@ AmsterdamWUM... At least it's not a line of people thinking I'm an ignorant, deluded, moronic disgrace of a human being (I know you have problems reading initial intentions, and have to have me spelling **** out deary, so this is a derogatory remark aimed at you)... Have fun being bitter mate (you won't get any from the crap O'Neill will be left with if he doesn't get those overpriced transfer-skates on soon, anyway...)
I don't see the need for the way you're attacking people with a view differing to your own, as you have in the posts I have just read. This is a discussion, can we have it like adults maybe? If a mentally ******ed person murders someone in cold blood, why shouldn't they have equal punishment as someone who is fully sane. They have committed a crime that justifies the punishment, and are clearly a danger to society, so death penalty is equally desirable imo. Although I can understand the point about them not knowing what they're doing, but imho it doesn't wash. As for your argument about corrupt prosecutors that you have made, that's an entirely different subject, almost completely irrelevant to a discussion about the death penalty.
Surely someone who is 'mentaly ******ed' is incapable of making their own decisions? No one is asking for them to be released on the spot as there is many hospitals/Jails that house such people at the minute. To me the only issue is where they end up. Jail or hospital. Was it not an English king who opted for his wannabe killer to be locked up rather than be killed?
I see your point totally, and to be honest I'm 55/45 on this one, maybe that's not enough to kill someone, I don't know. However I don't see which party loses out here, as someone who is incapable of understanding that murder is wrong, is hardly going to give a toss about whether they are put to death or locked up in a mental institution imo.
That's the point imo. So what do we do? Just kill them? How can we bring our children up to be forgiving and show compassion when we are killing mentally handicapped people?
The same can be asked if we are locking mentally disabled people up in solitary confinement for their entire, what would be miserable, lives. I think you have to show, this is right, this is wrong, anyone over steps the mark, look what happens. I certainly think it would be CRUELLER to keep a mentally disabled person alive like that, when they clearly wouldn't have a clue what's going on, than it would be to put them to death.
I think you're at it but... Most mentally handicapped people are actually happier in an enviornment that is structured and involves breakfast time and bedtime and all inbetween. They are, by their nature, looking to other people for direction. Thinking that they would be better off dead harks back to a certain mustached individual who's hunting ground included much of Europe around 70 years ago.
I very much agree with your view, as stated earlier, but how can we bring our children up to be forgiving and show compassion when someone can simply go and kill the most important people to them and be let off the most serious charges because of mental impairment? The "moral superiority" wears a little thin when you understand human-nature and various natural chemical processes in the brain. Note that being "mentally disabled", while medical fact, is only comparative and subjective construction. Being "abnormal" depends on having a normal precedent. With that in mind, it tends to go a bit off-topic in my opinion to keep bringing up the special "abnormal" cases, and not focus on the "normal" ones. That is a criminal, obviously guilty beyond any doubt of one of the most serious crimes... Death penalty or not? I see a problem in people passing off the special cases as an excuse to skip-over the normal, because it means they are probably incapable of facing up to whether or not they really are for/against the death penalty theoretically.
I was well aware that some of my comments were sounding very much like that, was wondering if you'd bring it up Obviously I'm not saying mentally disabled people are better off dead, but those that are capable of murder, imo, should get the punishment that any sane person would get. They aren't going to be able to live any sort of life afterwards as they won't be allowed access to the public. Your point about them being happy in a routine is fair, i wouldn't know as I'm no expert so I'll trust you on that. This is why I'm so unsure on this one as it is definitely arguable that they aren't responsible for their actions, but I just think to spare their lives opens up a massive grey area which isn;t really necessary. All of a sudden you will have lawyers trying to prove disabilities that aren;t there, and where do you cut the line off between someone who is and isn't responsible for their actions?
I'm against the death penalty regardless if it is Fred West or someone who is mentally handicapped Judean so the only question for me is Jail or Hospital/Jail.
The point about Lawyers is true. They are over a dead fly for compo for the dirty window that stopped their flight path. I'm against the death penalty for anyone so arguing about the different branches re. state of mind, with me is pointless.
Fair enough Personally, as I said I agree with you. I believe however that crimes committed by the individuals can be potentially minimized by better health care (which would help identify, regulate and possibly treat patients who have such conditions), but that means a better economy and dramatic re-investment in the NHS, and we're in the **** right now and the conservatives are all with BUPA so...
And you're fully entitled to be, we'll agree to disagree and leave it there for the night, have a good one.
Fair enough For what it's worth I think that for many people we have the Earth and the Mind sussed out. We are nowhere near it. You can never take the animal out of the Human Being. What's the difference between a premeditated murder and a drunk guy outside a nightclub hitting a guy around the side of the head with a brick he picked up? Both are murderers but are they both evil? A person has lost their life.
