Dnipro on Thursday

Interesting to see Jol's comments, on the Villa game and the Dnipro one:

"It's a different game, we start all over again," he added.

"We created chances against Villa, but not enough for my liking at home.

"The difference always is to score a goal. I would have been satisfied if we'd scored one.

"We were the better team and should have scored. But, although it's a different side tomorrow, it's an adventure.

"It's a new thing. I've been here for nine weeks and we will probably play in this style up front for the first time tomorrow.

(taken from http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...ramos-animosity-ahead-of-meeting-2339336.html )

Judging by that last phrase, it looks like he's got something up his sleeve tactically for the forwards that is different to the previous matches. Has anyone got any ideas?

 

I think (read: hope) he's going to play Dembele off Bobby.

 

I like Jols forthright manner in saying ok is not good enough,
much better than when we put in an abysmal performance,
glossing over with excuses.

 

yes agreed a la Hodgson and Hughes

 

I think what he means is 'let's go for it':


-----------------Schwarzer--------------------
-----Hughes-------Hangeland--------Senderos----
-------------------------------------------------
-------------Murphy------Sidwell-----------------
--Dembele----------Dempsey--------------Duff--
---------------Johnson-------Zamora--------

 

I would like to see Dembele in the role of playing off the striker with BZ playing up top. He is a better finisher than AJ, although this would be harsh on AJ as he has been playing really well recently. Agree that Sidwell has to play as well

 

Can see the logic WDWW and it fits with the way Jol sees the world. Brave to leave out Riise though.

My concern is whether Jol's world maps the current squad attributes. Specifically, since Dembele will cut inside, whether AJ will have the discipline/nous to move wide. I've always seen AJ as a RW so it could work. Alternatively it could get awful congested in the centre.

A plus is that it would strengthen and allow control in the midfield - where we have been lacking all too often recently with basically just Murphy and Etuhu there. The big question is whether we would open up the opposition defence and get goals.

As you know my preference is to go with the system proposed by Tosh in an earlier thread - one this squad knows well - 4-2-3-1. That is :

------------Schwarzer--------------------
---Baird------Hughes-------Hangeland----Riise----
-------------------------------------------------
------- ----Murphy------Sidwell-----------------
--Dembele----------Dempsey--------------Duff--
----------------Zamora--------

Well that's what my heart says. My mind says you'll be closer and he'll stick to 4-4-2

 

Bidley may well be right. If Dembele and Bobby haven't started up front together yet, that could well be what he means.

Alternatively, how about this line up:

- - - - - - - - - - - - Schwarzer - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- Duff - - - Senderos - - - Hangeland - - - Riise the Elder -

- - - - - Sidwell - - - Murphy - - - Etuhu - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - Dembele - - - - Kasami - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - - - - - - Zamora - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

It seems harsh to leave Dempsey out, so I'd be happy for him to come in for either of the two behind Bobby. I wanted to include Kasami as it would be good to see what he's capable of. Other variations would be to bring in Gecov for Etuhu to increase the passing quality from the 3 less advanced midfielders (if reports on the unseen ginger terror are to be believed)

More controversial than Dempsey's omission is Duff at right back. In this formation, we would depend on full backs to provide the width, and Duff would relish moving forward into the space it would give (as Riise did against Villa). He's no shrinking violet of a winger, so the physical tussle of defensive play would be a problem to him. He had a spell at left-back for Newcastle before, and he is very two-footed, so I don't think playing on the opposite side would faze him. The other thing we would be dependent on is intelligent movement and running from the front three.

I'm not saying that I think this is what Jol has planned - as I said above, I suspect Bidley has nailed it - and these are possibly the early-morning ramblings of someone who woke up too soon and hasn't had enough sleep. But it's something to think about.

 

Morning Captain.

I like the idea of the inclusion of Kasami, and having heard your explanation of Duff being at full-back, I like that idea too. My only worry would be that he may not last the full 90, running between the touchlines all night. But he wouldn't do badly at all, I think he played there last season for a couple of games.

WDWW offers a nice lineup too - but I'd be biting my nails all night witjh Senderos as part of a back 3.

What I think the team will be;

- - - - - - - - - - - - Schwarzer - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

-Hughes - - Senderos - - - Hangeland - - - Riise the Elder-

-Dempsey - - - - Sidwell - - - Murphy - - - Duff - - - - - -

- - - - - - - Dembele - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - - - - - - Zamora - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Nothing too exciting, and I'd like to see Kasami start instead of Murphy, or even a half time/60th minmute subs appearance.

 

I knew I had forgotten someone

----------------

Just found out

Simon Davies and Bjorn Helge Riise are both ruled out of Fulham's Europa League play-off first leg game against Dnipro at Craven Cottage.

Davies has a knee injury, while Riise is suffering with a hamstring problem.

 

I would go with Bidley's formation with the only change of Baird as RB. Hughes or Senderos to partner Hangeland.

 

Morning also.

Having mused overnight, I realised we have a jolly important match coming up on Sunday. May then be a case to rest Hangeland (he was carrying a bit of an injury), Murphy. Duff and Bobby .

- - - - - - - - - - - Schwarzer - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

-Baird ------- Hughes - --- Senderos - ------ Riise

-----Dempsey - - - - Sidwell - - - Murphy - - - Duff - - - - - -

- - - - - - - Dembele - - -Johnson- - - - - - -

Briggs and Kasami will be in the mix somewhere.

As sure as nuts are nuts, he'll play 4-4-2

 

I like Jol calling "for his Team to demonstrate their firepower" and am looking forward to getting back to The Cottage tonight and see if we can score the necessary goals to progess to the league stage. I also like Bidley's team, with Hughes at CB but as amended by Madness.

C-O-Y-W !!!!

 

I agree we have a jolly important match coming up on Sunday but tonight's match is pretty important too. Obviously Dnipro are an unknown quantity (at least they are to me) but I feel we need to beat them something like 3-0 tonight to ensure qualification. We're still not great at scoring away and I wouldn't want us to go to the Ukraine next week leading 1-0 to end up getting beaten 2-1

Whilst resting Hangeland, therefore, might be sensible I don't think we can rest Bobby - he came closest to scoring against Villa and he needs to improve his match fitness (it seems) so I'm expecting to see him start tonight.

 

To me having following the Ukraine league in the past i really dont think we can afford to rest players against them,
they are a fast tempo team who like to pass and move alot, they are a classy team, and with us having aged legs on the pitch aswell it might be wise to have someone like Kasami and Sidwell in the middle,

i think 3-0 is abit optamistic, but please make me eat my words lol,

 

I think tonight is more important than Sunday. You can make a case for saying league games are more important than gruop matches in the Europa, but we'd be gutted after all the hard work of the last couple of months to go out of the Europa at this stage. I want us to win against Wolves, but given the choice of one result or the other, I'd take tonight as the priority.

I think Bidley's eleven is almost right. I'd prefer Sidwell to Etuhu, as Bidley has it, but I'm expecting Etuhu to start.

I've been thinking about the Hughes/Baird debate. On the basis of Saturday, we tend to favour the right side when we attack. Most of our build up play goes down that flank, with Duff prominant. This draws the opposition across the pitch and leaves room for Riise to break forward into space. I think that Hughes' deployment at right back is not intended to be as attacking as Riise - a deliberately lop-sided approach designed to create chances like the one in the first half where Riise fired narrowly over the bar. When he storms forward like that, the defence naturally operates more like a back three. If that is, indeed, the plan, then Hughes is a better choice than Baird.

On the other hand, maybe the above is just a consequence of the players we have available right now, and if Jol signs a more attacking natural right back we might see a more balanced approach with both full backs taking equal attacking responsibility.

Just a thought.

 

I'd like to just say that my team was what I think it will actually be, not what I'd like. I'd like Kasami ahead of Murphy and Baird at RB and Hughes and Senderos in the middle (resting Hangeland).

I notice that a certain Nikola Kalinic is playing for Dnipro now having moved from Blackburn.

 

Also, what is Briggs' natural position? I know he played in midfield for us recently but isn't he usually a RB?

 

Briggs is usually a Left back but we have played him at Centre back and you say midfield

 

He's properly a centre back, Bidley, but the competition to get in the first team in that position is way to stiff for him at the moment. I think his current spell in midfield is - possibly - with a view to his development to eventually play centre back, adding to his comfort in bringing the ball out of defence. He's certainly a defender first and foremost.