It seems like diving is creeping into English football more and more. Drogba used to go down easily when he was with us on occasions but as did Ronaldo when at United etc. recently though it has become annoying. Ivanovic shamefully dived against Stoke. It was terrible and I was embarrassed by it when I saw it on MOTD. Oscar also got penalised in the same game. We got absolutely slaughtered for those two dives by the BBC and the media. It seems to have tarnished our image as now when we really should be getting penalties (3 times against Norwich) the ref waves play on which is very frustrating. However last night was shocking on MOTD2. Watching Bale dive for Spurs against Villa. That was disgraceful. Guzan was nowhere near him! No dive is ever good but at least Ivanovic was near his attacker (I don't condone diving at all ). I thought you couldn't get much worse than that tbh but there is always the man for the occasion. Luis Suarez. What an absolute karnt. His dive was truly laughable but disgusting. Had the ref given it it would have cost Stoke the game. How come Bale and Suarez weren't booked? It comes to MOTD2 last night and the three pundits have a laugh about these dives. Sorry? You're laughing at these dives when only a few weeks before you were criticising Oscar and Ivanovic and calling for 3 match bans!? I know Suarez now has a reputation which he has earnt but now it seems Chelsea have a reputation for diving with the media and everyone else. It's annoying because I hate all this diving. Surely there should be retrospective punishment for dives that Ivanovic, Suarez and Bale have done? Their habit of diving means that players such as Hazard and Jelavic (taking this weekend for example) don't get the penalties that they should be rewarded with.
Ivanovic wasn't booked for either of his 2 dives in that game. As for Hazard, if he went down outside the box under the same challenges he does inside the box, he'd never get in the bloody area. You can call it being clever or whatever you want but he doesn't make any attempt to stay on his feet in the box which makes it difficult for the ref to give a penalty, especially when you're regularly having 1/2 appeals more per game because of diving, throwing themselves to the floor. As for MOTD bias, I don't think they focused much on Luiz's dive after the game last week, or called for bans. Maybe it's not Chelsea and it's just Ivanovic and Oscar that MOTD are out to destroy with their criticism!
BB --I'm with you on this! I get embarrassed when it happens and its something Robbie needs to crack down on! The practice isnt exclusive to Chelsea, but with the class we've got on the pitch we DONT need to resort to it!
There's a big difference between going down under some contact and going down when there is NO contact though. Ever since the bottle job with that Arsenal player (v celtic?) players know they can and will get away with it so might as well try it on. The odd booking here and there is worth the chance of a pen in close game ala Bale, Suarez and Ivan. Holding in the box and diving is getting out of control atm.
But in every circumstance Hazard has been fouled. The way that he plays allows him to generate a lot of speed and with his skill the defenders can't handle him. It's a lot different to when Suarez chucks himself down in the penalty area with no one near him and how Bale looked like a fool. Surely you don't appreciate Bale's dive!? Luiz was booked at Arsenal but he never looked for the penalty. I was at the game and it happened in front of the away end. He got up and was heading back when the ref booked him. Jenkinson on the other hand got away with it for Arsenal last weekend but nothing was made of it.
This all ties in to my recent thread, it is considered professional to cheat and up to officials to stop it. Coaches moan about it then at training promoted it with a nod and a wink. This is all due to money. I'm certain that if no one got paid for playing, no sponsorship or prize money, that there would still be cheating, because it is human nature to be an ignorant arsehole, but the cheats caught would be vilified so badly they'd be socially shunned. With the money cheating is distasteful but accepted and certainly nobody loses any sleep with their concious.
There has been contact in each case but not always a lot and not always enough to send him to the deck. I'm not saying he should be punished for it but I've not seen him stumble once, apparently every single contact he's had on him in the box has been enough to take him off both feet. He's far from the only one, I can't remember the last time I've seen a player stumble in the box rather than go flying through the air making no attempt to stay on their feet but that will count against a player when they do it regularly. Personally I don't think Bale dived to con the ref. If you look at Guzan he feigns trying to kick the ball/Bale while both are charging for the ball. It's impossible to say for sure but to me, nothing about it suggests he was trying to con the ref. He didn't appeal, he tucked his leg away rather than sticking it out to try and get contact and Guzan definitely looked like he was going to kick Bale's standing leg. I don't like seeing Bale dive though, no.
I've just read an article in the sports section of the Times today, where it says that RDM has given Eden Hazard a lecture about staying on his feet when in the opponents box! It is clear that he is concerned about the increasing likelihood referees will ignore genuine calls for a penalty, as was the case in one ,or even two, contacts in the box on Saturday
As I said on another thread, you can't really be angry with the players diving. The FA haven't got a clear and strong enough standpoint on the issue, so of course they're going to exploit that, when they are paid and want to win football matches. If a ref could only possibly give them a yellow, they're going to dive. Retrospective bans are easy enough to dish out, and would prevent cheating or punish it. And they should scrap the "if the ref saw it, we can't take no action boss"... Biggest load of crap in the game. Just highlights and makes worse the original error.
Can't stand diving at all esp' when we do it. Basically if you dive outside the box give a yellow inside the box and you get a red. Will help stop it I think. Not helped by everyone in the game saying things like he 'won' a penalty etc. You don't win a penalty you get awarded one because someone else screwed up. To me the MOTD response to our two divers did seem a bit zealous and gleeful esp' as this weeks divers barely rated a mention.
please log in to view this image Yet MOTD just claim we should laugh it off. Scary bias. Worse than Suarez's as well
It was bad but Suarez's was a dive within a dive. Next level **** from Suarez. Bales standard 1 level dive doesnt even compare no matter how hilariously bad it was.
They were both terrible but yes... Suarez's was a lot worse.... and he wonders why he has this reputation!?
I agree with Yid V on Bale. He Baled out . A complete wussie. As for not appealing, well if the ref gives a free kick to him, he is not going to refuse it. In this case, my feeling is, he didn't do anything against the rules. Many players from all clubs have dived so no good being specific as you'd just be throwing stones from your glasshouse. What we have done here is watch a video of a player going down with no contact, easy enough to do. The FA refuse to change results or have replays for 'minor' breaches of rules. So we do need retrospective punishment based on video evidence. All charges from incidents sould be made by the FA, they should have people reviewing every game (they have the money and if they want clubs to be in their association and not another one they should have a big incentive to officiate their rules properly). Let them decide if an incident, such as the one with Bale, is worth punishment. Once match bans start the behaviour will stop. Manager chats aren't enough.
It seems though that following perhaps fall out from the likes of Suarez and Young last season, that refs are really wising up to diving and perhaps even going the other way and not giving genuine pens in case they are being conned. Since the first few games of the season we've had loads of solid penalty shouts (Qpr, Norwich and Wolves) all waived away. Hasn't really costs us so far but it will eventually. Something has to change. For me the easiest thing is let a panel of ex pros and refs consider any contentious diving issues on a Monday and immediately ban any cheats for their next game. I know there will be grey areas but how many more weekends can go by with Suarez falling over before something is done?? No-one wants to see it in this country. Fair play to RDM to acknowledging that our players need to try and stay on their feet if possible. Brendan should perhaps follow suit rather than try and argue Suarez of all people is being vilified for nothing. Massive doh!
