Off Topic Politics Thread

Funny you buy what this guy says, considering your views on the IRA. He wanted them to keep fighting for a united Ireland…

 

Well he's nailed his colours to the mast... the only time he uses his head. I notice he plaintively cites "Battle of Berlin… Srebrenica or Rwanda.”

Interesting. While O'Neill was chief political writer, his former entryist employer was bankrupted in court, for claiming atrocities around Srebrenica were a hoax. (O'Neill was present in support)

"Living Marxism (LM) was at the centre of controversy for a 1997 article titled "The Picture That Fooled the World," which claimed that ITN's famous footage of an emaciated, caged Muslim man at the Trnopolje concentration camp during the Bosnian War was a deliberate misrepresentation. LM lost a libel case brought by ITN and journalist Ed Vulliamy, resulting in the journal's closure. Critics accused LM of engaging in disinformation and propaganda to downplay atrocities by Serb forces and to stifle debate about the Bosnian situation."

 

Both of these replies are pathetic diversion tactics. If you have no credible reply to the points being raised then try to discredit the source. I didn't expect any better but hopefully you read an alternative view article you wouldn't normally be interested in.

 

So you take back all you said about Corbyn. Good to hear! I should troll back and find some of the crazy things you said about anyone who supports the IRA.

But on topic, I guess Israel could just allow journalists in to see for themselves…

 

I think being involved with pedalling genocide denial again is extremely relevant.

 

That article doesn't really raise a valuable point either imo. It's bemoaning that to label what we can see they are doing as genocide as anti Israel is weak. If it were Muslims doing what they are doing too Jewish people people would display the same level of horror and repulsion. Can Hamas numbers and figures be taken as absolute fact? No. But the Israeli side certainly can't either as can be seen with lies and mistruths over and over again throughout this. If the might of the Israeli army really wanted Hamas out of the tunnels then an army of their expertise would do so easily. The hostages also a reason to continue the conflict despite having the opportunity to free many of them. Starving the population of Gaza is giving them an excruciating death sentence too. Israel just want the land by any means necessary and nothing else really matters to them

 

Double post

 

I’m feeling that there’s usually a bit of context to the Trump/Farage slagging and less of the non-specific cutting

 

I’m not offended, just disappointed that this thread aint what it used to be

I also feel it’s pointless name calling of a Mayor that’s doing a lot for London, whatever party he’s allied to

 

Explain?

 

I read through your exchange with Imp Saint last week (hilarious) and it's pretty clear you will say anything if you think it will win you the argument. It was full of the usual diversions, what ifs and irrelevancies. Your reply here is more of the same but I will answer anyway because I don't want anyone to be unclear about where I stand on terrorists.

You can troll back as far as you like, my opinions on the IRA are consistent. That you think criticism of terrorist supporters is crazy is for you to reconcile with yourself but a disturbing comment nontheless . They, like Hamas are murdering terrorist scum and anyone who supports them are just as bad. That includes Brendon O'Neill if that is what he has done. However, despite your feeble attempts it doesn't exclude him from making observations about the situation in Gaza and I'm sure if there were any untruths in that article you would have found them for me.

Corbyn though is an elected member of the UK parliament and is supposed to look after the interests of all those he represents. Instead he has acted out his personal agenda by cosying up to terrorists. Terrorists who have executed at least 150 innocent people here on the mainland and countless others in NI. The much quoted excuse for him being part of the peace process is contemptable. I can only guess those same people think he was trying to resolve the middle east crisis when he invited Hamas backers to the HoP and called Hezbollah his friends. So rather than take anything back, I maintain everything previously posted and I'll add that he is a wholly despicable person. I will also add that anyone who has disputed those well proven connections in order to justify voting for him are short of morals.

 

Oh how lovely. Yet again you sit back and don’t engage in debate, before sniping in a few cheap shots.

But you asked, so I will provide:

“The latter [his fave topic of Western elites, teehee] are ensconced in the airless ivory towers of the West, prepping hyperbolic claims bordering on misinformation”

Let’s start here, shall we? Cast the first stone all who are without sin and all that? Ensconced in airless ivory towers… hyperbole. Oh, this guy likes his big metaphors. They are hyperbolic and… careful to ALMOST accuse all these brainy types of lying. But he doesn’t. He says ‘bordering on’. Bad journalism- hypocrisy, stick waving and saying nothing at all.

“The West-Hamas alliance is undeniable now.“ Oh, he meant he was the one going to be lying. At best this is his warped opinion. The west is very clearly anti-Hamas. The people of Palestine are not Hamas, whether or not you think they are all religious extremists.

“They’re in league in all but name, united by a merciless antipathy for the Jewish State.” Again, the inability to separate condemnation of a state’s actions from condemnation of a state. But then he has no interest in being fair - this guy has been rage baiting for 40 years. He is the classic elite, uni graduate who got off on contrarian ideas when he was in his teens and never grew out of it.

“Netanyahu says it will be Israel’s ‘Battle of Berlin’.” Very interesting recall of WW2. We are supposed to link this with his comments about anti-zionism, yet how do we pair this off with the images of people suffering in Palestine who look appallingly like the Jewish survivors of the holocaust? Which side is Netanyahu on?

“The genocide libel will become unsustainable in the face of what promises to be brutal urban conflict between two parties.” It is funny seeing a man whose previous magazine folded for genocide libel make this claim. What isn’t funny is that it is yet another assertion based on no facts. He isn’t there. He presents no inside knowledge. This is the sick wish fulfilment of a man who makes his career arguing ‘the other side’.

The next paragraph he is back on his ‘elites’ rhetoric, ****ing off his right wing ‘these uni liberals are idiots’ fanclub. He uses all the buzzwords of the kangaroo court, building up the strawman of what his has decided the world sees in typically hyperbolic tones. He even uses the phrase kangaroo court and, of course, hysteria. Because an alternate point of view must originate in the wandering womb of liberal emotions.

In the next paragraph he performs a statistic trick for idiots. He says 5/6 of the dead are not civilians, it is just that 1/6 of the dead are named combatants. Okkkkaayyyy. So, actually since we don’t know who they are we should suppose they are combatants. This continues for three paragraphs. This man who claims the left make it all up… is again relying on probably’ and his own wish fulfilment as rebuttal. Very poor show.


I could go on? We could discuss the ways he dips into attacking the contributors to reports rather than find contrary evidence? We could look at the edges of dog whistling he falls into at the end?

So, I am afraid this article is trash. You should go back to uni and do some studying so you can appreciate just how poor it is.

 

Let's be honest here, whatever I say will not persuade you away from what you believe about Israel. And I am very sceptical about the veracity of news that comes out of Gaza.
But this is my opinion.
I agree it's difficult to get a totally truthful version of events but in my view many in the west are too ready to believe everything that comes out of Gaza and disbelieve the Israelis.
The label of genocide is very important because of war crimes and those who commit them being taken to court at some point. That is why the anti Israeli groups continually call it a genocide. There are some factors needed to support the genocide claim and of course Israel and it's supporters dispute those factors have been realised.
Your comment about "If it were Muslims doing what they are doing to Jewish people.....". Well, they already have and this war is a direct result of the Hamas attack on Jews at the Nova Music Festival in 2023. That atrocity seems to be generally forgotten now. Far from showing horror some people were dancing in the streets and even on this board the general tone was "yes it's terrible but this will give Israel the excuse they were looking for". To say I was shocked at the lack of sympathy for those Jewish victims and more concern shown for what might happen in Gaza is an understatement. There has been an underlying dislike of Israel/Jews by certain political groups in this country for many years, long before Israel decided to invade Gaza, and this action has given those groups a chance to promote anti Israeli rhetoric.
I don't deny the IDF are brutal, their attitude very simply put is kill or be killed. They are surrounded by governments and organisations who want to obliterate them and I believe, to them, the Nova attack was the last straw. They are now systematically hunting down Hamas and will destroy them. But despite what you say it won't be easy.
Finally the starving of the people in Gaza. Listen to the video link below if only to get an alternative point of view. The guy being interviewed says that UN figures confirm that 85% of aid lorries are intercepted inside Gaza by various factions including Hamas and it is they who are causing the food shortages. The UN, who are at odds with Israel have done nothing to stop the interceptions and are quite happy for Israel to get the blame.

As I say I don't expect to change views but have a listen anyway.

 

And you can barely get a sentence out without spitting and whining like a tart. But he’s Mayor of London, and you’re some **** on the internet wetting his pants because London elected a man called Khan.

 

Maybe so , but the fact you even have 0.01% defence for that man speaks volumes!

 

This is confusing. He isn’t the reincarnation of Vlad the Impaler. What exactly makes him so despicable that he doesn’t have one hundredth of a percent of redeeming features?

 

While you didn't get an answer to your request for an answer that is a cheap shut down there trying to present it as being against "a man named Khan" rather than just "against Khan." Infer racism as a reason to shut down the argument.

In terms of "what he's done for Londoners" I'm not going to argue for or against but you only have to watch him in his throne room for his QT and how he answers any question from anyone, not just the Tory or Reform ones to see how smug and arrogant he is! As much as he rails against Trump he has a very very similar personality it seems and very very similar way of responding in such a "superior" manner to anyone.

 

Don’t you have any roundabouts to paint Imps?

I like Sadiq Khan. He’s done a good job in difficult circumstances as mayor, and for a politician he’s a remarkably decent man. Given the dog’s abuse he gets just because of his surname, that’s no mean achievement.

 

Thank you

 

I suspect you back the people that tear down and jump on our flag to? Give your head a big wobble mate