1. Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

(OT) Is Suicide Cowardly?

Discussion in 'Newcastle United' started by Bullshit Man, Nov 28, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Bullshit Man

    Bullshit Man Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    11
    I was talking to one of my colleagues over lunch today about the tragic loss of Gary Speed, and he was saying committing suicide was a cowardly act. Which in a way I can see where he is coming from (leaving his wife/kids behind) and I have heard a few other people say it as well. Just wondering what everyone's thoughts on it are. Personally I don't think its selfish, however I can think of very few situations which would make me depressed enough to think about it. Don't mean to come across insensitive or anything and apologies if i do!
     
    #1
  2. 5 Goals 1 Hat Trick 11 Heroes-NUFC4LIFE

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    9,848
    Likes Received:
    58
    Probably a bit too early for this kind of thread.
     
    #2
  3. Cal.

    Cal. Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,182
    Likes Received:
    1
    If used as an escape, it can possibly be. But there are so many possibly extenuating circumstances and motives that drive people to suicide that it's impossible to give a blanket yes/no answer.
     
    #3
  4. P.T.N

    P.T.N Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2011
    Messages:
    3,562
    Likes Received:
    3
    This <ok>

    Not trying to knock the OP or anything. Is just a wee bit too early. Welcome to the boards btw!
     
    #4
  5. 1905

    1905 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2011
    Messages:
    102
    Likes Received:
    0
    Agree ^

    Although, it hasn't been confirmed he did kill himself yet. If you see on many sources it says words like 'apparently'. Even so, you don't know what's happened in his life to say it's a cowardly act.
     
    #5
  6. Mr Wonderful

    Mr Wonderful Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2011
    Messages:
    1,739
    Likes Received:
    6
    Cowardly? No, I wouldn't have the balls to randomly kill myself... I'd kill some other tosser though.
     
    #6
  7. in carr we trust

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2011
    Messages:
    814
    Likes Received:
    0
    it's not the right thing to do but i wouldn't call it cowardly as sometime that's the only escape that the person thinks they can do.
     
    #7
  8. Blacker-than-Knight

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    2,489
    Likes Received:
    919
    I would say tragic, calling it cowardlly is lacking in compassion as this is the final option for people who are in a very dark place and are not in the right frame of mind to deal with the situation they are in, each case is different as well as I have come to the brink myself.
     
    #8
  9. Jesus Was A Geordie

    Jesus Was A Geordie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,944
    Likes Received:
    145
    <canofworms>

    I've personally been closely involved in this kind of situation and what I found is generally suicide isn't so much an attempt to end it as a cry for help - a way of saying "this is how serious my problem is".

    The fact that Speed had given no indication that he was suffering and did in fact go through with it suggests that it wasn't so much a cry for help, the fact that he knew it would be his wife or children who found him is very disconcerting.

    In answer to your question. I think often suicide is often the easiest answer to a desperate person's question. The fact that it is usually people who have trouble sharing their feelings, or believe that they're the only ones with that problem (and can therefore find no form of help) is in itself a selfish view. But the word has connotations of spitefulness and not caring for others and I don't think thats fair!
     
    #9
  10. Rubadub

    Rubadub Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    43
    Who is somebody that is not in the situation to judge if it's cowardly or not, depression is a serious hidden illness.
     
    #10

  11. Ameobi's Apprentice

    Ameobi's Apprentice Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,095
    Likes Received:
    3
    Taking your own life is not cowardly. Somebody coming to a decision that their only way of peace is to commit suicide, is a strong commitment to make. You've came to the decision of no longer wanting to breathe and exist anymore, if that's cowardly, then the worlds gone mad.
     
    #11
  12. nufc4life

    nufc4life Guest

    i seriously think they is more to this than meets the eye ,possibly a woman involved or he could of had cancer and kept it to himself ? time will tell i dont thinks its cowardly as he thought it was the only way out and taking his life must of been thought over for a while ,rip fella
     
    #12
  13. Jesus Was A Geordie

    Jesus Was A Geordie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,944
    Likes Received:
    145
    Its not always the case though. Only 1/20 suicide attempts are successful which suggest they've not come to the conclusion that they want to stop breathing, more so that they want people to take their depressions seriously.

    I'm not being insensitive. But in commiting suicide you leave behind friends and family who may very well blame themselves for your death. This not only ends one life but ruins many more.
     
    #13
  14. StoneyNUFC

    StoneyNUFC Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    Probably a dificult time to discuss the morality of this issue, but I'll bite.

    For someone sound of mind it should definately be considered a selfish, immoral act. However, who can really be considered sound of mind when taking that option, even if only temporarily?

    This whole thing is a tragic affair and I would like to re-state my sympathies for his family before I continue. The pain they must be feeling is beyond my capacity to comprehend.

    I would also like to state that I am now going on to discuss the issue at hand, with a general outlook which should in no way be considered related to his case in particular or any other recent events.

    I think most people have considered this course of action at some stage in their life, even if not seriously. In such cases, I feel that many may have used the same argument (of selfishness) in their decision to continue as they are, or find another way around their issues. Perhaps this is why your friend feels comfortable stating this as fact? I know I have done in the past for the same reasons.

    Unfortunately, people who are suffering from severe depression do not always tend to reason logically. Perhaps feeling that their existance is only a hinderance to those who care, or having a misguided view about how devastating their loss would truly be, among a possible multitude of other reasons.

    It is always terrible when something like that happens. I think the key thing is that they let someone know, who is of sound mind who can reassure them.

    So to round off, I would suggest that while your friend is right in my opinion, such matters cannot be judged in such an idealistic/fundamentalist way as they are usually infinately more complicated than anyone other than the person in question is likely to understand.

    EDIT - I do take it cowardly was intended to imply selfish? Cowardly in itself would be the wrong term. I had accepted that it was just poorly (no offence) put forward
     
    #14
  15. Jesus Was A Geordie

    Jesus Was A Geordie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,944
    Likes Received:
    145
    This!
     
    #15
  16. Bullshit Man

    Bullshit Man Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    11
    I know its only happened at the weekend and wasn't just meaning in the Gary Speed case but sorry for posting so soon after. I had an uncle kill himself and I don't consider it cowardly when I saw how he was beforehand. Changed into a completely different person beforehand. A coward couldn't commit to something with such consequences in my opinion
     
    #16
  17. Ameobi's Apprentice

    Ameobi's Apprentice Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,095
    Likes Received:
    3
    I agree, some are a cry for help, but some, like Gary, is the only way to stop the depression ( The reasons why are still unknown ). It's not a cowardly act but can be seen as a selfish act, but if you're not happy in your life, then i guess there isn't any point in living it. Would be a terrible situation to be in.
     
    #17
  18. Bullshit Man

    Bullshit Man Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    11
    No offence you right! (boss was in the room as typing) selfish was a better way to describe what I meant!
     
    #18
  19. Lucaaas

    Lucaaas Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    14,768
    Likes Received:
    3,980
    Do you think he was thinking rationally at the time though? What he was probably thinking was that he was going to die in the comfort of his own home, he wanted to die in a peaceful place where he had previously been happy.

    People have also got to remember that depression is a disease, just like cancer. You have to work your way out of it, by sharing your emotions and how you feel with somebody else. And Gary Speed was very much of the generation of men that had it drilled into them that sharing their feelings or showing any type of weakness was "gay" and not something a real man does. That can't have been easy for him.
     
    #19
  20. P.T.N

    P.T.N Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2011
    Messages:
    3,562
    Likes Received:
    3
    I don't think suicide is cowardly at all. Like people have said, with depression you dont think logically at all. Whatever happened in Gary's personal life, is a mystery to us all. So we cant speculate. But, it must have been awful to have made Gary resort to something so tragic
     
    #20
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page