There has been debate before this recent slump and even before this season about whether Wenger's time at the club has come to end. Many claim they're outraged at those who call for his heads calling them not true Arsenal but I think there are 2 key points that ALL Arsenal fans agree with. 1. We are all immensely grateful for what Wenger has accomplished for our club over those years not only in success but in finances, playing style, etc 2. We support the club over any one indvidual...I'm an Arsenal fan over being a Wenger fan That being said I have the feeling the true point to which you can asses whether the time has come for a manager to leave is if the team are no better/or worse than when they took over. Bruce Rioch's team finished 5th in 1995-96 and i think he did a decent job without being spectacular. He brought in Bergkamp and Platt whilst reinvigorating Martin Keown and making him the dominant player he became. Wenger's team right now is no real better than that team, we have players who are 'supposedly' more comfortable on the ball but look how Ramsey and Arshavin play for us. Rioch's team had Merson as the creator + Bergkamp with Wright getting the goals where as we only have RVP right now. The defence despite being improved and having some injuries is still clearly not good enough. Wengers success has built him some protection but all concerned even Wenger himself can delude themselves that things aren't right and a change is needed this summer
Good call. I was debating whether I should write an article asking the question whether we want the club to be run like a business .. or as a sports club. It should really be a bit of both, with more emphasis on being a sports club. I remember that, the following season we went out of Europe at Borussia Munchengladbach - I know I spelled it wrong. We were absolutely abysmal .. I think Stewart Houston was the caretaker manager.
OP has a good point. Our team has been stripped of it's guts. We did have a team that was better than the one Arsene inherited but of course he bought into Mr Gazidis's stupid dream plan. The good players left and were not replaced. Instead we grew our own and as we know, half of the patch are no more than rotten cabbage. If nothing happens to make this right, soon the remaining good players will feel there is no point in staying too. We should just cut our loses and cut free the likes of Gazidis, Law and a few others.
I think the salient point would be, that he should only be replaced if we could find someone who could do a better job. I do think given the circumstances at our club over since the move to Emirates that Wenger has done a good job keeping us in the Champions League and challenging at the top. He's kept us in contention, although we've not won anything. I think it can be over simplified a bit sometimes when things aren't going well, that sacking the manager will automatically improve the situation, when in fact it would likely to plunge us into an ever deeper problem. That said, if we finish out of the top 4 this season, then Wenger's position is going to come under intense scrutiny and I think the board are going to have to make some difficult decisions, be it with regard to the manager's position, or the amount of cash injected into the squad.
If we do miss out on the Champions League, I think it will force the hand of the board. My personal hope is that they give Wenger the money to invest in proper replacements for Fabreags, Vieria, Pires and Henry (I don't think we ever properly replaced any of those players) It probably won't surprise you to know, but I do think Wenger is still the best man for the job. Although I think he really needs to look at changing his tactics and formations at times. It's great if we've got a team who can pass the oppo into submission, but we don't have that at the moment, so we either need to bring in players who can do that, or play suitable formations to counter the oppo set up.
I think what we miss the most are the goals and play of Pires and Ljungberg. We had 2 midfielders who each contributed 12 to 15 goals per season and helped us when we counter attacked - teams had to think about that !!! Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Ljungberg, what an attacking quartet. Now we have RVP, Walcott, Gervinho, Arshavin. Oh dear.
'if we could find someone who could do a better job.' How do we find out? I agree he's been the best manager we've ever had - and trying to turn a blind eye on the last, say 5 years - second only to SAF. If only he would change - or admit the Board privately stop him spending - resting on the continued miracles he delivered year after year. I think the tide has turned and the squad - the motivation - the lack of Plan B - its all pointing to a gradual disaster unfolding. He is ageing and I worry that the man does not look well - football management is tough. I'd far rather he decides to go - and we take our chances with a new guy. Its a sad end to a fantastic servant to the club - but his time has come - it happens. I know you can't accept this - but I wring my hands in despair over our shortcomings most weeks. I want to be shouting COME ON ARSENAL as we take apart most teams - most of them frightened at having to face us - like the old days. Our football is pretty pretty - too indirect - too slow build-up - ponderous and always the same style. Sometimes just inspiring - lately almost tedious. Where has it all gone wrong? I and more and more others can tell you. -passionless.
I still think we could have a good season. We're in the knockout phase of the Champions League and in the FA cup. If we can get on another run like the one before xmas, then we've still got a good chance for top 4. So I think we need to wait until the end of the season before we do anything. I'd love to see us bring in a top quality player in Jan, but it ain't gonna happen - and that's not the fault of Wenger or the board. Things can change very quickly in football. So I think we need to remember that back to back defeats, whilst painful - are not the end of our season. The important aspect now, is how we respond to it. I'm hoping that Wenger and Rice are drumming into the players the need to concentrate 100% for 90 mins, because we switched off against Fulham and Swansea and that's what cost us. Otherwise we probably would have won both those games.
First it was Arsenal V Man Utd. Then it became Arsenal V Man Utd V Chelsea - note that since Chelsea became contenders Arsenal have only won a solitary FA Cup ! Then it became Arsenal V Man Utd V Chelsea V Liverpool. Now it is Arsenal V Man Utd V Man City V Chelsea V Spurs V Liverpool. It didn't matter if we were bad before, we could always qualify for the CL, but competition now is so fierce, it highlights what we, as a club have taken for granted for so long since Wenger arrived. The entire club need to work harder, this complacency is evident everywhere in the club, from the prawn sandwich fans to the pampered youth team players.
See .. the comment in bold is the problem Piskie - we have been making mistake after mistake for years now, why should it be only now that this message is drummed into the player's heads ??? It should be second nature, they are not kids anymore. If they haven't learned to concentrate for the whole 90- minutes then they are lost causes.
Too late for all that now .... gates, bolting and horses spring to mind. If these players do not know that by now .. they will never know.
Oh shut up!! Only j/k I wish I could share your optimism as to where we would finish this season Piskie but there is a trend which has been established of late that points to our dropping points. The run up to the close of last season, the beginning of this and our form of late. We have been fortunate in that our closest rivals have had their own problems but if we are to rise above them and indeed one other by which I mean Chelsea, then we need to do better. Much better because if they raise their game we would fall back. This I say on the basis of our form. Twice now of late we have let the opportunity to go clear of Chelsea, Liverpool and Newcastle slip away. If we do not get ahead of these three teams, we do not get to play in the CL. The fallout from that would be catastrophic. If we had the stringent constraints of Everton I can understand our lukewarm attempts at arranging meaningful transfers but the fact is that we have the means. Just not the will.
Alright i'll take your word at this but why on earth did he and Rice not address this before. It's as though they have just woken up to the need to give 100% over 90+ minutes. That lack of concentration which led to the third goal was abysmal given that these are supposed to be professional players. Wanna bet it happens again before the end of the season? It may take longer than 16 seconds from the restart but it will happen again. These guys have half their heads in dreamland.
Hopefully that's the case BTW can we make a truce? I am tired of our board being divided and being the laughing stock of Not 606 At the end of the day we all want the club to be successful
OK you have my word on this Yes we are on the same side after all. I'm sure you're a real positive too
I hear you fella, I just think that whilst the season is still very much alive that we should get behind the manager and players and support them. If at the end of the season we've come up short again, then it's time to start asking for changes. As it is, we've still got a chance to turn this into a successful season, so I think we should at least give the team the chance to prove it.
