Tbh I didnt have you at the top of my mind when posting. I was referring to what appears to me be have been a regular occurence of calling out mistakes and criticisms of him that other players have not had. More on a whatsapp I am on with family than on here. There have been times this season where a minority have called for him to be dropped. I am just pointing out what seems to be a flurry of articles putting a positive slant on what the ask of him this season has been. The Luton game you mention did include mistakes, but Regis pointed out how he had to shift Neil to CB after 20 mins because of Lutons tactics, and then the midfield as a whole had to be changed at half time to get control of the game. That game was an example, in my opinion, of Neils mistakes being called out by supporters, when it was a series of mistakes that would lead to his. Neil is the one being asked to adapt his game and position by the coach in games which is for the good of the team. I think the club are signposting that to us, and that he is bring asked to learn on the job.
A part of it is due to his new position, most of his play now is about positioning or receiving the ball from the defenders and playing simple passes to the fullbacks, a bit like we used to see from Corry Evans, if you aren't playing 40 yard passes or taking on players, some will think you're not playing well, or that something is wrong.
Someone mentioned that it was our best start since 1890 something, considering that we were the team of the 90's (the 1890s) I did a bit of research. After 12 games in 1891 we won 8 lost 4 Drew 0 1892 we won 9 lost 2 Drew 1 1893 we won 5 lost 4 Drew 3 1894 we won 9 lost 1 Drew 2 1895 we won 5 lost 3 Drew 4 Just out of interest, in our record 105 point season of 1998/99 we won 6 lost 0 and drew 6.
I didn't think you did mate ... ... I'm only answering for me though. I'm not a frequent visitor to social media tbh. Im my case it was the panicked clearances, needless sendings off and daft penalty at Watford. I know he's 'learning on the job' but to be fair so are Mundle, Jobe, Rigg, etc. O'Nien has learned half a dozen. I want them all to succeed but feel a little chat forum is the best place to discuss any issues ... ... I certainly wouldn't do anything but cheer at the game.
We wouldn't have beat Luton without Neil's contribution imo I don't mind him being called out for poor performances, some will call him out but they'll also call others out. Some will ignore the good a player does n only focus on the bad, some of that could be disliking a player but I think others will do it as mistakes will stand out more than all the good things a player like Neil will do. In the position he plays he will not do the fancy things that stand out to a lot of supporters (obviously the assist against Oxford was special). There will always be a player that will get it tighter than others, neil is that at the minute because of his red card (zero impact on the game) and the stupid tackle for the pen against Watford Neil has had a few games that have been well below his standards, now it sounds like its because he's having to take on more information than probably any player in the team - plus still adjusting to being captain! Neil has now had more good games than bad tho, he seems to be settling really well into his new role as a player but also as a captain. I don't mind when a player makes mistakes but what I hate is when a player makes mistakes then goes into his shell, Neil doesn't do that (tbf none of our players do at the minute)
Neil is a massive part of the side and the club. He wasn’t in top form indeed hasn’t been prior to Saturday, but he still does a lot more good than bad and he is always part of it. The criticism was a disgrace. Not the criticising but the manner and ferocity of it from so called ‘fans’ about a home town captain. Criticism is a part of football but trying to destroy people cos there’s nobody else to go at is insane. I love Dan. Liverpool don’t watch a player for 2 years cos he’s ****.
100% agree but local lads always seem to end up a target for some. Neils a class act but still learning, of course he will have poor games , who doesn't. I never understand why some of us think booing or hounding a player will improve their performance .. never will . Some need to take their beer goggles off now and again.
For a few online, the opportunity to criticise Neil isn’t really about DN. It’s actually just a surrogate for them to criticise their real target - Speakman and his inability to buy a ‘real’ dm.
I think Dan Neil is a topper player. Massive fan of his. Just feel he isn't a CDM personally and in the tougher games he has been lacking and it's nearly cost us. Games like Oxford when there is zero threat , is perfect for him. Give him time and space and he will run it like he did as an 8. Other games when it's more physical and or greater defensive demands, shows his weaker areas. That said, hope he continues in the form from Saturday. I still stand by my opinions from his performances so far this season though.
Interesting point that. We have long talked about wanting that holding player. I personally thought Neil was being moulded into that last year, particularly under Dodds. This year clearly Regis wants him there. I think the role of holding midfielder has changed in recent years. It isnt really a tough tackling ball winner you see in there anymore. It is more a player who screens the back line, makes the interception, and when necessary can win the odd 1v1. Much more important is the ability to set the in possession tempo, link defence with attack etc. Neil does those things well. Arguably the penalty mistake and the mistake for the goal against Luton was him playing centre half and getting isolated by attackers 1v1 in the box. Definitely an area to improve. But I am delighted to see Rodri get the award last night, much as I personally hate individual awards. 95% of the time it is for an attacker, now the value of the modern day holding player is recognised. Not suggesting Dan is going to be as good as Rodri, but I do think the styles are similar. Anyway, interesting to see when the lad from France is fit what Regis does. I think he is more experienced than Dan in the role. Time will tell.
Didn't Regis himself say that Neil shouldn't have been put in that situation, for the penalty ? Something like, one of the defenders should have screened and covered but didn't so left Neil in a bad situation. Yes he didn't make the best choice, but he shouldn't have had to make the choice in the first place
I'm not going to put myself in the position of being anti-Dan Neil, I'm anything but, I'm certainly not making points because he's local, I admit I always favour those players. But I do feel there's a place for a little balance and believe there's sometimes a tendency to ignore a player's deficiencies because he's local. I'm well aware of Neil's contributions and talents and understand exactly how he's being asked to perform in a role where he has limited experience. I'm not criticising Neil for his general game but think he's made mistakes that have nothing to do with the position he's playing. In those cases it's irrelevant where he's playing in my opinion. Allowing the man he's marking, to walk away from him, is just poor as is the tackle at Watford. Every player, in the team, should be able to do better in those situations. Sometimes players find themselves in situations they shouldn't be, but that's football ... ... Ross Stewart would've tracked that Luton player and I doubt he'd have dived into a player posing no immediate threat.
To be fair mate, it wasn't a bad situation and Cirkin was covering him. There were other defenders behind him and there was no immediate threat. It wasn't a situation where any kind of tackle was needed. It wasn't like the player was going through, one on one, with the keeper.
I'm just paraphrasing what rlb said. You know, the head coach bloke In reply to what felltop said "Arguably the penalty mistake and the mistake for the goal against Luton was him playing centre half and getting isolated by attackers 1v1 in the box. Definitely an area to improve. "
No need to be sarcastic mate, I wasn't. In this system players will find themselves in all kinds of positions, like our right full back playing inside forward to chip in a cross for our midfield player to be in the centre forward position for the first goal on Saturday. My point is that the tackle has nothing to do with the position Neil is playing, nor was the sending off against Burnley or the marking at Luton. They're just football basics no matter what your position is.
IMO Neil has not looked himself for a while and has had a dip in form which stretches back to last season. I think he is a young footballer who is captain of his home town club (being captain is not the only reason for his dip in form) and trying to deal with the extra responsibilities that go with that. However as with everything it is easy to isolate mistakes but I also think that he deserves great credit for some of the unsung work he has been doing and for starting to look like he is getting to grips with the crucial role RLB obviously wants him to play. All in all he has at times looked uncomfortable and has made some rash decisions which have been highlighted, he has also been a great link from defence to midfield and has been very good at helping us dictate games out of possession. And all of this from a man of about 22. He is not exactly perfect for us but for his age is probably years ahead of most and deserves a bit more patience from our fans. We are right to look at mistakes and be critical but it should also be balanced with support and praise when deserved (as smug, prehab and a few others have said). I believe in a few years time DN may well be one of the best CDM in the country he just needs some time to get there.
To be fair mate, if they're game changing incidents they're bound to be highlighted especially if they could win or lose points. That doesn't mean the other 89 minutes are being ignored. O’Nien has gone from being ‘Good old Luke doing his best’ to my favourite player solely due to his determination, But his pantomime ‘block’ at Hull, when their player feinted and hit the bar, could’ve cost us the game. I said so at the time, that’s what supporters do. Neil is a very good player but needs a cooler head when we’re under pressure imo and I still maintain the captaincy doesn’t help him which isn’t his fault.
Any DM is under spotlight if they make a mistake, and they do make mistakes. Dans mistakes remain minimal, the big ones. I’d be worried of a deep lying playmaker didn’t lose a few balls anyway. The Watford one was inexcusable, plain and simple, but a lot of a DM best and most vital work is relatively unseen and Dan has been doing that well.
