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The Victor Chandler Chase - Ascot Saturday 21st January

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by OddDog, Jan 15, 2012.

  1. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    This coming Saturday sees the 25th Anniversary renewal of the Victor Chandler Chase. The race was due to premier in 1987 (hence the 25th Anniversary) but that first renewal was lost to frost and the 1988 race to fog. So the first ever Victor Chandler Chase took place in January 1989 and produced probably the most memorable renewal to date, with Desert Orchid carrying 12 stone to a head victory over Panto Prince running off 10st4lbs. The concession of 22lbs (the race was originally run as a handicap) looked to be too much for Dessie but he really dug in after the last and, to the accompaniment of Peter O'Sullevan's unforgettable commertary "Dessie's fighting back like a tiger" he got up in the shadow of the post to win by a head.

    Other notable winners in those handicap years include David Nicholson's Waterloo Boy and Viking Flagship, Martha's Son, Call Equiname and Well Chief. In 2007 the race was elevated to Grade 1 status and is now run over 2m1f at level weights. David Pipe's Tamarinbleu took the race in 2008 but the last 3 years have belonged to Paul Nicholls with Twist Magic's 2010 victory being sandwiched by Master Minded victories in 2009 and 2011.

    Currently 12 horses are entered as follows (odds from B365):

    Finian's Rainbow (2/1) - favourite for last year's Arkle who was outstayed up the hill by Captain Chris. That race remains the only defeat to date over fences for Nicky Henderson's gelding who went on to take a rather weak renewal of the Maghull Novices Chase at Aintree. Finian's Rainbow reappeared over christmas at Kempton in the Desert Orchid Chase and looked to be cruising along when making a really serious error at the 4th last. Given time to recover by Barry Geraghty, he gradually worked his way back into the race and a flying leap at the last helped him to reel in Wishfull Thinking to claim an ultimately comfortable, if hair-raising success. I think Sandown will suit him and if his jumping holds up he should win.

    Al Ferof (11/4) - Last season's Supreme Novice Hurdler has taken to fences like a fish to water this season. He fought off Astracad with an awesome combination of jumping and power in the November Novices Chase at Cheltenham before showing he can battle in the Henry VIII at Sandown, pulling out all the stops up the run-in to beat For Non Stop a neck. The subsequent run of For Non Stop behind Cue Card is difficult to weigh up so for me the form remains good but slightly questionable. I also think Cheltenham suits Al Ferof much better than Sandown so I would not be rushing to back him here. The Arkle will be a different ball game though.

    Kauto Stone (5/1) - Half brother to the Star, he won the Grade 2 Ladbrokes.com chase at Down Royal (2m4f) in tremendous fashion before being done for speed by an imperious Sizing Europe in the Tingle Creek. I think 2m1f round Sandown will be plenty sharp for him and, if he does run, I'm sure we'll see Ruby make plenty of use of him as we know he stays further. This may however be a stepping stone to the Ryanair at the festival and he doesn't appeal to me at the odds.

    Somersby (6/1) - NO. EOS.

    Wishfull Thinking (6/1) - it really looks like Phillip Hobbs is struggling with the right trip for this one. He was second in the Jewson at the festival before taking the 2m4f novices chase at Aintree's National meeting and a 2m5f handicap chase at Punchestown. In his first 2 runs this season he has gone off like a scalded cat, weakened and been caught, finishing well down the field. He was much better last time in the Desert Orchid chase at Kempton, where he settled much better but hit the 4th last hard in unison with Finian's Rainbow. Although he lost less momentum that the Henderson horse he was readily outpointed after the last and it is difficult to see him reversing the form over this 2 mile trip.

    Gauvain (15/2) - has lived in Master Minded's shadow for the last couple of seasons but is capable of putting in a big run as he showed when taking the Peterborough Chase on his last start. This might be a bit sharp for him but could sneak into a place at a nice price.

    Forpadydeplasterer (10/1) - the perennial bridesmaid has been 3rd on his last 2 runs behind Big Zeb but he doesn't quite appear to be up to this grade.

    Others declared are I'msingingtheblues, Oiseau de Nuit, I'm So Lucky, Dan Breen and King Edmund but it is difficult to make a case for any of these.

    Conclusion: A clear round of jumping should see Finian's Rainbow winning this en route to the Champion Chase at Prestbury Park. Al Ferof is a worthy opponent and Paul Nicholls clearly thinks plenty of him, bit I can't help remembering how he struggled to see off For Non Stop here last time and I just think Finian's Rainbow will have a little bit too much for him.
     
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  2. rainbowview

    rainbowview Well-Known Member

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    Nice preview Odddy <ok>

    I think Al Ferof can take this. He is a much better jumper of a fence than Finians Rainbow imo.
     
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  3. woolcombe-folly007

    woolcombe-folly007 Well-Known Member

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    I believe it will be between the top 2 with FR taking the honours, an interview with BG today on ATR he seemed very impressed with the horses work and Hendersons horses are booming this year. Saying that I would like Kauto Stone to win this. I am a very big fan of his and I reckon he can be nearly if not just as good as his brother!!
     
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  4. TopClass

    TopClass Well-Known Member

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    Smashing write up Oddy <ok>

    Very interesting race. Finians Rainbow has both impressed me and worried me simultaneously in the same race, twice in fact.


    Last years Arkle he was superb, travelled very well, but the negative was that he just didn't see the Cheltenham hill out.

    This year on Boxing Day he made a glaring error to almost knock himself out of contention, but then fought back tenaciously to stay on strongly and win it late on.


    If he is serious about a Champion Chase challenge, he ought be looking at winning this.


    Al Ferof not impressive last time, but he was in front a bit early and I think Finians Rainbow ought to give him a real target to aim at, which will very much be in his favour. Interesting test but I feel the result will have little bearing on their Cheltenham performances come March.



    Nonetheless, and on my part, stupidly, I am going to dabble on Somersby, who has run really nice races right handed, has some good efforts at Ascot and travelled supremely well in the King George until about half a mile from home. I suspect Finians Rainbow might just get outstayed here if he makes it a proper pace and Al Ferof might just have a bit to prove going right handed, so that is the logic.


    That said, I expect big runs from both Al Ferof and Finians Rainbow at Cheltenham, especially the former when he runs on up the Cheltenham hill.
     
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  5. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Do you think Al Ferof will go the Arkle Toppy - I think it would be a mistake to pitch him in against Big Zeb and Sizing Europe. I think he has a favourites chance in the Arkle, can see him outlasting Sprinter Sacre up the hill.
     
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  6. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    I'm agreeing with you on this one Oddy.

    Even though I rate Al Ferof as the more talented horse of the 2, I think conditions on Saturday will suit Finians Rainbow more. Al Ferof is at his best on spring ground, on a stiff track, hence why he has performed well at the last 2 festivals. Finians Rainbow is best on a flat track, and his performances don't seem to be effected by the ground. You also have to factor in that Finians Rainbow has alot more chasing experience aswell :biggrin:
     
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  7. Istabraq

    Istabraq Member

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    I agree Rainbow, If Finians Rainbow is a potential 2 mile champion then its got to be the weakest division there as ever ever been. I don't think hes quick enough and I still don't think His jumping is good enough either. He only just managed to get up in the Desert Orchid and any mistake he might make at Sandown will effectively end his chances as I believe there are sounder jumpers in the field the same can be said at Cheltenham. I gave him absolutely no chance at Cheltenham last year in the Arkle but he suprised Me at how well he jumped and travelled just ran out of gas up the run in, I think it says it all when a horse who won the Arkle at the festival last year is now being aimed at the Gold Cup (Captain Chris) it shows the limitations of the horses behind at 2miles IMO. I think Finians will take his chance at Cheltenham but will be well and truly put in his place by the likes of Sizing Europe and Big Zeb and will stepped up in trip...

    Im encouraged by Wishfull Thinking's last run, Its always a worry when a horse doesnt finish his race like he did in the Tingle Creek but he looked like the horse he was in the Desert Orchid so Im expecting a better showing, Im a big fan of Al Ferof he looks a sound jumper and is clearly not lacking in speed he must go close if he puts a sound round of jumping in. At the prices Im tempted by Forpadytheplaster E/W, I think he represents a good bit of value and he rarely ever puts in a poor performance weather hes quite good enough to win Im not sure but I expect him to be in the mix...
     
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  8. TopClass

    TopClass Well-Known Member

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    I do think he will go the Arkle route, yes. UNLESS he goes and gives this field a beating at the weekend, but I just don't think this is his sort of race really.


    The Arkle all depends really. Sprinter Sacre is a wonderful jumper and it depends how much daylight he puts between himself and the field when they turn in. He might simply be a lot stronger this season, he did look a real tank of a horse at Kempton. I think if Al Ferof can stay withink 3 lengths then he might be able to get him on the run in. Whatever happens I think this years Arkle is a real firecracker, some super novices.

    Al Ferof and Peddlers are Cheltenham specialists. Sprinter might just jump them out of contention though. Will be fascinating to watch.
     
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  9. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    It's funny how the Champion Chase was only mentioned for Al Ferof, after Sprinter Sacre bolted up at Kempton. Maybe PN doesn't see any point in taking on Sprinter Sacre, and thinks the 10 year old Sizing Europe is an easier target :biggrin:
     
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  10. TopClass

    TopClass Well-Known Member

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    It crossed my mind Shergs, but Sizing Europe is a serious Champ himself. Nicholls comments last week made it clear that it was simply covering his options, as is the standard for his top horses.


    Barry G was very keen on Sprinter though, so he might genuinely be something special.
     
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  11. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    Good write up Oddy. I'm going to stick with Al Ferof I think. He's the one I would be most worried about if he takes on Sizing Europe in the Champion Chase. We just don't know how good these upstarts might be but there are a few of them and hopefully at least one will emerge as a good'un. I hope they all make it safely to Cheltenham.
     
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  12. Grizzly

    Grizzly Active Member

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    I knew I was getting old but I remember watching that very first VC chase !
    Fascinating to see how Al Ferof copes with the big boys and this looks a serious renewal - if he comes through this he'll be vying for favouritism in the Arkle market I think, should be a great race
     
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  13. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    Topclass...I'd say SE is one worst Champion Chasers for a while, he barely won a race last year before Cheltenham, and then got stuffed at Punchestown afterwards. Fair enough he is a Cheltenham horse, but his overall record is not that of a serious champ. More like a horse who got lucky on the big day :biggrin:
     
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  14. Sir Barney Chuckles

    Sir Barney Chuckles Who Dares Wins

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    I really can&#8217;t see beyond Mr Henderson&#8217;s Finian&#8217;s Rainbow here as he is a classy individual running over the distance that he excels at against a novice and a lot of horses without a trip. Should win on the bridle in a contest that overall is &#8216;lacking&#8217; given it s Grade 1 status and rich purse.
     
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  15. WubyRalsh

    WubyRalsh Member

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    Finians for me, will come on for his seasonal debut win, jumps for fun and will like the track
     
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  16. NassauBoard

    NassauBoard Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to say it but Somersby interests me again, but I wouldn't back it with AS' money. Think they will go hard enough in this to try and get FR beat, and Somersby is a good jumper of fences and should relish the test. Travelled so well in the King George but didn't get home, and this is weaker, much weaker.
     
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  17. NassauBoard

    NassauBoard Well-Known Member

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    8 declared with Kauto Stone being the major non dec horse.
     
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  18. Grizzly

    Grizzly Active Member

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    I can smell another well though out each way for me that I place on Friday only to discover a NR on Saturday morning leaving a field of 7 with mine finishing, yep, 3rd...... <laugh>
     
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  19. Zenyatta

    Zenyatta Active Member

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    This is a question, not a statement of fact.

    Is Gauvain hugely overpriced at 8/1?

    My answer is possibly yes. He beat Somersby fair and square in the Peterborough Chase last time and yet Somersby is a best priced 6/1 for this.

    Finian's Rainbow is a worthy favourite but he doesn't look unbeatable, especially considering that I'm not convinced by any of his form (even though I quite like him). He also tends to jump left handed which won't help. Al Ferof is only a novice and needs to step up on anything he has shown to win. That is perfectly possible but not a given. Wishfull Thinking might bounce back to form but again that is no given. His last run at Kempton was something of a return to form but he will need more to win this.

    Gauvain's form tailed off last season but he won well at Cheltenham, and then again in the Peterborough. He's now had a nice break and comes here fresher than most. He is joint second top rated on 162 and whilst he might appreciate further, the same comments could apply to many of his major rivals too. The stiff 2m1f at Ascot should be OK. He has run well right handed so that shouldn't be a problem. He jumps well in the main (despite falling in the Tingle Creek) and that might well be crucial given that Finian's Rainbow can be prone to the odd error and Al Ferof is untested out of novice company. Trainer Nick Williams is in good form, Noel Fehily is top notch in the saddle.

    In all, he appears to have a lot in his favour and if the 8 runners stand their ground then 8/1 EW 1/4 the odds 3 places would look a decent bet. He might find one too good, he might find two too good, he might even find more than that too good. He might run a bad race, as he can on occasions, but at the price it would be a risk worth taking. A lot will depend on how many stand their ground.
     
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  20. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    The Somersby point is a fair one Zenyatta, though it just proves my point, that Somersby is one of the biggest hype horse's in training, 2nd only to that Mikael Dhagenet mule. Its amazing how long it is taking people to realise that Somersby is not up to G1 level. He never has been and he never will, he should be 16/1, on his form this season and last.

    I agree that Guavain looks over priced, the worry I have with him is he's either very good or very bad, so I wouldn't rely on him as a place banker, if I was backing him id save half my stake, and just back him to win :biggrin:
     
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