Bare with me here. Now Is Peter Ried our greatest manager in living memory? Now I'm too young to remember Stokoe the first time round. It is arguable that two top filght 7th place finishes are harder to achieve than a cup win. Again I'm too young to know where Sunderland finished in the top flight under Stokoe? Don't get me wrong, gicven the choice between "THE" cup and two 7th places, I'd take the cup. I would say in most people's living memory these two are sadly the most succesful at the club. Now I remember when Peter Reid was our manager and I don't think anyone give Peter Reid God like status? I think most of us could se he had flaws and was perhaps more of a lucky manager than a great manager or did we underrate him? The one thing Reid did know was the value of Niall Quinn and how to build a team around him. I think you can equate Ried's success to Quinn. When he lost Quinn Ried lost the plot. He had no plan be and couldn't find another Niall Quinn, in the end buying Flo and the rest was history. Managers since Reid have not been great, Howard Wilkinson perhaps the clubs greatest mistake? Then pretty much a bunch of also rans. I did hold out some hope for Roy Keane but that was all based on his playing career and the fact he'd played under great managers. Keane proved to be a failure in my opinion, a man who lacked the bottle to see his job through. So now we come to Martin O'Neill and I think the majority of our supporters would agree if given the choice of Martin O'Neill and Peter Reid at least 90% would choose Martin O'Neill. In fact at the time when Reid was our manager I'm sure we played O'Neill's team and were unlucky to be knocked out in the semi final of the league cup by the eventual winners, Leicester City. I think back then the vast majority would have taken O'Neill to be our manager and over 10 years on most of us would make the same chioice. So anyway I'm delighted we have O'Neill but the tough question is can he take Sunderland to the same heights as Peter Reid? His track record would suggest yes. However is the premier league tougher than it was 10 years ago? I would suggest a month ago most of us thought 7th place this season was a realistic proposition. Has an opportunity been lost? Have we all under estimated the genius of Peter Reid or will O'Neill put Reidy in his place and become SAFC's most succesful mordern day manager? Could he achieve immortality and win something like Stokoe........? Opinions please.
We played the best football I've ever seen under Peter Reid imo Summerbee and Johnston down the wings, Quinn and Phillips up front, brilliant, Shame on Bob Murray for not backing him when we needed him to
Agree 100% - we had some magic seasons under Reid and I loved him as manager. It did go pear-shaped later though when his limitations as a manager were exposed. Given we had 2 promotions under Reid, and 2 x 7th placed finishes I'd have to say yes that is the benchmark as I can't think of any alternative at the moment.
Very good post mate and I tend to agree in most. I'd still say Denis Smith is the 'greatest' manager in my lifetime because without him, I don't think SAFC would exist in the same way it does today. That 3rd division campaign could have gone either way and that we stormed the league and subsequently got back to the First division (as it was then) in such a short space of time was the work of genius. Had Murray backed Denis, I think we would have had a manager for 15 years or more, as his record of buying was fantastic IMO and some of the football, given his resources, was exhilarating. Gabbers & Bally were his star signings but the likes of Byrne & Goodman were bought on shoestring budgets and he brought on the likes of Mickey Gray, Gary Owers and Gordon Armstrong via the youths. If he had money, he would have been dynamite imo. However, the best football I have seen in my 38 years was under Reid no doubt and that for football sakes, is the benchmark for Martin. Reidy finished top 7 for 2 years running and thats what Martin will be aiming to do. Whether he achieves it or not, I expect that the standards and ease with which we handle the EPL to improve considerably next season for sure and have a balanced steady consistent season.
Good Points Cest. I used to go to games with someone who consistently hailed Denis Smith as the most important managerial appointment we'd made for years - for just the reasons you state. Going down to the third for the first time ever could have sent the club into terminal decline. As it was Smith got us straight back up and we played some great football into the bargain. Gabbiadini and Eric Gates was a great combination !
I don't think people can actually grasp just what a perilous situation the club were in back in the summer of 1987. Third division football for the club that only 30 years previous had been hailed as the bank of England club and never been relegated from the top flight, found themselves in the 3rd tier of English football. Without a miracle, we could have just faded away to nothing and become another old giant that had died. Denis grabbed the club by the scruff of the neck and in a his own image, fashioned a tough hard fighting machine that got us out of the doldrums and back into the top flight in 3 years. How high do I rate the saviour of SAFC? Higher than any other in the clubs history mate that's how high and I had the opportunity to tell him my feelings at a sportsmans event some years ago. He was absolutely stunned and very moved. Complete gentleman and top man imo. I'll tell you another story why he is my all time favourite and a few lads may have been there on the night. A few months before he was sacked, just after he let Viv Busby go and it was going tits up, he agreed to come to a supporters meeting at the Framwellgate WMC, Durham. There were about 200 or so supporters there and they were baying for blood. He was late arriving and many fans thought he wouldn't come but all of a sudden he burst into the room, all on his own, marched to the stage and sat down. He grabbed the microphone and just said "right come on then" By the end of night he was almost carried out head high. Only a real man would have the balls, knowing that he was going to be sacked anyway, to face his tormentors and be dammed. I've never seen as many grown men want to shake another blokes hand and pat him on the back. A true SAFC hero and legend for me.
Cest' stop it I'm near to bloody tears here man! I found that last post very moving. Have to agree with you Cest' Dennis Smith was a legend. I was a boy when I watched Sunderland then. Just started going to the Sunderland matches with my mates etc. When you point out some of his signings it does make you wonder what if? I suppose the annoying thing was back then it probably would have taken not much money to become a contender. At the time I know Bob Murray was highly disliked as he never spent any money. Today we are thankful to him for the new stadium and he did give us the Peter Reid years. You could say Dennis smiths team did get to Wembley too. I know Crosby was the manager but it was Smith's team.
Yes, great memories of Peter Reid's team. They would have been eenbetter if Murray had allowed him to buy Hutchinson 12 months earlier..... I have a lot of time for Denis Smith. Success with little money. I was sorry to see him go. I always thought he would end up at Stoke as manager but never happened. I recall Smith recounting a discussion he had with Alan Durban. Smith is Stoke through and through of course and asked Durban why he had gone to Sunderland. Durban replied that it was a 'big' club. Later, as manager of Sunderland Smith said he had not realised just how big a clun Sunderland are, until he got here. Back to Durban. He was doing well and again was not 'backed' by the Chairman (Cowie I think). In answer to ConcreteTony - Under Stokoe we were relegated..
An excellent post. Still have the Stokoe softspot, as for position it has to be Reid. But Mon now has his chance, and I realy do believe in him. he will be wanting top six as a minimum.
