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Match Day Thread Norwich v Watford

Discussion in 'Norwich City' started by SuffolkCanary, Sep 20, 2024 at 3:11 PM.

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What will the result be

  1. Norwich win

    4 vote(s)
    80.0%
  2. Draw

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Watford win

    1 vote(s)
    20.0%
  1. SuffolkCanary

    SuffolkCanary Well-Known Member

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    Yeah fair he could play a bit but not as calm on the ball or quick enough with some of his passing as Cordoba and Doyle.

    Doyles role looked a bit like a left foot TAA today
     
    #61
  2. Puncturedtractortyre

    Puncturedtractortyre Well-Known Member

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    Historically, we've always struggled against Watford - on the whole a physical, some would say a dirty team. This one feels particularly satisfying
     
    #62
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  3. Golden Eadie 2

    Golden Eadie 2 Well-Known Member

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    Last season 4-2, this season, 4-1. We had 19 attempts at goal, surely the most for several seasons, well maybe the beginning of Wagner's tenure.
     
    #63
  4. DUNCAN DONUTS

    DUNCAN DONUTS SOCIAL JUSTICE WARRIOR

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    They usually bully us & make it a physical battle but Doyle & Cardona are real units & dealt with them easily today .
    Looks promising
     
    #64
  5. carrowcanario

    carrowcanario Well-Known Member

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    But that's not Stacey's fault it's clearly one of the teams patterns of play.
     
    #65
  6. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    That makes it sound as if Doyle was tasked with playing "the Stacey role", only on the left rather than the right. And, by implication, that Fisher at RB reprised Chrisene at LB when Stacey is playing. But that's not how Thorup had things set up today. Rather than advancing wide on the left to create a front 4 or 5, as Stacey does, Doyle joined up with McLean and Núñez in midfield, releasing Schwartau to go forward in support of the front three. Rather than staying wide, as Stacey does, Doyle was primarily stationed in the left half space, as when he scored, and later when he initiated the move leading to Núñez's goal. In that midfield role, he was much better placed from a defensive point of view, compared to Stacey, when we lost possession and Watford attacked. WhoScored's Player Positions graphic portrays the set up well.
     
    #66
  7. 1950canary

    1950canary Well-Known Member

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    The performance today was better than anything I saw under Smith or Wagner. Hopefully, onwards and upwards.
     
    #67
  8. zogean_king

    zogean_king Well-Known Member

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    Highlights here.

    Look at the third goal, McLean, Doyle and Nunez all three touched the ball once leading to the goal.
     
    #68
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  9. chinacanary

    chinacanary Well-Known Member

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    Just watched the highlights and the build up to the fourth goal was sublime. Very promising signs.
     
    #69
  10. Golden Eadie 2

    Golden Eadie 2 Well-Known Member

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    I counted nineteen passes, including the final one by Stacy which was a pass, not a cross. He looked up, saw Chrisene and passed to him. I can't believe that there are still fans who do not rate Kenny, he was immense in that match. Along with pocket bulldog Nunez. It's all beginning to come together, what will we be like by the time they learn each other's names? And Fisher has progressed a lot and worthy of his starting position. The corner that led to that miss by Watford was not a corner, Fisher made the tackle and the ball came back off a Watford player. That back line looks set to be first choice now as Cordoba was also outstanding, and I have no need to mention Doyle. You know we played well when at least five players could be considered mom.
     
    #70
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  11. zogean_king

    zogean_king Well-Known Member

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    I agree with the non corner, though the defending was a bit all over the place once it was a corner
     
    #71
  12. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    I've been a long time critic of Kenny, but my only criticisms this season have been about the time it takes him to get up to speed in games. He regularly gives the ball away in dangerous positions in the first ten or so minutes of matches, the cock-up with Stacey against Swansea being a prime example. But once he gets himself together, it's a different story. The reason I'm full of praise for Kenny this season, is not that the scales have been lifted from my eyes, but because, under Thorup, Kenny has become a different player; he's stopped trying to be the player I've always been critical of, and been given a role that suits his strengths and minimises his weaknesses. Thorup spoke about exactly this in his post-match interview on Saturday, when Paddy Davitt asked for his assessment of Kenny's performance against Watford (2 assists and a key pass). To quote (my italics):
    "He's the heart of the team and we have these players where they have to understand that it's not for them to decide the game and score the goals, but they are the reason why we can score the goals; and I think it's so important for them to have that understanding, they really have to create the balance, the shape of the team, create that flow, that rhythm. Definitely he's getting there."
    This is also why, if you look back at my posts about Kenny during Wagner's tenure, you will find me lauding his performances when Wagner had him playing LB or LCB. Those roles put the same reins on him as his midfield role under Thorup. If you are playing LB or LCB, you can't even pretend you're playing as the 10!
     
    #72
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  13. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    Just to add to the above, the reason I think Thorup ends with "Definitely he's getting there" -- implying Kenny is still a bit short of what Thorup wants from him -- maybe what he's referring to is Kenny's tendency on occasion to slow things down and break the flow of the game (a hangover from Wagner days?). Given that Kenny is team captain and a big influence on the field, perhaps Thorup thinks he is partly responsible for those spells in games where the team appear to revert to the Wagnerian mind set of "we have the lead, let's focus on keeping it", rather than Thorup's "we have the lead, let's focus on extending it".
     
    #73
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  14. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member
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    Just to focus on this, it's an interesting change, much more in line with how Pep has used full backs at Man City lately (Rico Lewis for example). Which does beg the question of whether this was the planned role for Doyle all along and part of the reason Man City were prepared to loan him to us.

    Has that only been made possible since the Schwartau/Slimane signings, as I'm not sure who else in our squad is comfortable on the left of a midfield 3, and in a more advanced role?
     
    #74
  15. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    That's quite possible, given that the main reason we've seen Doyle previously deployed at LCB has been to give Córdoba time to up his fitness levels. On the other hand, the set up on Saturday could be understood just as a response to the way Watford play, with a back 3 and midfield 5. By having Doyle play that inverted role, the numbers became more even in midfield, where we might otherwise have been overpowered.
    This also relates to Kellen Fisher at RB. Thorup clearly wanted a more "combinatory" player than Stacey in there, and when Fisher was able to advance into that inverted FB position on the right, it freed Núñez to get forward a bit more, much like Schwartau on the other side. (Again, the Player Positions graphic on WhoScored nicely illustrates how it all worked out on the field.)

    As for who is comfortable on the left of a midfield 3, the obvious answer surely is McLean? When Slimane is fully ready, wouldn't we expect him to be in the centre of the three, with McLean and Núñez either side?
     
    #75

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