Sarri ball, what it work?

[chelsea - over 100 years of history]

You can probably tell I'm fuming this morning and on a rant, but to counter the Sarri sack watch, thought I'd throw this up.

If in the unlikely event Sarri keeps his job into next season, what can we expect and what is required to get so called Sarri ball working?

Sarri's lack of any plan B or flexibility at least makes this consideration easier. He will clearly play 433, he will clearly keep playing Jorginho and Kante in their respective positions.

Given our start to the season, why was Sarri ball working then but not now? Were the players still playing it poorly then as well but the opposition just hadn't adapted? Or have we gone backwards? I suspect more towards the former. Therefore is it really a case of being able to train these players to play it better when they were seemingly playing it ok at the start of the season but it's too easy to defend against once it's been studied? Can these players ever play it sufficiently?

Pep had a similar (ish) problem in his first year. He realised he needed better ball playing and quick defenders and a sweeper keeper to implement his style of playing out from the back. He also cottoned on quite quickly that Aguero is bloody brilliant and shouldn't be dropped for a half decent teenager! So in the summer they spent a small fortune on a keeper and full backs, played Aguero when fit and they've never looked back. Carrying on the Pep comparison, has Sarri made a single Chelsea player better? Pep worked wonders with some of his players, particularly Sterling. I've not seen anything of the like from Sarri and in fact a lot have gone backwards this season. Alonso, Azpi and Willian being most notable and players Sarri has brought into the team (Jorginho, Barkley, Kovacic) have been hugely underwhelming.

Are our issues so easily solved? Are there obvious personnel weaknesses in how Sarri wants to play? Are they few enough that a decent summer window could solve? Because you could maybe get in 2-3 players to get it working but you won't get in 6-7. I fear it's more like 6-7 that are needed, especially assuming Hazard goes.

Some will point to the youth players as being able to step up. However Sarri doesn't trust these players so we can't expect that's going to change over night. The lack of game time in meaningful games for CHO, Ampadu and RLC bears this out. Christensen is maybe trusted a bit more, but is probably the weakest prospect out of the 4. He may come in if Luiz is let go.

So assuming in the summer we have this squad less Hazard and with Pulasic, what changes are needed? I suspect in the full back positions, and in most attacking areas of the pitch where the press isn't working and the attack is easily nullified.

Thoughts!?!?!

 

[chelsea - over 100 years of history]

title should be 'can it work'! can't seem to edit title.

 

[BobbyD]

You can probably tell I'm fuming this morning and on a rant, but to counter the Sarri sack watch, thought I'd throw this up.

If in the unlikely event Sarri keeps his job into next season, what can we expect and what is required to get so called Sarri ball working?

Sarri's lack of any plan B or flexibility at least makes this consideration easier. He will clearly play 433, he will clearly keep playing Jorginho and Kante in their respective positions.

Given our start to the season, why was Sarri ball working then but not now? Were the players still playing it poorly then as well but the opposition just hadn't adapted? Or have we gone backwards? I suspect more towards the former. Therefore is it really a case of being able to train these players to play it better when they were seemingly playing it ok at the start of the season but it's too easy to defend against once it's been studied? Can these players ever play it sufficiently?

Pep had a similar (ish) problem in his first year. He realised he needed better ball playing and quick defenders and a sweeper keeper to implement his style of playing out from the back. He also cottoned on quite quickly that Aguero is bloody brilliant and shouldn't be dropped for a half decent teenager! So in the summer they spent a small fortune on a keeper and full backs, played Aguero when fit and they've never looked back. Carrying on the Pep comparison, has Sarri made a single Chelsea player better? Pep worked wonders with some of his players, particularly Sterling. I've not seen anything of the like from Sarri and in fact a lot have gone backwards this season. Alonso, Azpi and Willian being most notable and players Sarri has brought into the team (Jorginho, Barkley, Kovacic) have been hugely underwhelming.

Are our issues so easily solved? Are there obvious personnel weaknesses in how Sarri wants to play? Are they few enough that a decent summer window could solve? Because you could maybe get in 2-3 players to get it working but you won't get in 6-7. I fear it's more like 6-7 that are needed, especially assuming Hazard goes.

Some will point to the youth players as being able to step up. However Sarri doesn't trust these players so we can't expect that's going to change over night. The lack of game time in meaningful games for CHO, Ampadu and RLC bears this out. Christensen is maybe trusted a bit more, but is probably the weakest prospect out of the 4. He may come in if Luiz is let go.

So assuming in the summer we have this squad less Hazard and with Pulasic, what changes are needed? I suspect in the full back positions, and in most attacking areas of the pitch where the press isn't working and the attack is easily nullified.

Thoughts!?!?!

If pulisic makes half the runs Pedro used to make them that would be good as no one makes any runs.

We need a creative dynamic and powerful midfield like pogba because kovacic and kante don't have that power or passing range.

Mainly i blame sarris tactics. I reckon kovacic would be a monster in jorginhos position.

Oh and some dominating fbs as we have no width

 

[chelsea - over 100 years of history]

If pulisic makes half the runs Pedro used to make them that would be good as no one makes any runs.

We need a creative dynamic and powerful midfield like pogba because kovacic and kante don't have that power or passing range.

Mainly i blame sarris tactics. I reckon kovacic would be a monster in jorginhos position.

Oh and some dominating fbs as we have no width

The Kovacic, Barkley, Kante midfield is definitely a big problem. They are all good players and do some nice things, they don't lose the ball often and often you can see they are putting in a shift. But basically they rarely threaten the goal or rarely provide a direct assist. Part of our over arcing problem is not creating chances and being too 1 dimensional.

Kovacic hasn't scored a single goal this season. Barkley has a handful, Kante, 2 or 3.

Basically remove Hazard and we bang average. I said at the start of the season this midfield has no goals in it and been proven right so far. But it's been that way for a while. It's taken exceptional seasons from Hazard and Costa in the years we won the title. Costa's gone and Hazard is being expected to do it all.

I agree the full backs are a problem but both are on long term contracts and were top class players a year ago. So does that fall on Sarri. Does that also show poor planning to sign up players who are suited to the system we want to play? It a mess

 

[BobbyD]

The Kovacic, Barkley, Kante midfield is definitely a big problem. They are all good players and do some nice things, they don't lose the ball often and often you can see they are putting in a shift. But basically they rarely threaten the goal or rarely provide a direct assist. Part of our over arcing problem is not creating chances and being too 1 dimensional.

Kovacic hasn't scored a single goal this season. Barkley has a handful, Kante, 2 or 3.

Basically remove Hazard and we bang average. I said at the start of the season this midfield has no goals in it and been proven right so far. But it's been that way for a while. It's taken exceptional seasons from Hazard and Costa in the years we won the title. Costa's gone and Hazard is being expected to do it all.

I agree the full backs are a problem but both are on long term contracts and were top class players a year ago. So does that fall on Sarri. Does that also show poor planning to sign up players who are suited to the system we want to play? It a mess

Dave is solid although he's going through a bad period (rashford and sterling have had him on toast). Hopefully it's form rather than his age. He's got a great cross on him but he's just not a modern attacking fullback.

Alonsos always been sketchy. Under conte he didn't need to defend as much and his energy is a big plus. He was always great when he has time on his left peg and hes great at attacking set pieces with his height (not so good at defending them).

He's just not a great left back and Luiz isn't that great at covering him. Since his injury i just don't think he's confident defending one on ones when he wasn't brilliant at it before.

I'm not sure if this midfield can't manage goals or whether they are held back by sarris tactics. It didn't help that Willian and hazard always come inside and that higuain is also dropping in. They definitely need to be getting into the box more rather than just sitting outside it.

I'm unfair actually kante gets in there but he's just not technically good enough or tall enough in there lol

 

[chelsea - over 100 years of history]

Dave is solid although he's going through a bad period (rashford and sterling have had him on toast). Hopefully it's form rather than his age. He's got a great cross on him but he's just not a modern attacking fullback.

Alonsos always been sketchy. Under conte he didn't need to defend as much and his energy is a big plus. He was always great when he has time on his left peg and hes great at attacking set pieces with his height (not so good at defending them).

He's just not a great left back and Luiz isn't that great at covering him. Since his injury i just don't think he's confident defending one on ones when he wasn't brilliant at it before.

I'm not sure if this midfield can't manage goals or whether they are held back by sarris tactics. It didn't help that Willian and hazard always come inside and that higuain is also dropping in. They definitely need to be getting into the box more rather than just sitting outside it.

I'm unfair actually kante gets in there but he's just not technically good enough or tall enough in there lol

This is the big problem changing to a manager with such a vastly different system and footballing philosophy. We've gone from a countering 343 to a possession 433 and the players that suited the former probably don't suit the later. Which I think is what you are saying.

Dave carved a niche in a back 3, Alonso is a brilliant LWB, Luiz looked good in a 3. All 3 look far worse in a back 4, particularly a back 4 without the protection of a DM / Kante.

So if we stick with Sarri, that's arguably 3 of the back 4 that will have to be replaced. Yet he doesn't rate Emerson or Zappacosta either who are probably more modern full backs.

Not getting in the box is a huge bug bare of mine. The amount of times Higuain (Giroud / Morata) is surrounded by 3-4 players and we're just pass pass pass outside the box. Even if a cross comes in, chances of someone getting on it is slim. And as you say, Kante isn't suited to that anyway. Oh for the days of Lampard's inventive runs and finishing.

 

[BobbyD]

This is the big problem changing to a manager with such a vastly different system and footballing philosophy. We've gone from a countering 343 to a possession 433 and the players that suited the former probably don't suit the later. Which I think is what you are saying.

Dave carved a niche in a back 3, Alonso is a brilliant LWB, Luiz looked good in a 3. All 3 look far worse in a back 4, particularly a back 4 without the protection of a DM / Kante.

So if we stick with Sarri, that's arguably 3 of the back 4 that will have to be replaced. Yet he doesn't rate Emerson or Zappacosta either who are probably more modern full backs.

Not getting in the box is a huge bug bare of mine. The amount of times Higuain (Giroud / Morata) is surrounded by 3-4 players and we're just pass pass pass outside the box. Even if a cross comes in, chances of someone getting on it is slim. And as you say, Kante isn't suited to that anyway. Oh for the days of Lampard's inventive runs and finishing.

I don't necessarily think we dont have the players for it i just think he has the personnel wrong.

Dave wont give us that attacking width and umph we need with kante and willian there its worse. Hudson should go out there.

I dont think hazard is suited to left wing either, he worked hard yesterday granted but he doesnt fit that pressing game in there. Hes also the one player who can work in tight spaces and he loves to wonder anyway so play him in the hole with a free role is perfect.

Kovacic and kante would be my 2 in the middle as they have that blend of athletism and passing.

Would personally prefer emerson emerson than alonso but with 2 shields that back 4 wouldnt be as exposed. I would probably put rlc or willian on that left wing.

We need to go 4 2 3 1

 

[chelsea - over 100 years of history]

I don't necessarily think we dont have the players for it i just think he has the personnel wrong.

Dave wont give us that attacking width and umph we need with kante and willian there its worse. Hudson should go out there.

I dont think hazard is suited to left wing either, he worked hard yesterday granted but he doesnt fit that pressing game in there. Hes also the one player who can work in tight spaces and he loves to wonder anyway so play him in the hole with a free role is perfect.

Kovacic and kante would be my 2 in the middle as they have that blend of athletism and passing.

Would personally prefer emerson emerson than alonso but with 2 shields that back 4 wouldnt be as exposed. I would probably put rlc or willian on that left wing.

We need to go 4 2 3 1

I certainly think the players we have are better suited to 4231 but Sarri seems pretty unwilling to play anything other than 433 and I'm not sure we have the players to play 433 well and in the way Sarri wants. We obviously played a 433 under Jose in his first stint but we had much better defenders and one of the best DM's ever, plus goals from midfield and brilliant wingers.

So if Sarri won't adapt, that can only mean he is sacked or a large change in personnel in the next window. If it's the later, it's going to be on the hope of sari ball being effective with the right personnel and still probably shutting out youth. Seems a pretty expensive risk on a manger with no real pedigree. Can't see the club taking that risk. I think they thought it was as simple as, we want to play more attractive football, Napoli play attractive football, lets get their manager.

I'd go 4231 for the remainder of the season at least.

 

[BobbyD]

I certainly think the players we have are better suited to 4231 but Sarri seems pretty unwilling to play anything other than 433 and I'm not sure we have the players to play 433 well and in the way Sarri wants. We obviously played a 433 under Jose in his first stint but we had much better defenders and one of the best DM's ever, plus goals from midfield and brilliant wingers.

So if Sarri won't adapt, that can only mean he is sacked or a large change in personnel in the next window. If it's the later, it's going to be on the hope of sari ball being effective with the right personnel and still probably shutting out youth. Seems a pretty expensive risk on a manger with no real pedigree. Can't see the club taking that risk. I think they thought it was as simple as, we want to play more attractive football, Napoli play attractive football, lets get their manager.

I'd go 4231 for the remainder of the season at least.

Well if he wants 4 3 3 hes going to have to let the cms off their shackles and let them run forward. Hes going to have to put rudiger on the left side of defence to cover alonso.

He still needs to play hudson and play rlc as well as dropping jorginho for kante.

 

[Gareth1808]

I think this system has showed how important full backs are nowadays. Neither suit our style and neither of them are dynamic enough. I actually Emerson and Zappacosta are better suited but I’m not a huge fan of those two either....

I agree with Bobby, I think Kovacic suits Jorginhos role perfectly. Great on the ball and getting out of tight spaces but he’s decent in defence and will get about the pitch more. I think him with RLC and Kante either side would fit better or even with RLC as a 10.

Centre backs also an issue, Rudiger just looks good cause the rest of em are that bad and the keeper doesn’t make the situation any better either.

Manager has to adapt more, he obviously has a way he wants to play but sometimes there needs to be some adjustments and doing the same thing every game just means the opposition already know everything about us before the game has even started!

 

[Chelsea Pensioner]

4 2 3 1 looks the obvious answer for the rest of the season, especially with Kante and Kovacic as the 2 and RLC as one of the 3.
That it's become guesswork is a big negative of Sarri. At the start he had the chance to use this season to sort EVERYTHING out without the pressure of winning. Everyone was prepared for a longish period of settling in. He wasted that by never experimenting or trying different people in different roles, instead perhaps settling too quickly on his 1st 11, seemingly in order of their weekly pay packet plus who he'd brought in.
Now it's all gone belly up, he is looking increasingly likely to miss top 4 and, again, win absolutely nothing. And winning anything seems to be more important to him than progressing the Team properly.
As for the changes, well firstly the midfield is putting huge pressure on the back 4, because it is simply over run by opposition mids too often who then blitz our back 4. Plus our mids never get forward or attempt to join any attack. That is totally down to Sarri and can be largely remedied with instructions and personnel changes.
Hazard and CHO should be wide men and Higuan the 1.
Try something like that and see if the back 4 improve before making changes there as well. If not, try Rudy at left back and bring in Christensen and start to use Ampadu, who might be the best kid we have.
Next summer we need to replace Willian or Pedro, maybe Luiz, Alonso, Jorghino, Barkley and Giroud. We will probably lose CHO, Hazard and Kante, possibly RLC.
If Sarri stays, we are looking at a huge turnover. Is it worth it, or should we fire Sarri and start another season of uncertainty , some 200 mill poorer ?
Trouble is if Zinadane comes in, it all starts over again and we're back to square one.