There really hasn't been a lot of negativity. You feel I'm being harsh on Clasie - fair enough but I still think it was a stupid challenge as Shaw was going nowhere. You just lost it due to people banging on about the same thing i.e. the chances.
I'm sure that type of comment was common, during Pochettino's early months in charge. That turned out alright, in the end. Just need more creativity upfront. (Something that was also said, during Pochettino's early days).
I thought that we played quite well, we have some good players, and you can see from how we try to play through teams Puel is Wenger's apprentice. Only problem is that we just don't look like scoring (tonight if we had Mane and Pelle we may have got something) and our formation is not conducive to width, we rely on the full-backs and leave ourselves exposed, otherwise we just play in front of teams and unfortunately this wont hurt so many teams. Not a disaster as tonight was the wrong time to be going to Old Trafford although we nullified them quite well.
I was worried before the game that there might be an unfair score on us; my thoughts up until before the game is that we've created a good Europa League team and I think tonight confirms that. In the first 2 thirds we were tidy and generally effective, barring a few rusty passes and positional brain farts. The final third though was the first of the 2 issues for me, we were way too vanilla. Not strong enough on the ball, happy to go sideways too much and didn't look like we caused their defenders too much hassle, there were however some exceptions to this. The other issue is the lack of plan b, although the Romeu change was enforced, if our attacking prowess was vanilla, our plan b is more "coconut deluxe" than anything else. I'm sure as other people have mentioned, we are looking for one/two attacking options. If we started the season with the squad we have now, I think we'll be OK, but I worry about the cumulative effect of too many "nearly" performances like tonight.
From a Man U perspective, I do feel like it was a comfortable win for them. We did make them work for it, and we made them nervous a couple of times. But overall, I didn't feel like we ever looked like stealing 3 points or even 1. I also don't think I can pinpoint what went wrong. I feel like we just weren't good enough in most areas, while not being awful in any particular area. I don't think not playing the diamond would have fixed it. I think that Bertrand is better than Targett, but Targett was by no means horrible. So I don't think just switching Targett out would have altered the game. I would say overall that game looked like a mid-table side losing to a true title contender. Which I guess could be read either way. Mid-table means that we don't have to panic over relegation, and that we were by no means awful. OTOH, I think we all hope to be better than mid-table. I suppose the negative view for me is that I think we were fundamentally flawed enough that I think we need changes. It wasn't just a one-off bad game, or Man U was just too good. We saw a lot of the same issues this game as we did against Watford. Just a stronger side and we didn't have a man advantage so the result was as good. The positive view is that we have a lot of time to make changes. Hopefully we bring in another player or two. I think we can maybe shuffle around midfielders a bit and see if that helps. We can change formations. I think it's a bit too soon to say we will for sure play better. I don't know if Puel has the tactical nous, or if maybe our team just isn't that good, or who we might bring in. But there are plenty of options still left to try and we'll have plenty of opportunities to try them still. Overall I guess I would say I am 20% slightly disappointed and 80% "let's wait and see."
Utd are going to be very good this season. These new players will start shifting some of the old crap out of their team. Rooney to West Ham perhaps? Hard it here first!
I'd been comparing this to early Pochettino too. Remember people complained at first that we were always awful one half and excellent the other and then when we managed to play two good halfs in a match we'd be excellent? But similar comments being made about players having to be fitter/running more etc. Very like Pochettino's era.
Wish they would get Puel a translator. I commend the guy for trying and his English is better than my French so I certainly can't criticize. But you can see that on those questions there is a lot going on in his mind, and his lack of fluency prevents him from giving the answer he'd like.
The question of where our goals are going to come from this season remains. 10 from Long, 7 from Tadic but we need to be getting 50-60. Davis, Clasie, Romeu, JWP arent going to contribute many/any. Redmond is playing out of position in his first season so anything can happen there. Will we need to revert formations and rely on Austin? Will JayRod ever make his way back? A lot remains to be seen and we've got to remember that we are starting from a new place managerially, tactically and with a new front line. My overall impression from the game was that we are still a very competent side with well composed players, particularly in defence but our front line is not going to terrify opponents and in midfield we are setup for defending and holding not slicing through defences. Its going to take some time and some managerial magic to settle us and find our best form.
Please tell me people are not being serious earlier in this thread when they said it was a clear penalty?! You must be joking. There was no contact from Clasie at all, Luke Shaw tripped over his own leg! Sky just brushed over it and it's a disgrace.
Its was as soft as they get but the blame is fully on Clasie not the ref or Shaw. Didnt need to do what he did. Clumsy as play in the box.
He really didn't. I've watched it several times and there is no contact. Not sure if this link will work but take a look... Take a look at @WarAndSetPiece's Tweet:
Nope, and Shaw did the same thing at one point. I was really surprised a foul throw wasn't given and wondered myself if that was one of the rule changes.
Can't get another link but search for "shaw dive" on twitter and there are plenty of angles and it's fairly obvious. For the record I don't think Shaw dived, he just tripped himself.
Right... I haven't read all the comments since my last post and I just want to post a few of my thoughts. I'm pretty drunk so I apologise in advance if I make little sense or if the order is ****ed up... 1- I thought we played pretty well, much better than I was expecting and it has made me feel less 'concerned' about the season as a whole. At times I think we looked very similar as we did under Koeman - who despite what some say was a brilliant manager for us, arguably the best in a generation. 2- I'm still unsure about the diamond, though I think calls for it to be dropped are premature. It's still early days and it's clear the team are still getting used to it. I've seen a few people (not on this thread) saying it's never worked in the PL. I ask those people to look back at Liverpool in 13/14. Though one thing I will say is I hope we are prepared to switch up during the season. Versatility is key and as much as I don't want to bring Ron up again I think this is something which made us so strong last couple of years. 3- There's no shame in losing to United. I know we won our last 2 games up there but they're quite clearly a different animal now, and as I mentioned before the game they seem to have some momentum which they haven't had since Fergie retired. Taking everything into account they are my favourites to win the league. 4- Thought Fonte had a good game, doesn't seem to be too distracted by speculation though I think it's imperative we keep him. 5- Think Targett was pretty decent too, yes he lacks pace but i can think of a few times he was beaten yet got back to make a block/tackle. Clearly Bertrand is a step above but reckon we'd struggle to find a better back up. Plus as he's an academy player (which is something we pride ourselves on and makes us unique as a club), he should be getting more suuport from some fans than what he's currently getting imo. 5- Yes we can say despite all our good play we didn't create a lot but as I can remember this has been a problem for a long time so nothing new. Again think it's also worth noting the opposition & the manager. Would be suprised if they didn't win at least 14/19 of their home games. 6- Hojberg looks class, thought he struggled with the pace of the game for the first ten mins or so but grew into the game and you can see what a wonderful footballer he is. Will only get better as season goes on. 7- I'm still concerned about the DM position. Though Clasie done well (bar the pen) when he came on I think we are very light there. I personally think some underrate how good Vic is/was (and did during his time here too!) I also feel we lack a bit of height which is pretty important in PL. 7- Regarding points 1, 2 & 5. I think a lot of that only applies once we sign a few players. I've said before that we will struggle like **** without more attackers. Hopefully more players will help with both the creativity/clinical problem and the new formation. I'm sure we will make signings but will be borderline suicide if we didn't. 8- Hate to end on a negative but think we will struggle against Sunderland next week. Will be a bit of role reversal to tonight and Moyes knows how to set up his teams away from home. Again, !pologies for the ridiculous long post but as I said I'm quite drunk and can't be arsed with replying back and forth right now. I've got my Son tomorrow so really need to go to sleep If anyone wants to address specific point then please do and I will reply tomorrow. One more thing... Up the ****ing Saints!!
