Match Day Thread Watford FC v Sunderland AFC - Saturday 28th September 2024 - KO 15:00

If both were fit i'd start Isidor against Derby and Mayenda against Leeds. A mix of the two would be a really good forward.

 

Defensive stats were tho, 50% defensive duels won, 7 ball recoveries and 4 interceptions

That's what I mean by stats can be easily used, plus that doesn't include the blocking of passing lanes, organising the midfielders around him etc which he did last week

No issues with folk using eye test n making comments on what they see, just really wary about using stats for arguments (both for n against btw)

 

Just not true. I think he splits opinion massively in our fanbase because some think he’s the next Henderson and others think he’s nowhere near that level. Whereas most other players bar O’nien I think everyone has a similar opinion of their ability. Nobody splits it like those two, which is probably why you feel they’re getting targeted. If he was French I could say he’s a waste of space and people wouldn’t bat an eyelid but because he’s from Jarra people take it as personal dig at them.

 

Those stats are just average though. Not amazing. Then you have today. Well below what's expected. For me the eye test will always win but then you have a lot of stats to show he isn't performing in the CDM.

 

Only Patto had worse passing accuracy than Neil today mate. He was shocking. You’re right about stats being interpreted to suit however you want though.

 

It didnt cost us a point though. It isnt as simple as that. It cost us a goal. Same as allowing so much space cost us a goal. I just dont see how picking out a mistake by one player, in one moment as the one that matters above all else makes any sense. Football is more complex than that imo.

Whether Neil will go and play premier league football is a good debate. I think he will. And I think it will be for a top end premier league team. In my opinion he has been at around 90% of his level this season. That is quite a drop off, as 2% is noticeable. But I see no reason to think he cant get back to his level. He isnt coming back from a bad injury. This looks like a mental thing here. We are playing differently under Regis and maybe he is learning a new way he is being asked to play. Maybe the captaincy is taking time to adjust to. Maybe something is going on away from footy. So many things we will never see. What I have seen for 3 plus years is an exceptional talent. That hasnt gone. I am happy to be patient with him personally and it isnt like we have a player kicking the door down to replace him. My money is on him being one of our best players, again, when the season is done.

 

cheers again RTB...


never expected that mind, was positive we would at least get a draw there...did not start well/watford started very well yet we still carved the chances out, cirkin well out of position for that first goal leaving plenty of space for thier lad to line a good shot up.

second half was ours from the off, or so it seemed as we pinned them back and it was just a matter of when rather than if we would score, very good first goal for wilson and another assist from roberts, watford never really got .into a position to hurt us.

thing is, neil made a complete mess of a tackle just outside the box and i thought 'pleased he did that where he did' then he goes and makes an even worse 'tackle' and gives the penalty away, no excuses whatsoever for the lad, terrible play for a CDM...i have to say i started the game watching neil as i thought he has been poor recently and he did start off ok but really just dropped out of the game the longe rit went on.

have to say wilson looked good with his runs, winning the ball upfield and linking play, so two decent options so far for the striker position, mundle and roberts keep doing good jobs on the wings but i honestly think w eneed to rotate the central three more often as (unfortunately) we looked at our best when moore came in for neil.

my MotM goes to wilson isidor for not onlt his goal but his movement, mainly in the first half.

ref watch...he was terrible, simple as that.

 

What's different this year is he is playing the deepest of all midfielders all the time. That's not when we have been raving about Dan Neil. Not ever. It's his forward play, his interchange.

No point having a CDM who is weak in the tackle and loses duels. Zero point.

 

Take the boro performance. We chose not to engage them and sat deep with two lines of 4 for long parts of the game. It worked a treat because it was a game plan they could not react to. Today we needed to control possession much more imo, and opted for a different game plan. I think we have players who want the football. They have shown they can play the game without it, but when you have players like Roberts, Rigg, Neil, Mundle, Jobe you need to be looking at keeping the ball more. I would be surprised if we dont dominate against Derby, and a bit worried if that is not our setup.

 

Couldn’t agree more. I think the captaincy is a huge thing then being asked to play, in my opinion, the hardest position on the pitch in a totally different system and style is a lot. But if he can’t get to grips with it then we need to change it we shouldn’t be carrying passengers this season I think we’d all agree we have a real chance this season and need the best players for the job regardless of reputation.

On the penalty, it wasn’t just a mistake from him it was THAT mistake. He was giving the ball away all afternoon and putting us under pressure but that penalty is what’s given them the 3 points at the end of the day. That’s how football resulted are often seen when one big mistake results in a goal

 

Rotating could be a good thing tbf, still got Connolly to come in. One thing with Isidor that I like about him is his height and in the box movement to me and his channel runs. I really think he looked very threatening.

Mayenda’s pressing is great though but maybe it was just today but I felt like Isidor would score from the few chances he had and the runs he made

 

Yep, which is why I would start him in games we should dominate, like Tuesday for example. Can't have him playing like he did out of possession against Leeds though.

 

He’s struggling this season but it’s most likely just form. Perhaps the armband is weighing heavily too. Little bit of a tweak for him positionally this season but he’s been the deeper player in a double pivot for over 18 months now - apart from the Mowbray brain fart when he swapped in Ekwah last season - and he thrived when we went to the playoffs, so it’s not completely alien to him. Just needs to calm down and rediscover his form. The armband is a bit of an issue though. Don’t really like us naming a team captain as it makes them somewhat unstoppable. It may become necessary for Neil to have a bit of time out.

 

Was that not a case of our whole team sitting back? Didn’t see Rigg pressing as much as he used to either

 

Big fan of RLB saying

"Away from home, you have to be strong in the duels, and some were not today".

 

Agreeing today was a poor performance. A 5 out of 10 performance. I am just not ready to bench him because I know how much he can bring to this side. If Samed shows up as better then fair play, get him in. We dont know that yet though imo and I will wait to see how he settles and shows up. Hopefully he puts Neil under pressure for his position, maybe it pushes Neil on a level. For two years nobody has been good enough to threaten his place in the side. Now he has Rigg and Jobe getting the headlines. Maybe Samed will push him hard as well. Could be perfect for all. Hope so mate.

 

I'm going to take the blame for today's result lads, been 2 live scouting twice this season n both times we've lost!!

Not live scouting nxt week so hopefully means 6 points

 

It's his positioning. He didn't block a passing lane once. The central centre back and the right centre back found it so easy to pick out the right wing back or one of the midfielders. They didn't get as much joy doing it down their left side as Rigg knew where to be. Hopefully it will come in time the more he plays in the system as his movement was a real positive but if we are going to concede possession in most games all 10 outfield players need to be bang on it positionally. Any gap will be exploited against good sides, we got lucky today that Watford weren't 3 ahead at the break.

 

Fair play for coming out and owning it. Needs to improve though, Samed hasn't came to warm the bench.

 

I wonder if that’s the trade off maybe, right now his pressing off the ball isn’t as great as Mayenda but he’s offering more threatening runs and much better movement in the box.

that’s the one thing Mayenda lacks for me as of right now is his movement in the box but he will soon pick it up from watching Isidor and Connolly