@Evil Jimmy Krankie . Whilst working at home, I've been watching Police Force Australia. todays episode covered 3 major crimes and the crims just own up on all of them. One of them in your neck of the woods, The Flight Centre Robberies, DS Troy Kendall (what a cracking super hero name) gets his man, well boy really and the kid just leads them to his lock up where they find the evidence. If the kid could change one thing, it wasn't that he wouldn't do it, but he would go back and not leave his DNA at one of the shops. The perps in all 3 just didn't care that they'd been caught and were quite happy to take whatever was dished out. No fight, no denial, nowt Jobsworth Title of the day goes to the Sergeant on "stop sign duty" in Sydney, fining people for not actually coming to stop, the video shows her rolling but not enough to even register on her speedometer. All in all though it got me thinking, because most of their ancestors are criminals anyhow. Policing seems quite relaxed as it is in the UK (largely) but despite carrying guns, is quite tame compared to the US, mind that is only going off TV programmes. I haven't seen a uniformed cop in Australia draw his gun, or even have his hand ready to go for his holster when approaching cars etc. Conclusion is that Yanks are gun toting, trigger happy twats, Aussie cops are almost comatose but ready for anything, and UK Cops just don't bother with those things that go bang unless they need highly trained firearms officers. Obviously the countries face different circumstances. So to cut a long story short and to create some debate whilst we work from home, what is gun crime like in Australia? Is it necessary for all cops to carry guns, what sort of training do they get and would the UK way not be possible in Aus?
I can only speak from my own experiences @Confucius but here goes. I think there is more gun crime in Australia compared to the UK. You have to look at demographic and everything else though. Australia has farms the size of Wales and the animals on those farms need protection. This can be done in lots of ways but one way is by the use of firearms. The laws surrounding the ownership of guns is very similar to the UK, inasmuch that a normal member of the public can’t just have one. Look at this to find out why. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia) Speaking personally I have only drawn my firearm once. I’m not going into circumstances suffice to say I didn’t need to. Like the UK police use of a firearm is very heavily scrutinised both internally and externally. Contrary to what the public think the cops don’t try and cover up anything, at least not now anyway. I’m not naive enough to think it didn’t happen in the past as I knew it did, but during my entire service both UK and Australia I’ve never known it to happen. I don’t know why we all carry firearms and Taser here other than policy says so. One thing I can’t work out is why frontline officers in the UK don’t at least carry Taser. Over here, one thing we’re taught is to meet deadly force with deadly force. If someone comes at me with a knife, my gun comes out. I reckon that this could turn into a good debate. Keep it coming!!
Brilliant thanks for that mate. I read somewhere that an Indigenous man had been killed by Police (2019 I think) and he was actually charged with murder ( I don't know if he got convicted or not) However there was hell on amongst their community. There was things like the Police not being trained to a higher standard for the use of firearms, but its a fair point, the cops over there could be miles away from any sort of assistance so I get that. Any victim could also be 100 miles away from any medical treatment so any major injury is exacerbated somewhat With regards to the link, am I reading that right in as much as in Tasmania you would need to register a pistol but not an assault rifle? With regards to the UK, one in five officers now carry tasers and I can see that increasing.
Indigenous people die by police actions. But then, so do non indigenous. I don’t know what the answer is, if indeed there is one. I do know though that there is no police conspiracy regarding the death of indigenous peoples. As for training, there is always a review of current practice whenever a death by police or a death in custody occurs. Don’t know about Tasmania as each state and territory have their own laws for the licensing of firearms.
Aye I wasn't insinuating that like the issues they have in the US But actually it brings up another point. I never understand different states having different laws, I recall the back end of last year and Outback Truckers were being stopped on all state borders and checked, its not like going from Northamptonshire to Leicestershire, again I suppose due to the size of these states. But also previous to COVID, one trucker had to make sure he had no mud on the vehicle so as not to transfer any bugs into the state and border patrols actively look out for that kind of stuff. Digressing I suppose, but no less interesting Today I learned about the Hoon Legislation, whereby just through reckless driving Police can impound a vehicle for 28 days for a first offence. Obviously our Police can but only if the car is unsafe, has no insurance etc, they cant impound it just because he ran a red light and swerved all over. I think we should adopt Hoon Legislation, we might call it Chav Laws or something, but the little bastards here get away with murder. Driving without a licence, oh that will be a fine and points on your licence... errm if you actually get one Police work isn't the same the world over and isn't likely to be, and Im sure training in the use of fire arms is great, but you still cant account for officers reactions or mentality And I've even learned why you have a swan on your cap badge
i am with you on the 'different laws per state', when we were driving into victoria during our 'mini tour' of Oz we had to make sure we ate or threw away any fruit we had (a stray 'fruit fly' could cause havoc to their crops) also, some states you can get fined if you have your arm outside the vehicle (common practice on hot days in england), others, you must give way to traffic turning right...always had me thinking it would surely be easier to standardise laws/rules/regs across the country
You know more than me about the cap badge (which we just updated a couple of weeks ago). I’m guessing it’s to do with the Swan River which used to be called the Black Swan River maybe? I wasn’t insinuating that you thought we were bent btw. It’s just that a common theme on lots of police threads is that we ‘look after our own’ which we don’t. Hoon legislation is good. It was enacted shortly after we moved. It gives us the power to take cars off people if they’ve committed certain offences under the road traffic act. I also agree in principle that laws should be standardised. But as Australia is a country in its own right the Federation of Australia allows for each state and territory to make and enact its own laws. A bit like the USA only better. Coming from the UK where to become a firearms officer meant intense training, lots of psych tests and generally getting binned off the course for a minor transgression it was a bit surreal at first to carry one. My overriding thought is that maybe the UK do go overboard on the who gets to play with a gun. I can only speak from experience of my own force back there but the majority of firearms officers were very much ‘look at me, haven’t I got great tattoos on my big biceps’. As we all carry firearms here, that pissing contest has been just about been eliminated.
Aye it’s something to do with early settlers and the Swan River. The latter about fire arms officers is probably right too mate, but if we are going to have gun cops on the street, I’d much rather have a highly trained one that will use it only when necessary and not just have SWAT teams pissing over everyone else on the size of their biceps. I’ve another subtle difference mate, a trivial one, but our cops are constable, sergeant. Over there they had Senior Constable, Leading Senior Constable, First Class Constable, wtf?
Aye. Bottom heavy on Constable ranks. It goes recruit, probationary Constable, Constable, Constable first class, Senior Constable, sergeant, senior sergeant, inspector, superintendent, commander then into the commissioner ranks. At least in WA. I think some of the eastern states forces have a Leading prefix to some of their Constable ranks. Don’t know why though. We also have TRG here as well, who are the equivalent of SWAT. They are highly trained and very fit.
Yeah I saw one the other day that has Senior Leading Constable and didn’t know whether I had that mixed up with the NZ Highway Patrol one. There are a couple of erm pommie cops on that programme, you aren’t ugly enough obviously.
All to do with having a face for radio mate! Just haven’t been in the stations when the film crew arrive I suppose. You will see a fair few cops from the motherland if it’s in South Australia, Western Australia or New Zealand as they were the forces that specifically recruited us all about 15 years ago. It’s funny how many of those that told me I was making a mistake in coming over here back then have since told me that they wished they’d done what I did.
EJK, what’s the score with car insurance in WA? Every time I have been over, friends have provided me with a vehicle for getting around, when I asked about insurance they said not to worry, the car is insured and I’m fully covered for driving it. I have had a clean driving licence for 50 years, surely it can’t be the same for someone with endorsements on their licence.
It’s mostly NSW, WA and Victoria, but yeah it seems canny. Mind people over here don’t hear about the criminal activity over there. In your place for example you have quite a bit of bike gang activity and a few shotgun robberies
Ok. Like the UK, we pay to register our cars here, (what’s informally and incorrectly called road tax in the UK). We informally call it car rego. Everything here is shortened and/or has an ‘o’ put on the end. For example, I met Wayno and Shano this arvo. We went to the bottle-o. Anyway, the car rego also incorporates third party insurance. So that means assuming you have a valid licence you can drive any car with the most basic insurance. That doesn’t and shouldn’t stop you from getting your own insurance though. Both our cars are insured fully comp. With the standard of driving over here you’d be insane not to do it.
Yep, OMCG are prevalent here. We’ve just had the former president of Rebels WA murdered just before Christmas. I’ve read on this board and over the road how some posters seem to like the fact that they knew Hell’s Angels members in Sunderland. The problem is that they only see them with very rose-tinted glasses. They are criminals, violent ones at that. End of story. If anyone thinks that they are just a bunch of mates riding motorcycles then they are very much mistaken.
Cheers EJK, does that mean that if the cars I drive are insured fully comp then I am also covered by that fully comp insurance?
Not necessarily. Only if the person who has that fully comp insurance on their vehicle has also requested that any driver can drive it. Then you will be fully comp. Otherwise the vehicle and therefore you are only covered by the car rego third party insurance. In other words if you crash you better have deep pockets! Me and Mrs K can drive each other’s cars as we are named drivers on each other’s fully comp insurance. That’s as far as it goes for us. We have chosen that level of insurance.
Cheers EJK, the vehicle that I am given (loaned) is part of a fleet of site vehicles that were used up north prior to the owner partially retiring. They are still used by people working for him around the Perth area and, I would assume knowing how meticulous the owner is, are insured appropriately. What concerns me is the few occasions when we shared the driving whilst touring down Margaret River in our relatives car (probably not a good idea now that you have put me right)
Couple of questions EJK Do they have a version of an MOT? Also do the police in the big cities have ANPR? I noticed on the programme they run a check before pulling someone over, whereas in the UK, ANPR gives them an auto alert Our whole CCTV motorway network system is a marvellous system mind, even for the detection and investigation of crimes. They can find people’s travel at particular times of the day The police have some fantastic tools at their disposal, which is just as well considering the ****e judicial system we have
Hi mate just been watching a french police series called spiral on I player when you see their judiciary our lads are in utopia, canny series mind.
