I understood the point you were making like i said mine weren't planned (by me anyway) if it was left to me i would never have had any, i was too busy out ravin and poppin pills every weekend and would never have seen myself turning in to boring old **** that spends his time on an internet forums. One advantage is when my daughter is 18 and bringing her 18 and 19 year old pals round i will only be 40 and still be able to nip to the toilet for a fly tug over her pals young nubile bodys without too much fear of having a heart attack