Forget the euphoria and final scoreline yesterday for a minute, and let's be honest. Up till that goal went in, I looked down at the technical area in front of me and there they were - Warno, Blacko and Jeppo, the ****ing Marx brothers. All we needed was Chico Choo and Harpo Tan down there because there were already about 5000 Grouchos sitting around me watching that **** quality play against 10 men until Bamba scored. I thought the Three Stooges were funny but this lot are out on their own - trouble is it's not funny any more. You can do as many pre and post match interviews with Warnock as you like but you'll always get broadly the same message - "we do what we can in the circumstances" - FFS we've created them. Back slapping and taking crumbs of comfort from the 3 points is just great, but despite their massive contribution to this club this past 2 seasons, I'm worried they're out of date and out of touch with football at this level. Somebody got it wrong this season. No matter who or what, it needs to be addressed. Praying 3 teams will be worse than us is tempting fate too far. Whether you throw money at it or a new management team at it (or both), the club (Tan) needs to agree and set out a plan to avoid limply dropping back to where we came from just a few months ago. It won't be easy, but probably a damn sight easier than getting back up here next time.
Sparkey...after the years of famine and then the financial disasters, I am happy to sit tight a bit and take a breath. We are on the right path and some worries have gone. Now that we are worrying about staying in the top end I can live with it. not sure it is mismanagement ….rather a different approach. Whether they get it right, I don't know but I'll give them their head....I can't do anything about it anyway. I had the pleasure yesterday of watching Frankfurt FSV v Freiburg II in the Regional leagues…..effectively the fourth (fifth?) level of German football. Freiburg were young , fit and passing it around with gay abandon (what you'd expect from blokes trying to get into the firsts of a Bundesliga 1 team). FSV were pretty dire and reflected guys at the pinnacle (maybe above!!!) of their career. Dogged stuff but they brought the young guys down to their level and forced a draw. What I am trying to say is that FSV were in Bundesliga 2 and pushing to go up. They had big town support, both from fans and city government. They dropped down a league, went bust and got relegated further for that and I'm not sure which came first...money troubles or on-field struggles. I'm not sure they will ever get back. Maybe we will drop but we will survive and be in a better place, financially and on the field. We have an owner who has made mistakes but learned from them. He was called as mad as a box of frogs by noisy neighbours...but they'd have him now over what they have......an empty box!!! I'd have our manager over theirs, however well he has done, so far. If we stay up, I'd hope for some development to make it a more permanent thing. If not, I'll enjoy the Championship and maybe come back again. The noisy neighbours got 7 years by good luck and management (side played out of their skins and they bought and sold well) for a couple of years and then by the skin of their teeth thereafter. Not sure how they will fare now but there are more skeletons to come out of that cupboard, I am sure and the Championship is hard to get out of playing sweet football with young lads. Good luck to them if they do, but they are all enjoying where they are for the moment....and frankly speaking, so were we. Our promotion maybe came a bit too soon and no-one was fully prepared. NW may be struggling or he may be making the best of a bad job. His purchases don't seem to fit the Prem.....but his type of player and style are more suited to lower leagues. He is a much more grounded person and maybe he (and us!!!!) are happier prowling the Championship frightening the crap out of others.
The only other thing I forgot to day is that, for me, it is easy since I am not able to turn up every other Saturday and see what is dished up.
I must admit I'm enjoying this season far more than the last time we went up. Maybe it's because we know that we were lucky to have made it by just true grit and our never say no attitude. When Malky took us up it was all flowers and light, big money players we thought we could beat anyone on our day. It was just another mirage, smoke and mirrors comes to mind. This time we know that we will have to scrap for every point in the hope that a record low amount of points will keep us up. Although we have struggled to find the net there has been some good football played among the dross. I've been surprised by the way Manga, Morro and Bamba have improved. I think that come January the transfer money will be there to improve our lot. I'd take 17th right now and bite your hand off, if we fail not the end of the world. We need and want to play against the best but I must admit I miss the Championship.
I stuck the thread up to provoke some debate but nobody seems to have bitten that hard....... I said on the matchday thread that it was our worst performance that I've seen this season, even the one against Burnley that we lost wasn't as bad. I stand by the tone of the OP, and a last minute goal to win it doesn't alter the fact that we were very poor throughout the game especially against 10 men. We failed to kill it under the same circumstances against Newcastle and Huddersfield and it looked like the same would happen again until that scrambled affair at the death. They sat back and invited us on for about an hour after their guy was sent off and we had no idea going forward how to break them down. We couldn't pass through them nor around them, only over the top was on offer- that is down to team management and tactics. The technical area below me was a sea of frustration. When the goal went in the relief down there was tangible. Got out of jail - I should say so.
I will agree with you Sparks. Away at present so watched on tv with Portuguese commentary. Don't understand them but even they sounded fed up like they had been given the worst gig of the weekend. Sol's goal was a bonus we didn't really deserve. We were tactically inept and had no idea how to gain an advantage over 10 men. I think Arter would have improved things but we had to play with what we had. Great to get the 3 points but little sign of any major improvements.
I definitely think the euphoria and relief of the last gasp winner made us forget how hard we'd made it look to play against the 10 men. There were times when I thought we were going to lose (Great save from Neil to prevent this). I was impressed how quickly and well Brighton got themselves organised after the sending off. There was a definite feeling of frustration in the crowd that I haven't felt before this season so far. Its still fairly early but if we couldn't get a result against 10 men of a mid table side for the best part of an hour then we really are in trouble. I agree that this came from the management style and tactics. I didn't see much change for us when we had the numerical advantage. I wanted to see some hard running and movement up front to make up the midfields mind for them about a forward pass (at least look like we wanted it!). It seemed that they thought more of the same was enough. Ultimately they were correct this time. I also agree that who knows where we would be now if a 'proper' manager hadn't come to the club when he did. We may have been looking up at the championship wishing we could be there. Its human nature to want 'more' but I am enjoying the season. As Cardiff fans we are used to being the underdogs and deep down we love it and enjoy ruffling a few feathers.
Our problem (apart from central defensive and full back frailties) is our lack of pace and creativity and inability to pass forward to a player in space and on the run. Watching Man City yesterday were many examples of these necessary attributes. Obviously City will never get to that level but other mid table teams do eg Bournemouth, Watford, Wolves, West Ham and Palace even with their lack of goals. City can do it eg the 16 pass leading to our equaliser but not enough. Arter for Ralls should improve the offensive passing. Until we get better players team spirit and lumping it into the box will only go so far and that’ll be down the trapdoor to places like Millwall and Preston.
I took as much pleasure in the 3 points as anyone else on here, but it'd be a huge mistake to think we earned them through good play - we were poor and got lucky. If it wasn't for Bamba's goal at the death, and you could feel the massive relief surge around the ground, there'd be a far different tone on here. Another 1-1 draw playing against 10 men for an hour would have been seen for what it was. Instead the 3 points took the pain out of it, but the reality remains - something needs to change if we're going to climb out of trouble. On the subject of Man City yesterday - that was a lesson to us all. Whilst we can't hope to emulate them nor their players, we can learn that passing the ball beats trying to run with it. They took the Man U players out of the game by moving the ball rather than running themselves. When they needed to run they did, otherwise they made the ball do the work - just brilliant.
Aye, and one touch football in the Prem costs £££££££££££ It's okay to cite the likes of Bournemouth, Wolves and Watford etc but they all spent a s##tload more money than we have (Watford may be an exception in their promotion year, I can't remember tbh). Bournemouth would have had their arse kicked for FFP breaches had they not gone up, Wolves definitely would have. Pretty much everyone bar Huddersfield have by luck or good judgement been in better positions to cope with Premier league football without major overhaul OR have had the money to make a major overhaul. I'd liken our position to that of Huddersfield or Burnley the first time they went up under Dyche. We may survive and if we do we'd need to strengthen significantly to repeat the feat. However, I won't be shedding any tears if we do go back down as the Premier league is a horrible place to be and will be up until such time as the "big" (ie self serving greedy feckers) bugger off to their closed shop European Super League!
That's just the problem though Brizz - it is very much a matter of luck and/or judgement. You can't do much about the former, but you need to exercise the latter. Money obviously comes into too. No need to throw silly money at it either. Now we are up here we had the guaranteed funds this season to utilise sensibly. Apart from the usual "bad luck" on the pitch that seems to get blamed for everything, there's genuine bad luck that can hit any club. You can buy a player for 20/30 mill and he can do his cruciates or break a leg in his first game, but that's football and no amount of money will avoid that. The judgement bit comes in recognising what you need to compete at this level and then funding it. Once again, we're not talking about the funny money that the top half dozen teams throw around, but a considered and calculated policy that gives you the opportunity to compete effectively with clubs other than the "elite". I've still got no idea why we're essentially trying to stay in this division with Championship players nor whose decision at the club it was to go this way, but it's nothing to do with "luck" - it's the other one that's at fault and that's where the "judgement" comes in. You can say it's the financial constraints placed on the club by the owner, or put it down to poor assessment of what was needed by the management. Either way we're scrambling around for points relying on other teams to fail to keep us up. It was never going to be easy but we've not made it any easier for ourselves with our poor summer transfer policy (judgement?), whoever set it out.
I’ll say it again as I’ve been saying all season: why try and adapt a championship team to PL standard rather than supplement the best of last seasons team with PL quality? I just don’t get why NW was allowed to do that given his poor track record at PL level?
Maybe it was because we only have a Championship level management team? Would have been seen as a huge slap in the face for Warnock had he not been given the chance to have a shot at it up here, but are we now going to pay the price? Wishful thinking is one thing, but downright naivety as a football club is another. Recognising and getting to grips with the standards up here has been missing.
Funny that Tan was publicly outspoken over the Cornelius signing but has been quiet on the madine front.
I think the fuss Tan made about the Cornelius episode was more about Malky paying something like £7.5M on "one for the future" without his knowledge rather than using the dosh to maintain Prem status. Madine, who cost almost as much was bought to do a job there and then, but the decision fell flat on its' arse. To that extent, Tan would have personally authorised it and was therefore party to the deal - nowhere to hide unless you publicly blame your manager for a bad decision and effectively misleading you.
