran over a mile at Ascot on his seasonal debut and was hardly disgraced against horses who had already had a few runs this season. had he been race fit who knows?

He will always be at his best In sprints but he will have the class to win a G1 over a mile, trust me :biggrin:
 
King Shergar said:
Zenyatta....Have you seen the prize money in races such as the Golden Jubilee and July Cup, they are certainly not a poor relation to mile and middle distance races, yes there isn't a classic over 6f but it is a far harder division to dominate, than the mile division, that's why we haven't seen a dominant force in the division since Dayjur, it takes a special horse to win 3 or 4 G1 sprints in a season, as they will often have to overcome bad draws, and traffic problems :biggrin:
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I'm not considering the prize money, I'm considering the prestige. And perhaps the requirement for luck in running, and therefore the failure of one horse to mark themself out as the best of the bunch is the reason for this.

In that respect sprints are most definitely the poor relation to the middle distance runners and milers. This is perhaps why we are so inferior in this regard to the rest of the world, whilst we dominate in the middel distance arena. And by 'we' i mean GB, IRE and France.
 
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