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WAR! What is it good for?

Discussion in 'The Premier League' started by Treble, Feb 11, 2022.

  1. Solid Air 2

    Solid Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    yeah cos things are sooooo much better today .
     
    #20021
  2. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    A not so fun read (if true) ... 10 people including 6 children killed in an airstrike that hit a queue for water at a refugee camp

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0rvxjnvv71o
     
    #20022
  3. brb

    brb CR250

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    Always seems a strange word to me 'martyrs' generally speaking I mean.

    Why?

    Well the only martyrs I tend to remember in history were Japanese kamikaze pilots, it didn't end well for them nor the Japanese people as an ending chapter to the war.

    So I asked AI...

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    AI Overview


    While some may view Japanese kamikaze pilots as martyrs, it's a complex issue with varying perspectives. The Japanese government (replace with Hamas) certainly tried to portray them as such, but many pilots themselves struggled with the concept and sought meaning in their sacrifice beyond simple martyrdom. Many viewed their actions as a desperate attempt to defend their country rather than a quest for religious or spiritual reward.

    Here's a more detailed breakdown:
    • Japanese Propaganda:
      The Japanese government actively promoted the idea of kamikaze pilots as heroic martyrs who died for the Emperor and the nation.
    • Pilot's Perspectives:
      Diaries and letters from kamikaze pilots reveal a range of emotions and motivations, including a desire to fulfill their duty, a sense of desperation, and a struggle to reconcile their actions with their own survival instincts.
    • Beyond Martyrdom:
      Some scholars argue that the pilots' motivations were more complex than a simple desire for martyrdom, highlighting their struggles to find meaning in a situation they couldn't avoid.
    • Cultural Context:
      The concept of dying for honor and loyalty was deeply ingrained in Japanese military culture, particularly through the samurai tradition.
    • Alternative Views:
      In the West, kamikaze attacks are often viewed with horror and seen as a sign of desperation and fanaticism, rather than heroism. (The West probably still do this).
    Ultimately, whether or not kamikaze pilots are considered martyrs is a matter of interpretation and perspective, with both historical and cultural factors influencing the various viewpoints.
     
    #20023
    Saf likes this.
  4. brb

    brb CR250

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    #20024
  5. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    I will admit I had thought that the usage wasn't going to help the overall situation for quite a while - but on investigation it seems the usage is much more widely used than those that die in combat - it's used for anyone unjustly killed because of their beliefs ...
     
    #20025
  6. Citizen Kane.

    Citizen Kane. Well-Known Member

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    You being serious?

    It's obviously all relative though. Maybe you'd prefer to live as an indentured peasant in a mud hut having just buried his fourteenth child who failed to make it past 2 years of age, watching his wife waste away to the black death as 'doctors' dressed as crows apply leeches to her lesions and drain blood from her head by sticking a rusty metal spike into her ear, only to receive a knock on the wooden door from the local lord's serjant who confiscates all freshly grown produce to be redistributed due to the plague. A commotion outside distracts him though as a baying mob drags his sister to the local pond, which is full of human excrement, dunks her and then ties her to an altar and burns her as a witch. Then just as his wife breathes her last, a trumpet sounds and a priest marches up and down the muddy path calling for able bodied men to march on the local Jewish community and kill all men, women and children in order to atone for Jesus and bring an end to the plague.

    To each his own, I suppose.
     
    #20026

  7. Sucky

    Sucky peoples champ & forum saviour

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    Fosses childhood sounds horrific
     
    #20027
    brb and Diego like this.
  8. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    I would coarsely define a martyr as :

    A person who consciously allows themselves to
    undergo immense physical suffering (up to
    possibly death) in belief/support of some
    socio-political matter X, rather than
    renouncing/withdrawing their belief/support of X.


    So on that basis we are informed that 66 people
    consciously allowed themselves to die of
    starvation, in belief/support of X (X being what ?? ) .
     
    #20028
    brb likes this.
  9. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    Screenshot_20250713_145915_Chrome.jpg
    Only if we go with your definition...

    ... they could just refer to the dead women and kids as 'the murdered" ... guess that would be less emotive... <whistle>
     
    #20029
  10. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    As religion is one specific socio-political matter, my definition covers it.
     
    #20030
  11. brb

    brb CR250

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    please log in to view this image
     
    #20031
  12. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    Israeli spokesperson now saying there was an 'unfortunate technical error' that led to the water queue in the refugee camp getting obliterated! <doh>
     
    #20032
  13. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    In your head perhaps ... the real definition covers 'other beliefs' ...
     
    #20033
  14. brb

    brb CR250

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    Liverpool on the telly mate, ITV1

    Will watch until the Wimbledon mens final at 4pm I think it is....when I say watch, I just mean it's on, depends how it goes :bandit:
     
    #20034
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  15. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    I'm with @Chief on this ... we're gonna need a bigger plank <laugh>
     
    #20035
    brb likes this.
  16. Sucky

    Sucky peoples champ & forum saviour

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    These things happen man


    Look at the post office scandal
     
    #20036
    Saf likes this.
  17. FosseFilberto

    FosseFilberto Pizzeria Superiore and some ... Forum Moderator

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    The one where they closed before you could pick up your Giro?
     
    #20037
  18. Sucky

    Sucky peoples champ & forum saviour

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    Watch that kid on our left wing.

    Baller
     
    #20038
    brb likes this.
  19. brb

    brb CR250

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    Not really sure why a friendly is on TV, unless they thought there might be interest easing football back in after the Jota accident. Not sure how long this game had been planned to be aired.
     
    #20039
    FosseFilberto likes this.
  20. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    "belief/support of some socio-political matter X"

    covers all beliefs.
     
    #20040

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