Off Topic Politics Thread

The closest thing I can think of is after covid restrictions were lifted, Celtic and Rangers continued to ban away fans from Old Firm derbies, up until late 2023 I think. But that was on the clubs themselves rather than police advice.

 

I am not sure if there have been any other European ties where there has been a political angle in UK. I could imagine this being thr case with teams from.the Balkans or maybe Greece / Turkey/Armenia.

As I said before, the actions of Israel are having implications in European countries. This is just an example.

 

I just don't think we should be bowing down to threats of violence like this and it sets a worrying precedent while sending out a poor message.

As IOAG said ultimately I think appeasement is playing a big part here unfortunately. You can't just cancel things and ban people if they might be at risk of violence, that's what police and security services are for ultimately.

The question about whether they should be competing is a reasonable one but ultimately a different discussion and not relevant to the decision here.

 

They are known as being one of the worst group of ultras around but there are many of those and there's no way they would ban Ajax or Roma fans who are also pretty dangerous at times!

Starmer has jumped right in though like the fool he is. If his interjection reverses this decision and there are then massive full scale riots he will get absolutely hammered! A day after saying that a spying scandal was a matter for the CPS and not government.........he wades into this in the reverse position!

 

Luton banned away fans for a while after the infamous Millwall.riot in 1985. In 2002/03 Millwall banned supporters of Wolves, Forest and Pompey from.attending. And way back in the mists of time, 1975, Manchester United fans were banned from.Liverpool.

 

I'm sorry to say but this strikes me as another example that in this country we tolerate a level of discrimination towards Jews/Israeli citizens that simply isn't tolerated for any other minority.

It's awful.

 

Wait until Ian hears about Lazio…

 

100%

 

I don't think they are worried about the 1000-1500 Israeli fans. Its the hordes of coaches spurred on by Owen Jones and his lot to attend that is more likely to be the problem.

 

Is this a Guardian revisionism or was it found out that the pre organising of a so called Jew Hunt by Muslim residents of Amsterdam was not true? Pretty sure a lot of the images we saw on TV were actually attacks on the Maccabi fans and not the other way round.

Yes I'm sure there was a fair amount of dodgy chanting but thats what happens at every match day and in this country seemingly every Saturday in London dodgy chants are fine as well.

So was it discovered it was the Maccabi fans at fault last year?

 

Leeds - Galatasary?

 

This one of a number of articles about the violence in Amsterdam when Maccabi Tel Aviv played Ajax, of course it was going to go off. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c30p1jmzjrzo bit more in depth https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/11/what-happened-amsterdam-israeli-football-fans

There's no condoning either faction for the provocation and violence that followed. It would take a huge police operation to allow the visiting 'fans' to attend with every chance that there would be clashes. Those that are loudly protesting the ban would be those loudly protesting the cost of policing the attendance.

 

Good shout. Fairly different circumstances though in that Leeds fans had been killed by Galatasary fans just a week before.

Like I say this is nothing to do with hooliganism.

 

Huge police operations are required constantly for football matches here as well as other things like protests etc. maybe we should never play at Fratton Park again.

I certainly would have no problem with money being spent on protecting foreign football fans

 

Indeed. It is about British "authorities" saying they can't stop British residents attacking foreigners, which is a bit of a wow moment in the context of our own domestic political arguments!

 

That's exactly what it is mate. It's a huge embarrassment imo.

And I'm willing to bet if it was another group at risk the people defending it absolutely wouldn't be.

 

Times is reporting that the delayed local elections of this year..........might be delayed another year. lol. There's no hiding they are playing the game here and just constantly feeding into the reform narrative:

"Elections to seven councils covering more than five million people could be delayed for a second year amid fears that Reform gains would stop Labour’s plans to overhaul local government.
Ministers are considering accepting private pleas from Tory leaders of seven county councils to cancel their elections this year."

and free re_mo_ve Pa_yw_all for anyone that didn't know about it Just post the pa_yw_all blocked address in the top and voila:

https://archive.ph/kBE5o#selection-1567.0-1571.129

 

Thumwood's attempts to vilify Maccabi are laughable. Why even mention Beitar Jerusalem unless it's an attempt to connect them all by association?

"One of the Israeli clubs is affiliated with the more extreme Zionists in Israel."



"According to the Guardian, Maccabi fans targeted Muslims during a match in Amsterdam in November 2024. "
Thumwood

As usual, Thumwood (or the Guardian) is selective in reporting what actually happened in Amsterdam.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78dzr432x7o

In another BBC report

Rachid O, 26, who was given 10 weeks in jail, was found to have taken part in a WhatsApp chat group called Buurthuis2, on which he referred to intended victims as "cowardly" Jews who he would never again get the chance to attack.

More than 900 people were in the group and the court said the chat had been used to pass on information to "commit violence against people of Jewish descent and/or supporters of Maccabi Tel Aviv".

Umutcan A, 24, was also found to have kicked one of the victims several times while taking part in an attack with other men and then kicked another fan on the ground. CCTV footage had shown him attacking several Maccabi fans, as well as grabbing one fan by the throat and seizing his football scarf.

He had written in messaging groups about a "Jew hunt" but told the trial he did not harbour hatred towards Jews.

 

Presume this is the ‘Ceasefire Now’ style protestors (fair enough) who now there is a ceasefire are finding it harder to disguise the ‘I just don’t like Israel’ which is the actual reality.

Which if you really drill down into it, well…

By the way, comparing it to the Russian ban - I can’t bear Bibi, I think he’s awful, and the Israeli response to October 7th was excessive. But when Israel unprovoked invades another sovereign nation, maybe then make that comparison.

 

The whole "I don't like Israel" is probably an extension of "I don't like the west" and "I don't like capitalism" and "I don't like Tories" anyway though!