http://www.fsf.org.uk/blog/view/ban-the-bomb City's Dutch friends in Tilburg are allowed to use pyrotechnics by Willem II. Club provide holders for smoke cannisters. Here its an imprisonable offence!!
Hate being by a smoker. The smell is terrible and annoying. Glad the only place good enough for smokers is outside.
Don't go to any of the great games in Europe, keep off the curvas ..You can smell the atmosphere. The visceral feel is part of it. Coming back to England seeing the feeble support at too many stadiums makes you realize why European fans laughs at England. Smoking bans and the rest [ flag bans .. !!] would be considered ludicrous in Italy. The Dutch have no smoking sections, interestingly they are far quieter than smoking sections. My memories of the Eastend at its peak decades ago as a child was the sweet smell of pipes, and the sight in the dark of the lighters.
Visited Zagreb years back and ended up watching the BBB instead of the game, stunning fans. Weird one. If asthma attacks are a risk from pyrotechnics why does this not affect Croatians, Dutch, French, Greeks, Italians, Poles, Serbs, Turks ... ?
Watched Ajax and Volendam in Netherlands and away fans behind perspex fences to protect from missiles/being shot etc.so I was told. At an international only non alcoholic beer available/allowed, so swings and roundabouts, also number of clubs have gone to the wall in the last few years in Netherlands. so not all good.
clouds and clouds of pipe and cigarette smoke, especially at evening games. very nostalgic and I'm an ex smoker (hooray!!)
Perspex screens are not used to prevent being shot !!! They are to be used against missiles. The screens themselves are superior to the huge segregation used at Ashton Gate. Dutch grounds like Utrecht are as safe as really can be imagined. Dutch grounds are often police less due to the forward thinking manner they are stewarded. Stewards are laughably laid back and very tolerant. As one said to me, "they are only signs!" Arrangements will alter match to match e.g local derby = No alcohol although this may not be general. Many games you will be able to drink, smoke and err toke in your seat. No significant [?] club has gone out of business recently in the Netherlands. The spectacle of even an average Dutch sides fans makes the UK look a little tame.
At Ajax, not only do they have the perspex screens but they have built a train station especially for the away fans at the ground. They are funnelled into the top tier of the stadium via a staircase completely enclosed in steel and out the same way after so they are completely isolated. They have also been known to paint the 2 side perspex screens for the particularly savage local derbies so the fans can't see each other... They did get caught out once recently though when they though that they had all angles covered until one set of away fans startted pissing on the home fans under (now sorted)...
Millwall isn't much different, but went there with England and ?? Didn't see it. I would certainly like to see pyro allowed in this Country v the ban everything culture we have. Touching video of Feynoords fans honouring a terminally ill fan doing the rounds with flares and banners. Health and safety here would have banned it. Loads of club abroad have organised displays making a nonsense of the negative extremes authorities here trot out to protect us from nothing.
Remember the european style supporting flares and firecrackers at the Valley and London road. No injuries, nobody harmed, great atmosphere and fans smiling about it. Ruled by killjoys here.
I don't like the idea of flares in the hands of pissed up idiots. Sorry guys but there's too many knobs about for a free for all on flares. I do remember some talk on designated fans using them before a game, but I think the club gave a flat no.
Which is why there codes of conduct in France and elsewhere, and areas for specific use at some stadiums abroad. Walking down the steps with a cup of coffee is more dangerous. Club were asked about it several years back ... But this is modern football.
It is the dickheads that ruin it for everyone the authorities here have seen the videos of major problems especially from South America where flares and smoke bombs are thrown into opposition areas causing many injuries so they slapped a carpet ban on. If you think back this ban was brought in at roughly the time of the Heysel stadium when 90 odd people were injured several died in a panic caused by smoke bombs and flares thrown into away supporters in a match in Argentina. Yes we have a nanny state mentality here at times but clubs are not prepared to leave themselves open to being sued for millions if some idiots think they are being clever/funny throwing these things at opposing supporters, it is the club that would be sued not the idiot fans.
Only in the UK are fire resistant flags banned in non smoking stadiums in case they catch fire. Ground regulations are often based on idiocy!! Wembley has banned flags over a certain [small] size in all sections of the ground. This has the effect that Euro style supporting norms can never be recreated. Argentina is hardly a parallel to the UK. Belgium, France, Germany etc are relevant. This all has nothing to do with fans behavior. Regulations are not based on precedents here, or in Europe. Even club organised displays are now barred in England.
It was because of the fact that the two things happened at almost the same time caused panic in the FA so blanket bans on almost everything were introduced like I said yes it is Nanny State but you have to look at the wider picture from the clubs perspective any injuries caused by anything that could have been preventable will get the clubs sued we have become more like America in that respect than Europe with Ambulance chasing lawyers so it is unlikely that anything that could be seen as being likely to cause problems will be allowed. Re: Flags yes you can buy fire resistant flags but how do stewards/clubs know if a flag is fire proof are they going to have to try and light every flag brought into the ground? And you would always get the odd idiot hiding their favourite flag under their shirt to get it into the ground even if it was flamable so they employ a blanket ban. I was talking to a friend this morning about this He is a risk assessor for an insurance company he said if any club allowed flares smoke bombs etc in this country either their insurance would be so high they wouldn't be able to pay it or the companies wouldn't insure them anyway as he said Insurance companies are there to make money and cover reasonable risks not to compensate for idiotic behavoir.
I couldn't care less what Wembley bans. The average fan at England games is more interested in having their face painted than waving a flare about. Same as cup finals.
Why do you need to have a fire ******ant flag [surfer] v fire resistant v anything in a non smoking stadium? Cant remember flags catching light all over the UK before. Ever seen somebody trying to light a flag? History? Its based on nothing. Its based on the idiocy and intolerance of authority. Only in England. Even the Scots don't go this far. That is why in some respects have abandoned the stadium v old Wembley and the atmosphere is so poor. Its the domain of modern football in its ultra dull form. Wembley is intolerant of everything = sterrile.
We are comparing our health and safety rules against other country's. Got to defend our's a bit here working in the construction industry with death and injury rates down compared to other countries. But as Hawk says if we never had the blanket ban, we would be queuing for hours to get whilst everything is checked. Sure there's a no smoking ban in grounds, but it only takes one flare or one idiot to start something that could effect the rest of someone's life be it theirs or their children's. Yes we think its a nanny state, but it's better to come home from the event / work or whatever than some hospital bed. We sit and complain about health and safety in our country, but would sue if it wasn't in place when the accident took place.
