Why Is Suarez's Racism Taboo?

velachiperoo - Good answer mate - We obvioulsy have a different view of the term but I'm happy we debated each others point rather than calling each other c**nts.

Seems we stirred up a hornets nest too - I'll enjoy the fallout.

 

Rubbish. I am black and called people black xxxx ... was I being racist ?

 

I am a bit wary of getting in here again -but here goes. Why is calling a player a black bastard,or mick bastard, or Iti bastard any different to calling them a c*nt? If any of it is done in calm intentional manner then it is racist. If it is a response to just getting hurt by a bad foul, or whatever - its a reaction to pain. However I am always a bit puzzled as to why the nig word is so offensive (so I'd NEVER use it). Oddly how can you black guys say that to one another? So the Suarez stuff was a bit concerning - because he wasn't reacting in pain, was he? i don't like Terry, but perhaps he was reacting after getting hurt? Not too sure about all this stuff. What is sure is that we live in a world where our nationality, religion, culture or race takes on far too much significance.

 

So I win right? Yeah was really good discussion I am glad that while we disagree we both made our points without biting each others heads off.

This I think is directly attributed to historical significance/weight of the term. The word ****** has been used as a derogatory term for black people for 100's of years and has its roots directly linked to the slave movement started by the Europeans and used by the Americans. The word ****** brings up direct reference to slavery in the west and up until the 60's a derogatory term to discriminate against 2nd class citizens due to their skin colour. It has far more socail and historical significance than calling someone an English bastard or White Bastard or C***. It is why using the term black in a derogatory sense i.e. black bastard rather than white bastard is so much worse as it has a historical significance.

The progression of the word since then was during the freedom movements and the empowerment of black people post 60's they reclaimed the word to weaken's it's power as a term of hate and lessen it's historical significance. All though the rap culture and lack of education in today's youth has bastardized it too useless while ignoring the reason it was used. Which is why it is still such a hot bed word. You can make the logical argument of calling someone fatt is as bad as calling someone a ****** but it doesn't hold sway due to the lack of discrimination against fat people historically.

 

thanks for helping to explain that. I assumed the root 'nig' came from Nigeria, and suggested the person was a slave stolen from Africa.
Thus of lower status to the plantation owners.
Perhaps the term Nigeria didn't exist for the area at the time of slave capture ?

 

The root history of the word itself mate I don't have the foggiest.

 

My mother is 82 and she use terms like ******,wog,chink,she describes gays as queer.I've spent years telling her these terms are unacceptable but she still uses them.My mother isn't racist she's just from that era when such terms were acceptable.She certainly isn't homophobic as my elder brother was gay

 

So what's your problem with Bingo?

 

Okay the eldest generation you forgive and forget and move on they are racist in modern day conventional sense to some extent, but yeah mostly it is what was considered acceptable in their time. You are not gonna get them to change their ways now. My grandmother used old Kasmiri and Hindi (India) terms to describes dark skinned people (black/south Indian) which my generation and to some extent my parents generation know to be racist.

But that doesn't hold sway here in this argument, it is an entirely different kettle of fish

 

Surely the word ****** comes from the spanish / portuguese words Negro / Niger meaning Black?

 

When I think about offensive words to black people ... what is offensive is what it relates to. ******, coon, wog, darkie, sambo - are all names that are offensive, I think as was mentioned, it is a reference to being a 2nd class citizen, a link to slavery and, in the case of being called a monkey - a reference to not being as developed as humans. I've been called all of them. Add Kunta Kinte to the list as well.

Got to say though, I can't think of a name for white people that comes close to being as offensive as any of those words, I mean, honky doesn't really cut it does it

 

Wasn't Suarez's defence that he used the the word negreto or something similar as it was the Spanish word for black ?

 

Like I was saying dont have a clue one the origins was discussing it's significance. Quick wiki read shows

 

The use of the term ****** is racist because of the way it's charged, particularly when used as an insult. And in the context where, according to Evra, Suarez said he kicked him because of his colour, then that would go down in court as a racially-aggravated assault no? A very serious offence. I think there's some hysteria over what terms are acceptable and what aren't. I personally think it's more the way they were used, here it was used as an insult, an attack on Evra because of the colour of his skin. Suarez did this over the course of several minutes, which suggests it wasn't a heat-of-the-moment slur but a dogged tirade.

It doesn't matter if Suarez is racist or not, it was a racially motivated attack on Patrice because that was how Suarez made it out to be.

 

When someone pisses me off, I tend to use whatever term/words/phrases I think will piss them off the most. I call someone a 'black this' or 'yellow that' or '4 eyed whatever' because I hope it upsets them, not because such terms offend me.

That said, I would not of use such terms/words/phrases in everyday conversation as they wouldn't enter my head. Except where Cym is concerned. He brings out my ageism & Welsh-centric xenophobia in spades (no additional pun intended)

 

TBF I would happily kick Patrice Evra, not because he is black but because he is a right C***

 

The trick is always not what you find offensive but what others do and what the law does.

 

I agree that people who are of the generation mostly all dead, or quite old, use terms openly that most of us cringe at.
I think this is due to when they were young and impressionable these descriptions were made as if the people described were indeed 2nd class citizens. Large scale immigration after the WW2 sadly reinforced that view as a majority were people who came to Britain without much money or sometimes skills that were not sought after here. Thus 'the older generation' continued to speak in this way, not readily accepting immigrants as equals. At least us younger Brits ( now including those immigrants' children) are educated better and much less often confront the bigoted views a few still hold. It has been a slow process, not always helped in my opinion, by things like the race relations act, which continue to draw attention to differences between us, instead of allowing understanding and cultures to be come more tolerant and accepting.

 

I am sure if I called a white guy a honky he would laugh at me and tell me I needed to move out of the 1960s

 

I doubt many would be bothered because we haven't been brought up to be offended. Black people have found that various words were intended to be offensive - hence thats quite different and understandable.