Saints expelled from Play Offs by EFL

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What is the point of playing sport if you cheat ? That is against the whole principle of sport. I just feel that we need to be made an example of so that other clubs are never tempted to do the same.
Ian, regarding cheating in football, I have been saying for years that of the 23 people inside the white lines during a game, only one of them has no intention of willingly cheating. That’s the bloke with the whistle. The rest will do whatever they can to get the officials to give them advantages they shouldn’t have, from a simple throw in they shouldn’t have to diving.
Sadly it’s what the game is all about now.
 
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To be fair, I will always remember Henry for his sportsmanship at Cardiff in the FA Cup final, when he could have gone down and got Claus sent off in the first ten minutes, but stayed on his feet. The referee was the only person in the stadium who didn’t see the foul, and thank God no VAR back then.
Great minds.
 
We were presented with it at the weekend.

Problem is because we were already planning on admitting it all it's hard to now say we didn't have time to build a defence for the extra two instances.
How were these brought to us?

From the evidence it looks like it comes from our internal comms/ WhatsApp?

If so, we've incriminated ourselves?
 
Thierry Henry on Southampton expelled for spying drama against Middlesbrough:

“I have to be honest, this is a difficult one. Spying on another team’s training is wrong. Full stop. It crosses a line, it undermines the trust that should exist between clubs, and I understand why Middlesbrough are furious and why the EFL felt they had to act strongly. Integrity matters in this game.

At the same time, I find myself questioning whether expulsion from the play-offs is the right punishment. It feels… heavy. Almost like using a sledgehammer when a precise scalpel was needed.

Let’s be clear: this wasn’t match-fixing or doping. It was analysts pushing boundaries for tactical information, something that, sadly, has happened in different forms across the game for years.

Marcelo Bielsa did it openly at Derby and Leeds, admitted it, and people called him a genius, not a criminal. Drones, analysts in trees, whatever, in the modern game with data and marginal gains everywhere, clubs push boundaries.

Southampton admitted it, yes, and they deserve punishment. A heavy fine, points deduction, maybe even a ban for the staff involved. But kicking the entire club out after they earned their place on the pitch? That punishes players, coaches, and fans who had nothing to do with one or two analysts doing something stupid.

What troubles me most is the collateral damage. The players who battled through a tough Championship season after relegation, who went to extra time and scored that late goal to beat Middlesbrough on the pitch, they earned their place in the final through merit.

Now that achievement is being erased because of actions taken by a small number of staff members. That feels disproportionate to me. A significant fine, a points deduction for next season, and sanctions against the individuals responsible, those would be strong, meaningful punishments that address the breach without nullifying an entire season’s competitive work.

Sport has to balance two things: protecting fairness and recognising that human error and ambition sometimes lead people astray. If every rules breach in high-stakes moments leads to rewriting results, we risk turning the disciplinary process into something more powerful than the football itself. I’ve sat in dressing rooms where we prepared meticulously for opponents. Everyone does. The difference is getting caught.

I hope Southampton appeal and that the final decision finds a better equilibrium. Middlesbrough deserve respect, they were wronged but the players of Southampton also deserve not to have their legitimate efforts wiped away. Football is emotional, passionate, and imperfect.

The response to this should reflect wisdom as much as outrage. We need clearer rules going forward so incidents like this become rare, but we must be careful not to let one mistake destroy what was built legitimately on the grass.”

Always liked Henry.
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I think there is a chance we are reinstated but only a low one, around 20%. The fact the EFL added charges at the last minute probably helps our case.
I think the odds of winning are much higher than 20%. A KC of his stature would not have wanted to take on this case, unless they thought it was winnable. Professional reputation is important to these type of high profile KCs.
 
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How were these brought to us?

From the evidence it looks like it comes from our internal comms/ WhatsApp?

If so, we've incriminated ourselves?
They probably asked for it. We'll find out more when we get the full written submission.
 
Yeah they’ve asked for it, and we clearly thought that by admitting the charges immediately would mean we would get a lighter punishment. I don’t think it ever was considered that an expulsion was realistically going to happen, hence why we were so cooperative.
 
How were these brought to us?

From the evidence it looks like it comes from our internal comms/ WhatsApp?

If so, we've incriminated ourselves?
You have to remember that our Chief Executive admitted what we'd done to Steve Gibson, possibly the most litigious man in the football league, in front of EFL representatives. It's clear the club totally underestimated how serious this could be.

In fairness to them, pretty much every talking head "in football" that I've seen today, from Harry Redknapp to Le Tissier via Brett Ormerod, Rickie Lambert, Gary Lineker, Alan Shearer, Simon Jordan, Danny Murphy and Thierry Henry has said they're surprised and the punishment is excessive.
 
You have to remember that our Chief Executive admitted what we'd done to Steve Gibson, possibly the most litigious man in the football league, in front of EFL representatives. It's clear the club totally underestimated how serious this could be.

In fairness to them, pretty much every talking head "in football" that I've seen today, from Harry Redknapp to Le Tissier via Brett Ormerod, Rickie Lambert, Gary Lineker, Alan Shearer, Simon Jordan, Danny Murphy and Thierry Henry has said they're surprised and the punishment is excessive.
Oh I completely agree. As I said previously, I think Parsons has tried to be honest in an industry of ****e hawks.
 
What is the point of playing sport if you cheat ? That is against the whole principle of sport. I just feel that we need to be made an example of so that other clubs are never tempted to do the same.
I have slept on this.

Punching the ball into the net is cheating. Observing a training session - is the correct term - is not in the same league. It’s possible to watch hundreds of hours of opposition setpieces and open play and that’s not considered as cheating and yet watching the same players in a training environment is being treated as worse than punching a ball into the net. You will never find an example of a games outcome being overturned for blatant on field cheating but you would have the most severe penalties ever considered in the game for what amounts to a marginal increase in the information already available to every team.
Yes it was a breach of the rules, yes we are all embarrassed that it happened however the games were played and the results have been overturned. In that respect this is an unprecedented outcome. I do hope this is the argument we are presenting. We did not cheat in the game, any advantage gained was not enough to win the first game on the field. I no longer think that this was a reasonable decision.
 
Oh I completely agree. As I said previously, I think Parsons has tried to be honest in an industry of ****e hawks.
No doubt. I actually wonder if any of those public statements will be presented to the panel. When you have the likes of Henry, Lineker and co saying this sort of thing has always happened and it's not a big deal, does that carry any weight?
 
You have to remember that our Chief Executive admitted what we'd done to Steve Gibson, possibly the most litigious man in the football league, in front of EFL representatives. It's clear the club totally underestimated how serious this could be.

In fairness to them, pretty much every talking head "in football" that I've seen today, from Harry Redknapp to Le Tissier via Brett Ormerod, Rickie Lambert, Gary Lineker, Alan Shearer, Simon Jordan, Danny Murphy and Thierry Henry has said they're surprised and the punishment is excessive.

And he probably said that because of previous sanctions given to teams that broke EFL rules in the not too distant past. If the punishment is not overturned, the EFL have made a case for every club who breaches EFL rules to be punished to the harshest extent (is what the wronged club will argue and now have evidence for). If a club finished 10th, and spied all season, should they be relegated? A 20 point deduction? An 8 figure fine?
 
EFL allowed Middlesbrough to sell tickets before the appeal outcome. I’m sure our KC will argue that as an appearance of prejudgement.
The judgement has already been made, no reason Boro can't sell tickets while appeal plays out.