Off Topic any Mxs out there

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The UK Supreme Court rules that the legal definition of a woman is based on biological sex

Judges say the "concept of sex is binary" while cautioning that the landmark ruling should not be seen as victory of one side over another
Unfortunately Mlord sex is not binary.

There are a lot of people wondering round with XXY and XYY genes.
There are a lot of people whose androgen receptors are for one reason or another are silenced.

And there are people with ( to standard levels):who have abnormal sex hormone levels.

All these situation are completely natural.
Sex is not binary
 
Unfortunately Mlord sex is not binary.

There are a lot of people wondering round with XXY and XYY genes.
There are a lot of people whose androgen receptors are for one reason or another are silenced.

And there are people with ( to standard levels):who have abnormal sex hormone levels.

All these situation are completely natural.
Sex is not binary

Surely a few genetic anomalies do not justify some of the madness we've been subjected to? Biology before ideology I would think.
 
Surely a few genetic anomalies do not justify some of the madness we've been subjected to? Biology before ideology I would think.
Not saying anything like that

Just saying the legal ruling is scientifically flawed


You are the one who has introduced ideology into this
 
Last edited:
Not saying anything like that

Just saying the legal ruling is scientifically flawed


You are the one who has introduced ideology into this

Individuals with such conditions may, or may not, be bothered by them.

The ideology, however, does seem to cause considerable mischief, hence the mention.
 
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I am flabbergasted no one has mentioned the Imane Khelif news. Kiwi sort it out.
Imane Khelif must undergo sex testing as World Boxing brings in new rules

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Imane Khelif must undergo sex testing if she wishes to compete in any women's event organised or sanctioned by World Boxing, the governing body has said.

Khelif won gold in the women's 66 kilogram category at last summer's Olympic Games, having been cleared to compete despite being disqualified from the 2023 World Championships organised by the International Boxing Association for allegedly failing to meet gender eligibility criteria.

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World Boxing announced on Friday it was introducing mandatory sex testing to determine the eligibility of male and female athletes wishing to take part in its competitions.

The body - which will oversee boxing at the next Olympic Games in Los Angeles in 2028 - said it had written to the Algerian boxing federation to say that until Khelif had undergone the test, she would not be able to compete in next month's Eindhoven Box Cup or any other women's event under its authority.

World Boxing said it was introducing the rules as part of a new policy on sex, age and weight "to ensure the safety of all participants and deliver a competitive level playing field for men and women".

The letter stated that in the event of a challenge by the federation or by World Boxing to Khelif's sex certification, Khelif would remain ineligible to compete until the dispute was resolved.

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Speaking to ITV News in March about the row over her involvement at the Olympics, Khelif said: "I see myself as a girl, just like any other girl.

"I was born a girl, raised as a girl and have lived my entire life as one.

"I have competed in many tournaments, including the Tokyo Olympics and other major competitions, as well as four World Championships.

"All of these took place before I started winning and earning titles. But once I began achieving success, the campaigns against me started."

All athletes over 18 wishing to compete in a World Boxing owned or sanctioned event will need to undergo a PCR (polymerase chain reaction) genetic test to determine their sex at birth and their eligibility to compete.

Athletes deemed to be male at birth, as evidenced by the presence of Y chromosome genetic material (the SRY gene) or with a difference of sexual development (DSD) where male androgenisation occurs, will be eligible to compete in the male category, World Boxing said.
 
Kiwi although I agree that in contact Sport people carrying a XY genotype who have gone through puberty under the influence of testosterone should be barred from competing against women..on a safety premise.

There is absolutely noevidence out there that Khelif has XY genes.. Khelif was born a girl ( on her birth certificate) and raised a girl.
( yes she may have genetic variants that have made her bigger and stronger. But Mo Farrar had abnormal muscle types. Michael Phelps had abnormal lung capacity and long and large limbs too...so unfair)

This is such a delicate area..I am happy to leave this to the governing body of the sports involved. Rather than victimise the people involved
 
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No wonder the NHS is in crisis when nurses are forced to deny biology​

Those running the health service seem determined to ignore vulnerable women and defy the Supreme Court’s trans ruling wherever they can

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Women and Equalities Secretary Bridget Phillipson is ‘shilly-shallying’ on enforcing the Supreme Court’s legal definition of a woman Credit: Toby Melville
Suzanne Moore
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22 December 2025 7:00pm GMT
An ex-neighbour of mine came up to me in our local shop. “Just wanted to tell you to keep going,” he said. He is a GP. “I agree with you on all the gender stuff. But we are having real difficulty with some of the younger doctors.”

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This kind of thing happens to me a lot – approaches from individuals who have not bought into gender self-ID nonsense and explain to me that they work for institutions that are riddled with it. Like the NHS.

They are forever given rules and guidelines and the possibility of sanctions if they do not adhere to policies produced by a lanyard class who never goes near an actual patient.

There are so many things that need repairing in our health service right now that fiddling at the outer edges of trans ideology feels deliberately obtuse. Such fiddling never stops but its purpose these days is to find ways to defy the Supreme Court ruling on the legal definition of a woman.

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You might think that with long waits, doctors’ strikes and a flu outbreak, the issue of misgendering was not a priority – unpleasant perhaps, but life-threatening, no.

But for as long as the government and Women and Equalities Secretary Bridget Phillipson shilly-shallies on enforcing the Equality and Human Rights Commission guidance, which led to the Supreme Court ruling that “sex” means biological sex at birth, time-wasting trans activists will be pushing hard to complicate the lives of nurses and doctors.

The Nursing and Midwifery Council now says that nurses could be disciplined for having gender-critical beliefs and it could “take action” against those who “deliberately misgender” a transgender person and who refuse to refer to them using “the correct gender”.

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Presumably the correct gender here means whatever that person feels themselves to be that day? Medical staff, then, are not only meant to accommodate a delusion but will be in trouble if they don’t.

How have we ended up here? How many of these cases are there? Why are the basics of nursing care being overridden by a world view not shared by most of the public?

Where care fails, as it tends to when it is over-complicated by petty regulations and these hypotheticals that barely exist in reality, it is because care is no longer seen as a human relationship.

Skilled carers are regarded as the lowest of the low and they make decisions all day that make someone else’s life a tiny bit easier.

Green Party leader Zack Polanski’s halo slipped on Question Time when, while trying to make a pro-migration argument (and explaining that one in five care workers are migrants) patronisingly said: “Now I don’t know about you, but I don’t particularly want to wipe someone’s bum.”

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No, you see we have slaves and women to do that I suppose. And now we must instruct them in how to be better people, in how to actually think.

Yet, surely we have seen that so many problems in our hospitals arise when patients are not listened to over the things that really matter. We see this in maternity units, and in the care of the elderly.

When I last visited an elderly woman in hospital, I found that she wasn’t really eating any of the food. All she fancied was a bowl of cornflakes and they had that in the cupboards on the wards. I had to argue all the way to the top to get it for her.

And the awful stories of the women who spoke to the parliamentary inquiry into birth trauma showed one thing repeatedly: that the woman giving birth was ignored, not listened to, or respected. Much of what went wrong for these mothers and babies could have been avoided.

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These issues are way more important than whether a man in floral leggings is called “sir” by a flustered nurse.

Still, we have reached the point where activism within the NHS has meant female nurses no longer being able to get changed in private, separately from trans colleagues (which is what has happened in the cases of Sandie Peggie and the Darlington nurses).
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Nurse Sandie Peggie endured a legal battle with the NHS over single-sex changing rooms Credit: Jane Barlow/PA Wire
It has meant a denial of biology at the heart of the medical establishment, which is truly shocking. It has meant an inordinate amount of time has been taken up catering to the needs of a tiny number of staff and patients at the expense of other services.

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All of this would stop if Keir Starmer and Phillipson (the most recent politician trying to block rules protecting safe spaces for women) do what they are supposed to do and implement the Supreme Court judgment instead of running scared. Most of it is simple common sense and anyone who has actually done any “caring” would not be raising spurious objections to it.

It is fundamentally about maintaining single-sex spaces for women. And in hospitals, where women are vulnerable, this is important.

Meanwhile, all the fuss about toilets and infants is ridiculous. Of course, mums can take their little boys into the ladies as we always have done. Phillipson has also said that, if we protect women-only spaces, mothers would not be able to take their baby boys into swimming pool changing rooms. She is just wrong here – common sense in those instances will prevail.

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This is about protecting women and children by not allowing adult men into our private spaces. There are gender-neutral loos in most public places. None of this is that complicated.

If the Health Secretary Wes Streeting were to get a grip on the NHS and show some integrity, he would make sure the Supreme Court ruling on the Equality Act is obeyed. He would also put a stop to the planned, NHS-commissioned puberty blocker trial, which is utterly unethical. This would earn him much respect.

It looks like a member of my family will be in hospital over Christmas, as some of your loved ones will be too. I wish them and especially their carers well at this time of year. Let’s let them get on with their jobs.

More from Suzanne Moore

The Olympics is finally turning its back on trans nonsense. Now others must do the same
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Toilets and changing rooms must be used on basis of biological sex, guidance confirms​

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Alison Holt,Social affairs editorand
Nick Triggle,Health correspondent
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Single-sex spaces - such as changing rooms and toilets - must be used on the basis of biological sex, new guidance from the equalities watchdog has confirmed.

This means, for instance, that a trans woman - a biological male who identifies as a woman - should not use female toilets or changing rooms, according to the code of practice.

The guidance, produced by the Equalities and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) and now approved by ministers, makes it clear that transgender people should instead be offered a third or a gender-neutral space.

The code states that leaving a trans person without access to any services or facilities would be unlikely to be proportionate and could be discriminatory.

The guidance was published on Thursday following the landmark Supreme Court ruling last year that the definition of a woman under the Equality Act should be based on biological sex.

The code of practice sets out how associations, businesses and services open to the public should organise their facilities. It covers a wide range of settings from shopping centres and gyms to hospitals and restaurants.

Women and Equalities Minister Bridget Phillipson said the aim was to allow people to live free from discrimination and harassment.

"Our focus has always been making sure organisations have clear, accessible guidance on how to implement the law," she said.


Within the guidance, it was recommended that gender neutral toilets or changing rooms should have self-contained lockable areas with floor-to-ceiling walls and wash basins.

The watchdog said it did not think the requirements would be too onerous as services could decide to let trans people use toilets for disabled people, for example.

The EHRC also said if a service just had two toilets - one for men and one for women - they could be changed into unisex facilities.



Minister blames 'slow' watchdog for trans guidance delay​


Trans people could be barred from services based on appearance​


With the guidance now before parliament, MPs and peers have 40 days to raise any concerns. If there are no objections, the guidance becomes statutory.

The guidance, which is more than 300 pages long, was first sent to the government in September 2025.

The EHRC said it expected ministers to spend six weeks examining it before either asking for revisions or placing it before parliament.

Instead, the government said it would deal with the issue "thoroughly and carefully", and took six months to release the guidance.

EHRC chair Dr Mary-Ann Stephenson said she hoped people would read the code with an "open mind".

"I think we do need to broaden out the debates, and we need to start from a point of saying, how do we make sure that everyone has access to the services they need, and that will be different things for different people," she said.

At the Watershed arts cinema in Bristol, chief executive Clare Reddington said they pride themselves on being inclusive.

She said it had taken too long for the guidance to be published which has led to confusion and misinformation.

Reddington described the impact on trans people as "toxic", and said they had been waiting to hear what the guidance meant "for their ability to live a full public life".

The Watershed has gender neutral toilets, which won a Loo of the Year award in 2024.


The brightly coloured cubicles have floor-to-ceiling doors, and some have sinks inside. They also have separate male and female toilets.

"I would say that designing toilets for everyone is great for business," Reddington said.

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Bristol's Watershed arts cinema chief executive Clare Reddington says they pride themselves on being inclusive

'Less rights'​

Maya Forstater, of Sex Matters, a gender-critical women's rights group, said: "Finally, there are no more excuses for the many public and private sector organisations that said they were 'waiting for guidance' before fixing their unlawful policies.

"The government's long delay in placing the updated code of practice before Parliament was seized on as cover by organisations that preferred to break the law than enrage trans lobby groups.

"The new guidance is long and detailed, but at its heart is a simple principle: 'sex' means what it says – male and female. What people call themselves and how they dress doesn't change their sex.

"Any business, charity or public service provider that took a wrong turn and started letting men who identify as women use women's spaces or vice versa must now urgently fix its policies."

But a spokesperson for TransActual, a trans rights campaign group, said the guidance left trans people with less rights.

"Not only does this new guidance fail to protect the rights and dignity of transgender people, but appears to have weakened protections for the LGBT community as a whole," they said.

"TransActual will continue to fight for equal access to public life for all trans people, and will publish our full thoughts on the new code once we have had the time to properly scrutinise it."