Financial Fair Play request

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simonstainrod

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
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Can someone explain to me our current FFP situation? Had a look online but I can only see details of the original fine and punishment in 2018.
Given that it's now 5 years later, how long is the punishment destined to go on for? It seems loads of other clubs get clobbered but somehow get around it. As far as I can see we're the only club playing by the rules and thus prevented from spending anything on transfers for what seems like forever.
Maybe I'm being as thick as Liz Truss but I can't find any info on how long this dire situation is set to go on for.
Would appreciate a little enlightenment.
 
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simonstainrod said:
Can someone explain to me our current FFP situation? Had a look online but I can only see details of the original fine and punishment in 2018.
Given that it's now 5 years later, how long is the punishment destined to go on for? It seems loads of other clubs get clobbered but somehow get around it. As far as I can see we're the only club playing by the rules and thus prevented from spending anything on transfers for what seems like forever.
Maybe I'm being as thick as Liz Truss but I can't find any info on how long this dire situation is set to go on for.
Would appreciate a little enlightenment.
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I also find it difficult to understand.
Chelsea, Everton,Man City will be hit by FFP, but you just know they won't be crippled like us for years and years and will be back buying big.
 
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The bit I don’t understand is how other clubs go and get a load of decent players on a free and we end up with a bunch of useless players who aren’t anywhere near championship level.
 
Sutfol said:
The bit I don’t understand is how other clubs go and get a load of decent players on a free and we end up with a bunch of useless players who aren’t anywhere near championship level.
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Cos we can't afford their wages or the loan fees, we are totally ****ered. The latest is for an Arsenal kid at right back who's wages we can't afford. If we can't afford a kids wages who I've never heard of we really are doomed !
 
We are paying a million a year for 10 years....but luckily that is not included in the 3 year rolling FFP total...so you can essentially forget that.


I believe we are allowed to lose 39 million in each rolling 3 years. When we had ezes 15million...in the bank okay...but then in the Warburton/ Beale era 2.5 years ago......we bought a few players, and didn't sellanyone...that year we made a big loss ( we gambled on going up, but didn't).... so in this football year... we cannot make more than a 10 million ( about ) loss.

We are perilously close to that figure...that is why we are selling, losing big earners...and only getting cheap free players.


If we can get through this year without get a fine...we will be okay...because the big spend year, will have passed..
 
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qprbeth said:
We are paying a million a year for 10 years....but luckily that is not included in the 3 year rolling FFP total...so you can essentially forget that.


I believe we are allowed to lose 39 million in each rolling 3 years. When we had ezes 15million...in the bank okay...but then in the Warburton/ Beale era 2.5 years ago......we bought a few players, and didn't sellanyone...that year we made a big loss ( we gambled on going up, but didn't).... so in this football year... we cannot make more than a 10 million ( about ) loss.

We are perilously close to that figure...that is why we are selling, losing big earners...and only getting cheap free players.


If we can get through this year without get a fine...we will be okay...because the big spend year, will have passed..
Click to expand...

Ahh, thanks Beth. At last, a bit of clarity.
 
I'd have thought it far easier to simply have rules to control the balance sheets of the clubs such that owners can invest via ordinary equity only, thereby preventing them from overburdening the club with unserviceable debt. It's not that hard to ensure there's no sleight of hand where the debt sits in a HoldCo instead, or the stadium or whatever is owned via another entity (or secured against the debt). There are already perfectly adequate rules in place preventing companies paying out dividends or buying back shares if there's insufficient distributable earnings on the balance sheet, so every penny somebody wants to put into a club becomes 100% risk capital. That might reign a few back.
 
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Uber_Hoop said:
I'd have thought it far easier to simply have rules to control the balance sheets of the clubs such that owners can invest via ordinary equity only, thereby preventing them from overburdening the club with unserviceable debt. It's not that hard to ensure there's no sleight of hand where the debt sits in a HoldCo instead, or the stadium or whatever is owned via another entity (or secured against the debt). There are already perfectly adequate rules in place preventing companies paying out dividends or buying back shares if there's insufficient distributable earnings on the balance sheet, so every penny somebody wants to put into a club becomes 100% risk capital. That might reign a few back.
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If your not in the Premiership unfortunately your bandjacked
 
The main thing to understand about it is that nearly all other clubs find a way around it, but we're totally ****ed by it.
Go figure.
 
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rangercol said:
The main thing to understand about it is that nearly all other clubs find a way around it, but we're totally ****ed by it.
Go figure.
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Not sure the likes of Derby, Birmingham, Bolton, Reading, Sheffield Wednesday would agree with that. All had points deductions related to FFP rules.

It's easy to feel like we're the only ones trying to stick to the rules. The reality is that it's harder for us to stick to the rules because:

(1) We have a smaller older stadium than many in our league
(2) We're incredibly badly run.

It's also fair to point out that there is more that our owners could do if they really wanted, but reading between the lines they don't want to put even more in than £2m a month. For example, Chelsea's current trick is to sign players on 7 year contracts, which means you can spread the cost of that transfer in your accounts across 7 years. That gives more FFP headroom but ties you to the cost for longer.
 
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Quite Possibly Raving said:
Not sure the likes of Derby, Birmingham, Bolton, Reading, Sheffield Wednesday would agree with that. All had points deductions related to FFP rules.

It's easy to feel like we're the only ones trying to stick to the rules. The reality is that it's harder for us to stick to the rules because:

(1) We have a smaller older stadium than many in our league
(2) We're incredibly badly run.

It's also fair to point out that there is more that our owners could do if they really wanted, but reading between the lines they don't want to put even more in than £2m a month. For example, Chelsea's current trick is to sign players on 7 year contracts, which means you can spread the cost of that transfer in your accounts across 7 years. That gives more FFP headroom but ties you to the cost for longer.
Click to expand...

Your point 2 is the one.
 
A club like ours is forever going to be governed by ffp. A small ground and a small fanbase doesn't generate the necessary income to compete in the transfer market at this level. There are exceptions to that theory, Luton Town as an example or Brentford. Both were/are run with a good business model, a good manager and a very good recruitment process. Brentford scoured the foreign market for cheap imports, often selling for profit but with the replacement already in line. Luton, when they last played us had 4 strikers in the matchday squad all capable of starting. We only had Dykes. They are now in a position to improve their ground and even if relegation come then they will be in a better position to bounce back.
We are years and years away from even getting close to those two teams, if ever to be honest. We are literally operating as a league 1 or even league 2 club. My expectations of this season are to be relegated, especially with no signs of any tactics or identity from Ainsworth. I believe the rebuild will start in league 1 which could take a few seasons of mediocrity there. It is what it is, it's the direction our owners have steered us towards.
 
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