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Let's Count the Mistakes

Discussion in 'Ipswich Town' started by San Diego, Nov 28, 2020.

  1. San Diego

    San Diego Sir Mediator
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    So just to make us all feel a little better about our club (I'm kidding) why don't we all put our heads together and count the mistakes that have been made during Evans' ownership.

    Warning - this could be a depressing exercise.

    I'm looking for your answers to the following questions, please fell free to add another question if I missed an important one.

    Players bought overpriced but weren't worth it
    Players sold cheaply/profit loss/released for nothing
    Players profited on
    Players not signed but were close to signing
    Players we should not have sold at the time we did
     
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  2. San Diego

    San Diego Sir Mediator
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    I'll start with some quick ones I can remember

    Players bought overpriced but weren't worth it
    Chopra, Lee Martin, Priskin

    Players sold cheaply/profit loss/released for nothing
    McAuley, Berra, Chopra, Edwards, Martin

    Players profited on
    Cresswell, Mings

    Players not signed but were close to signing
    Ricardo Fuller

    Players we should not have sold at the time we did
    Rhodes, Wickham, Matt Clarke
     
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  3. Mike_Holmes1990

    Mike_Holmes1990 Well-Known Member

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    1. I'd add most of Hurst's additions. Though to be fair to Hurst, I think the list of incoming transfers that we paid a fair price for is the shorter by for.

    2. Leadbitter

    3. Wickham

    4. Charlie Austin

    5. Waghorn Murphy
     
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  4. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    For me the appointment of Roy Keane was the biggest one as it set the president for the downward spiral and burnt the fingers of ME so he never properly invested in the team again.

    I would wager that the majority of managers (maybe bar Hurst) he appointed after Keane would have got ITFC promoted if they were appointed when Keane was.

    At the time it looked like we were on the up and our feathered friends up the road were on a downward spiral. The appointmentd the club then made set the course for those clubs for the next 10 years...the irony that we now have Lambert failing to stop the declines hurts even more as I've always said he's arguably the best manager Norwich have ever had.
     
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  5. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    As I said apart from Keane I don't think ME has necessarily appointed bad managers, I think its just often either been the wrong manager at the wrong time or the wrong fit.

    With Jewell there seemed to be the pressure to get promoted due to the amount of money spent under the Keane Magilton era but he then decided to put the majority of our money into wages which led to a pretty poor squad supplemented by past it big names and loans with Jewell trying to get us to run before we could walk. If Jewell would have been appointed instead of Keane I genuinely think things would have been different.

    Mick did wonders under the budget restraints but for me he's a bit of a charlatan and it felt as with Keane he was an employee of ME rather than accountable to the fans, whatever you say about Paul Lambert he gets the fans are the most important part of the club and understands its heritage. There was the failure to strengthen when we were in a good position for promotion and since that point it was general stagnation, results weren't bad but there was a feeling of real lack of ambition, both from the owner and Mick himself. All his previous clubs say it, that he never progressed to the next level in terms of quality, he was the polar opposite of Jewell, in that he'd never try to get us to run even if we could walk. There was just that lack of hope, which killed any enthusiasm and he had to go. Whilst not my cup of tea again if he was appointed instead of Jewell I think we would be in a better place now.

    Given our lack of finances and poor squad Hurst was completely the wrong appointment, we needed a manager who had broad enough shoulders and personality to take this on, it wasn't time for a novice, again I think we could well be in a different position if Lambert was appointed then instead of when he was, buy which point alot of the damage was already done, particularly in the transfer market. There are alot of managers who could have performed better at the end of that season but I think the rot had already set in. It was important that we got a win early in his reign, we were so close but then it when we didn't all opportunity was lost and then just at the time Sears and Keane looked like they were building a decent partnership upfront Sears got injured.

    I haven't been enthralled with Lambert but there's no shying from it, he hasn't had an easy job, our squad isn't great and the injuries the past 4 years have been awful. The biggest disappointment is how good he was up the road, how he built a real balanced team full of team players and was very pragmatic.... where has this gone?

    I honestly don't know where we go next but the one of the biggest problems I think is a real lack of consistency from ME in managerial appointments and direction he wants the club to go in, its like watching the current government flitting from one thing to the next.
     
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  6. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    Sorry I didn't read the thread properly and went off on one

    1. Players bought overpriced but weren't worth it -
    I'd say pretty much every player we've spent more than a million quid on since ME came in bar McAuley, so pretty much every manager bar Mick and Lambert who I'm not sure ever spent that much money.

    2. Players sold cheaply/profit loss/released for nothing
    Biggest mistake by far Jordan Rhodes. I also think the release of David Wright was a big mistake. Plus right at the start of the ME era Neil Alexander. Jon Walters. McAuley, Berra were big losses

    3. Players profited on
    Mings, Wickham

    Players not signed but were close to signing
    Nugent, Austin

    Players we should not have sold at the timewedid
    Same as above
     
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  7. Nuggets

    Nuggets Well-Known Member

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    Lots of good observations above. I’d also add Roy Keane scrapping the academy and letting Klug go, which Evans could have prevented. Those related decisions set this club back years, in my opinion. Although there appeared to be an agenda against us getting Category One academy status, missing out on that has also impacted our ability to bring through young players, as the more promising youngsters in our catchment area generally go to Norwich or West Ham’s academies.

    As I mentioned on the other thread, I also think Evans’ record of managerial recruitment and a lack of ambition or investment behind the scenes (scouting, state of facilities, sports science etc) are also major factors in the decline of this club and relegation.
     
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  8. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    Sacking Magilton.
    Appointing Clegg.
    Failing to invest in Cat 1 academy.
    Selling key talent.
    Paying stupid wages to loanees from top clubs to develop their players and not our own.
    Allowing Klug to leave.
    Failing to invest in playing staff.
    Failing to maintain the pitch leading to Alan Ferguson moving on.
    Putting his name on the shirts / main sponsor.
    Outrageous ticket prices.
    Appointing Paul Jewell.
    Appointing Mick McCarthy.
    Giving Mick McCarthy two seasons too many.
    Not looking after contracts leading to low morale and so much talent to leave on frees.
    Failing to back Paul Hurst.
    Firing Paul Hurst.
    Appointing Paul Lambert.
     
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  9. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    Add to that extending PL’s contract as a “reward” for failing!
     
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  10. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    That was a very strange decision.

    I have tried to put this list together without the benefit of hindsight. Things that I felt were mistakes at the time that they happened.

    If the first mistake hadn’t happened, all the rest may not have followed.
     
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  11. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    Magic, incidentally, said yesterday he doesn’t want the job back!

    The only positive step forward I can see now is getting Dyer in alongside one or two of the class of ‘81.
     
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  12. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    Magic’s never really made it as a manager has he?
     
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  13. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    Having knowledge and integrity doesn’t always make for a great career in management. You need to be a bullshitter, or have a strong passion, or have a bit of luck.

    That was a decent team in ‘09 that only needed a couple of players.
     
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  14. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    Which two of those three did SBR have ;)?

    Another of those hindsight things,should ME have stuck by him?I’m sure most Town fans preferred the style of play from Jim’s day!
     
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  15. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    Love a bit of Jim and was treated unfairly here. The game is ruthless, he showed alot of potential but was his fiery temperament too much as a manager im not sure.

    As for Dyer people have been saying this alot and I'm willing to be proven wrong but I don't see it, he's got soo little experience and not sure he's got the right temperament to manage in how he comes across in interviews.

    If we do replace Lambert the one which strikes me as a good bet is Paul Cook
     
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  16. Bigalreigned

    Bigalreigned Well-Known Member

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    My big concern with Kieron, bless him, is that he’s just not that bright!
     
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  17. Nuggets

    Nuggets Well-Known Member

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    Jim Magilton had us playing attractive, entertaining football worth watching. And we won more often than not, however, as Hampy says, we had a good team back then and I don’t think Jim was ultimately the guy to get us promoted. Not to mention the manner of his sacking with his mum in hospital. I don’t blame him for not wanting to work under Evans again.

    I understand the romanticism of Kieron Dyer and George Burley being the next management team, as it strikes me of the kind of managerial appointment Chelsea made with Lampard and Manchester United made with Solsjkaer - but unlike Dyer, at least those two had prior management experience. For me, Burley has been out of the game for too long and he seems well-suited for a Director of Football role.

    I think our next manager has to a better communicator than the last few. He would ideally be more comfortable working with young players, at that seems to be the way this squad is being built. I’d still question Dyer’s appointment, although it seems he would tick that box!

    Also worth noting Phil Ham of TWTD has been banned by Ipswich press conferences at the behest of Lambert. Apparently a poster put up the Town line-up prior to the recent Lincoln game on the forum, before it was taken down. Rather than investigate who leaked it from within the club, Lambert and the powers-that-be have determined it is worth banning Phil. One of those rare times you see TWTD forum posters all in agreement! It’s bad PR from the club and seems to point to another sign of the disconnect between the club and its fanbase.
     
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  18. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    Far from it actually, was in the top class for absolutely everything and memorably brilliant at Mathematics.

    Nuggets - Lampard’s first job was at Derby and Town are in the division below where he started. If a manager can’t cut his teeth in League One there would never be any new blood.

    PTC - Dyer has matured ever such a lot since his 20s playing days. How are the temperaments of Mourinho, Ferguson, Klopp on a bad day? Not everyone is as ice cool as Pep and it’s not a prerequisite to be a successful football manager.
     
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  19. itfcptc

    itfcptc Well-Known Member

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    Yes I've heard him in recent interviews, just doesn't strike me as managerial material but that might be different if he was given the responsibility. He still seems to talk about his coaching as if he's still one of the lads. So wasn't talking about temperaments as being ice cool, he doesn't seem to be particularly fiery
     
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  20. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    I reckon if he had been in the dressing room at half time against Hull as manager he’d have been fiery enough.
     
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