Clubs Facing Administration

After the shock of Rangers' administration and 10 point deduction could Port Vale be next? http://www.thisisstaffordshire.co.u...ns-pain-Vale/story-15041672-detail/story.html

What a sorry state of affairs and it's only gonna get worse.

 

I know, it's desperately sad.

 

Whatever your thoughts on rivalry it IS ALWAYS sad when it comes to this. Laugh at your peril - your club could be next. We never thought it would happen to us as we were led to believe we were being managed well at the time.

 

Yet another sad tale. The only consolation they might have is that 10 points would probably not see them relegated like it did us and they could not have a fire sale of players as there is no transfer window left so the timing would be better if it has to be. As long as the team kept the points ticking over then they have plenty of time between now and the start of next season to sort themselves out. It just goes on and on though.

 

Is it? It's a football team, not a living, breathing, sentient, being. If Rangers go out of business it will have been of their own doing for living way beyond their means. IF they fold they won't vanish, a phoenix club will arise and start again. After a few years they will be back as strong as before but don't tell me they deserve no real punishment for their actions. If every club behaved as Rangers seem to have done, the whole of the UK and it's taxpayers would be in an even bigger mire than we already are. I'm a taxpayer, I pay tax and I don't see why Rangers should'nt. It's as simple as that.

 

So you don't care that people will be made redundant then? Of course it's more than a football club - it's real people's livelyhoods. I'm not talking about the players but joe bloggs who sells tickets in the box office, people who serve in the shop etc.

 

I'm not a complete ogre, of course I feel for the people at the bottom of the ladder, that's what makes it even worse, millionaire footballers will get their money, that's guaranteed, but the rest can go sing for their supper including the fans, but if they are guilty of tax avoidance why should I wish them good luck in a deal which will allow them to write off a vast debt, some of which came from MY pocket?

 

Mismanagement is nothing to do with the people who work for the club or the traders who will likely lose a lot if a club goes tits up. It is to do with the upper management and only them. All businesses should live within their means but that is not to say people should be happy to see a club go to the wall for whatever reason and whoever they are. I may be indifferent to some extent but happy definately not.

 

People are losing their jobs every day, it's a sad fact but letting Rangers off scot free should not be an option. What's to stop EVERY club who is in trouble pulling the same stunt when they are in massive debt?

 

And there speaks a Celtic supporter...........

I was actually commenting about Port Vale rather than Rangers. As scottish football is akin to mickey mouse then I don't take a lot of notice of it. However, I don't particularly want ANY club to go to the wall for their supporters sake who invest a lifetime generally in following it. Without Rangers in the hunt in that league it will hardly be worth running it anymore which it almost isn't now.

 

All highly original insults, well done.

 

Original insults or facts? Scottish premier league is not a mickey mouse affair then? Sorry to disagree but it definately is when only 2 clubs have had any chance of winning it for christ knows how long. That isn't a competition it is a play off with the rest making up the numbers. There is no interst outside of Scotland for the competition simply because there is no competition. It's why players are signed for the top Scottish division from the lower depths of the English leagues. Real top class players don't want to go there and the clubs can't afford to pay ordinary players more than they get here anyway even in league one. In terms of European football Scottish teams hardly register on any scale. Insults? This is pretty much fact my friend so sorry to burst your bubble if you think otherwise.

 

"guilty of tax avoidance"

You can't be guilty of tax avoidance because avoidance schemes are perfectly legal. Tax EVASION is illegal.

I don't know the ins and outs of what Rangers have been doing but from the little I've heard, they've been deploying avoidance through employee trusts not evasion e.g. anonymous payments to overseas bank accounts, mentioning no names.

It's not all all beyond HMRC to take test cases against what are believed to be legal schemes: it's up to the Government to draft tax legislation as they see fit: if employee trusts are within the law, then people are entitled to use them.

Meanwhile, it's not just the staff I feel sorry for but the fans also, although if they stopped demanding instant success from their clubs, directors might stop spending insupportable sums trying to buy it.

 

I was speaking to a few locals at Port Vale and they are convinced it's only a matter of time before they are in administration. They should be safe enough this season even with a points deduction, but that's how it's starting to become. Clubs planning when to go into administration! And all the while the big clubs get richer and richer....

 

Don't talk such crap and start telling me what a "fact" is, it's not a fact it's your "opinion" which you are fully entitled to but I suggest before you start pontificating you have a look at your own "Best league in the world" and see how many teams have won that over the last 10 years or so.

As for the quality of our SPL, where have I said it's anywhere near the EPL?

Boo ****ing hoo, the EPL is better than the SPL

 

They have "avoided" paying the Tax which was due, I never said it was a "criminal" offence, merely that they are "Guilty" of not paying it.

 

its got to happen in the next few years that supporters have got to take over the clubs, so that everyone is on an equal playing field, look at swansea,wrexham exeter..all going now with no future problems, and theirs us Shrewsbury, who's owners are just happy to keep the fans hungry by being around the play off positions but with no real ambition or hunger to do well so the can milk the cream off the top!!

 

The Government writes tax law and tax payers [if they have any sense] use that law to minimise the amount of tax they pay. That's the way the system works. Nobody is guilty of anything, legally or morally, by operating the tax system according to regulation.

Sir David [Murray] said: “Words cannot express how hugely disappointed I am with news of today’s appointment of administrators to the Rangers Football Club PLC. The timing of the appointment of administrators is especially surprising given two facts.

“Firstly, there has been no decision, and there is no present indication as to the timing of a decision, from the first-tier tax tribunal concerning the potential claim from HMRC of £36.5million excluding interest and penalties.

“Secondly, legal opinion on the strength of the club’s case remains favourable.”

Now we've learnt the hard way at PAFC not to believe everything [or even anything] club directors tell you and it may be that the trirbunal decides at some point that Rangers didn't apply tax law properly. However, the fact HMRC say they didn't and have demanded tax is neither here nor there, they always say that. I don't suppose anyone is going to hand over £36m before the tribunal has ruled if they can avoid it.

 

I'm not sure that Exeter come into the........."all going now with no future problems" category ......just above the relegation line and no money to replace their star players that left last summer.

 

As you took the trouble to come all the way down here to the Plymouth board I thought I would have a look at the Celtic one to see what people were saying on there Devadvocate. Lo and behold there is speculation about the time being right for Celtic to push for entry into the English Prem. Not in a million years will that happen for many reasons. Somebody would have to make way for them which would be like asking a turkey to vote for Christmas. Secondly and more important, the EPL don't need Celtic whatsoever in their mix. Celtic however need the EPL which is not the same thing. The way things pan out in Scotland means that it is only ever a 2 horse race and nobody else stands a hope in hell. They know it before a ball is kicked as does everyone else. Whilst the EPL is also restricted in who can win it, the options are more than just 2 and that band has grown a little rather than like Scotland shrunk to just one club now. Now your's is a one horse walk over and that gives no interest for anyone outside of your borders. It is automatic entry into the Euro Championship and that makes the divide between the clubs abilities to finance themselves even greater. It also means all but automatic exit from the competition at the first hurdle every year because the club involved is just not good enough or rich enough to progress. IF, big if there, Celtic were ever to be allowed into the EPL they more likely would not even qualify for the competition in the first place. There was somebody on your boards reckoning Celtiic could have been 4th this season in the EPL. Now this is opinion of course but to me that is somewhat deluded. Mid table at best would be my guess although it will never be put to the test. You might find bigging up the Scottish PL as anywhere near equal for any of the clubs to the EPL will take some doing but you carry on deluding yourself if you want to.